(Topic ID: 172723)

Homepin OFFICIAL Thread - Pinball Parts & Machine Progress


By Homepin

2 years ago



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#2151 1 year ago
Quoted from Homepin:

these machines will ship off all over the world to be tested in various places

I'd be glad to test one for ya! (PM for address)

#2152 1 year ago

design questions:
Why does this return on the right just crash into the left return at this tight angle?
Wouldn't it make more sense to flow into it? Or maybe cross over and feed back to the left flipper?

wire (resized).png

#2153 1 year ago
Quoted from MarkInc:

design questions:
Why does this return on the right just crash into the left return at this tight angle?
Wouldn't it make more sense to flow into it? Or maybe cross over and feed back to the left flipper?

Just going from memory that's where the balls lock for multiball.

#2154 1 year ago
Quoted from Toads:

Just going from memory that's where the balls lock for multiball.

That’s correct. They just roll down the ramp and roll down. Works fine.

Good to see Mikes improvements as per above. Him sending it to NZ was worthwhile.

rd

#2155 1 year ago

I had the opportunity to play the machine and talk to Mike during pincade. Mike seems a nice guy who is enthusiastic about his machine. Mechanically the game it looks well made. Lots of things - maybe to much - on the playfield.

The main controller is in the backbox, with some smaller pcb's spread on the back of the playfield.
On the control board is a removable daughterboard. This is needs to be replaced for software updates! No internet downloaded software updates, but actually sending a piece of hardware around the world. Strange.

The main game logic is controlled by a PIC processor, likely residing on the removable board.
The sound and video are handled by a Propeller cpu. Last time I heard about that processor was 10 years ago. In that time it was a quite interesting chip containing 8 cpu cores running at 20MHz each. Nowadays are there so much better chips available, so I was surprised to hear they selected this chip.

I don't think Mike selected a very good software company. First they copy Ben Heck design ?! Then they have problems field updating the CPU and need to resort to use a daugherboard approach. Also selecting this old propeller chip is quite strange. And finally they have real time control issues with the flipper coil timing, and Mike has to add extra board to fix this.

But I enjoyed playing the machine, and that is what counts!

#2156 1 year ago

Parallax fully open sourced both the Propeller hardware and Spin software and PGL.

There are probably very cheap OEM versions available in China ... and it's more than powerful enough for a DMD game.

Still, bit of a relic. I think most would have expected ARM or possibly MIPS as it's Chinese.

Regardless of the Heck question, it does seem very strange they were unable or unwilling to add the capability to update the firmware in situ.

That aside, biggest question about the hardware IMO is whether the video output and way the machine talks to the DMD are fairly standard. If so, adding a colour LED DMD should be relatively easy. If not, then probably orange forever.

#2157 1 year ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

If so, adding a colour LED DMD should be relatively easy. If not, then probably orange forever.

Oh, what? Yall want a color display? You dont say.....

11
#2158 1 year ago

TAG uses a standard DMD input stream. One of our DMDs would plug into a WMS machine with no modification.

Our DMD's are manufactured on an SMD line so all the LEDs are separate and perfectly aligned - no wonky gaps between the LED blocks. This also makes the DMD easily repairable should an LED fail.

Right from day one, all those years ago, I made it crystal clear that I was NOT trying to re-invent the wheel and that I intended to create a "WMS, DMD style machine". This is exactly what I have done. People can complain and bitch all they like that it doesn't have this, that or something else. I have built a solid machine at a very competitive price that I believe will be reliable.

If people don't like what we are making they are free to pay many thousands more to get what they desire, I'm not preventing them from doing so BUT remember - all these things such as USB updates, colour screens etc etc COST MONEY!!!! Not for the items but for the HUGE background development - we don't have that expertise or budget. Homepin is a tiny factory with 20 staff - that's it.

If someone wants to add colour or twin overhead foxtails to TAG please knock yourselves out!

We are providing a quality machine at a sensible price. We are NOT going down the exact same road as some others and selling at a price to cover the "nice extras".

I believe there is room in this world for all players not just high end LCD screen users. Actually, we could use LCD screens as they are about 25% the cost of our DMD but the background needed to drive them is a LOT more than most here would understand not only electronically but content as well. We are not ready for that.

11
#2159 1 year ago

PinballSTAR is proud to announce we have been appointed US distributors for Homepin Pinball and their first game : THUNDERBIRDS !

Games are now in production and shipping soon ! Great price point too at only $ 4,999 !!!

Interested ? Email Joe at Sales@PinballSTAR.com.

Welcome Homepin to the growing PinballSTAR lineup :
* Jersey Jack Pinball
* Chicago Gaming
* Spooky Pinball
* American Pinball
* Homepin
* VP Cabs

#2160 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballSTAR:

Great price point too at only $ 4,999

#2161 1 year ago

since you have china connections how about getting wpc 95 AV boards made and attack from mars strobe boards?
lots of demand for those items

#2162 1 year ago

USB DFU can be added to most usb enabled PIC chips i assume this is a pic32? Basically just need a USB connector and 2 resistors but would need some special firmware / boot loader to enable the DFU via USB. But hardware wise its as easy as just adding the above mentioned parts. But i appreciated quite a bit of development would be needed in the software to support such a feature!(with all the correct error handling so you don't brick your game!) (maybe next revision?)

12
#2163 1 year ago
Quoted from Homepin:

If people don't like what we are making they are free to pay many thousands more to get what they desire

Be fair here, the brand new Iron maiden is only 1k more msrp. Plus, you are talking about questionable engineering choices, like unnecessarily complicated updates, not some "nice extras".

Maybe a color screen is still considered a extra perk, but I think Thunderbirds might be the only new pin shipping with a mono DMD? The pinball landscape has changed in the 5 or 6 years since you started the game.

I do understand that it costs money, skill, and time to do that stuff, so maybe you are against a rock and a hard place, but don't pretend a 5k MSRP is some kind of amazing savings that justifies that stuff, especially when Ben Heck covered a chunk of your initial R&D.

Just my 2 cents.

#2164 1 year ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Be fair here, the brand new Iron maiden is only 1k more msrp. Plus, you are talking about questionable engineering choices, like unnecessarily complicated updates, not some "nice extras".
Maybe a color screen is still considered a extra perk, but I think Thunderbirds might be the only new pin shipping with a mono DMD? The pinball landscape has changed in the 5 or 6 years since you started the game.
I do understand that it costs money, skill, and time to do that stuff, so maybe you are against a rock and a hard place, but don't pretend a 5k MSRP is some kind of amazing savings that justifies that stuff, especially when Ben Heck covered a chunk of your initial R&D.
Just my 2 cents.

Some one will color it and it will be epic.

That orange blob just doesnt jive with the rest of the beautifully colored machine art. Thats right, im not even a TB fan and I like this machine a lot. Im not even trying to shit on you sir, I want you to succeed. I just think a color display would have made this whole machine completely pop.

-2
#2165 1 year ago
Quoted from Homepin:

TAG uses a standard DMD input stream. One of our DMDs would plug into a WMS machine with no modification.

That's good news.

Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Be fair here, the brand new Iron maiden is only 1k more msrp. Plus, you are talking about questionable engineering choices, like unnecessarily complicated updates, not some "nice extras".
Maybe a color screen is still considered a extra perk, but I think Thunderbirds might be the only new pin shipping with a mono DMD? The pinball landscape has changed in the 5 or 6 years since you started the game.
I do understand that it costs money, skill, and time to do that stuff, so maybe you are against a rock and a hard place, but don't pretend a 5k MSRP is some kind of amazing savings that justifies that stuff, especially when Ben Heck covered a chunk of your initial R&D.
Just my 2 cents.

Huge economies of scale though, and Stern's cabinets are total crap and quite probably cheaper than what's being used in TAG, despite the latter being MiC.

#2166 1 year ago

I think it's fine that the game comes with a mono DMD. If the demand is there somebody can come up with an aftermarket colorization solution (ColorDMD, Pin2DMD, etc.)

The lack of easy updates sort of turns me off but it's not a deal breaker. I feel that would stifle software updates and improvements, because when you come out with an update it would be a major process to get it implemented on released machines. This may encourage a lack of software updates to avoid the hassle.

#2167 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballSTAR:

PinballSTAR is proud to announce we have been appointed US distributors for Homepin Pinball and their first game : THUNDERBIRDS !
Games are now in production and shipping soon ! Great price point too at only $ 4,999 !!!
Interested ? Email Joe at Sales@PinballSTAR.com.
Welcome Homepin to the growing PinballSTAR lineup :
* Jersey Jack Pinball
* Chicago Gaming
* Spooky Pinball
* American Pinball
* Homepin
* VP Cabs

Is there any chance you will have a machine at the Allentown show?

#2168 1 year ago
Quoted from Chitownpinball:

Some one will color it and it will be epic.
That orange blob just doesnt jive with the rest of the beautifully colored machine art. Thats right, im not even a TB fan and I like this machine a lot. Im not even trying to shit on you sir, I want you to succeed. I just think a color display would have made this whole machine completely pop.

i know nothing of how to colorize a DMD, but would you need to access the conten5s of the game ROM?
which seems dificult with this machine

#2169 1 year ago
Quoted from PopBumperPete:

i know nothing of how to colorize a DMD, but would you need to access the conten5s of the game ROM?
which seems dificult with this machine

This is the future man, some one will figure it out.

#2170 1 year ago
Quoted from PopBumperPete:

i know nothing of how to colorize a DMD, but would you need to access the conten5s of the game ROM?
which seems dificult with this machine

Nope, shouldn't be an issue if someone wants to colorize it. The display data would be intercepted via the ribbon cable and then modified before being displayed on the color screen. No direct reading of game ROMs.

#2171 1 year ago
Quoted from ultimategameroom:

Is there any chance you will have a machine at the Allentown show?

Working on it... : )

#2172 1 year ago

I can’t help but to think that the longer this machine takes to come out, the more irrelevant it may become?!? Looking at IMDN and even Alice Cooper as the 2 most recent releases, these games playfield artwork, cab artwork, design and shot flow are amazing!! Especially in some recent Stern games.

TAG in comparasion looks old, monochromatic and not a very exciting shot selection. Like you said, trying to reproduce a WMS style machine has worked and you’ve got it on the head....the problem is is everyone else is moving with the times, and as such left TAG or Homepin behind.

#2173 1 year ago
Quoted from jardine:

I can’t help but to think that the longer this machine takes to come out, the more irrelevant it may become?!? Looking at IMDN and even Alice Cooper as the 2 most recent releases, these games playfield artwork, cab artwork, design and shot flow are amazing!! Especially in some recent Stern games.
TAG in comparasion looks old, monochromatic and not a very exciting shot selection. Like you said, trying to reproduce a WMS style machine has worked and you’ve got it on the head....the problem is is everyone else is moving with the times, and as such left TAG or Homepin behind.

Irrelevant...hardly. There will always be a market WMS style machines.

#2174 1 year ago
Quoted from jardine:

I can’t help but to think that the longer this machine takes to come out, the more irrelevant it may become?!? Looking at IMDN and even Alice Cooper as the 2 most recent releases, these games playfield artwork, cab artwork, design and shot flow are amazing!! Especially in some recent Stern games.
TAG in comparasion looks old, monochromatic and not a very exciting shot selection. Like you said, trying to reproduce a WMS style machine has worked and you’ve got it on the head....the problem is is everyone else is moving with the times, and as such left TAG or Homepin behind.

The recently announced UK distributor will be selling TAG for £1700 ($2400) less than an Iron Maiden Pro. I'd expect the price delta to be a little lower in mainland Europe. Dunno what it will be in Australia / NZ ... probably similar?

Agreed the price difference is quite small in the US (~$600), and not in TAG's favour.

However, *IF* the game is good, there's certainly a market for it in Europe, purely based on price.

#2175 1 year ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

The recently announced UK distributor will be selling TAG for £1700 ($2400) less than an Iron Maiden Pro. I'd expect the price delta to be a little lower in mainland Europe. Dunno what it will be in Australia / NZ ... probably similar?
Agreed the price difference is quite small in the US (~$600), and not in TAG's favour.
However, *IF* the game is good, there's certainly a market for it in Europe, purely based on price.

£1700? That surely can’t be right?

That’d be approx $3400 NZD. No way it’d be that cheap here. More along the lines of $8000NZD I would’ve thought. But I don’t know what it is.

£1709 is well cheap though if that’s what it is

#2176 1 year ago
Quoted from rooky79:

£1700? That surely can’t be right?

He said 1700 LESS than Iron Maiden Pro. 1700 is not the price.

#2177 1 year ago

In Australia Thunderbirds retails for $7k compared to Stern pro’s at about $8350. Keith’s game (art, programming, game design up dating etc) compared to this probably puts stern games at a much better value.

At Punfedt a few years ago the colour dmd was being promoted so it was on the cards but dropped I think with the programmer passing.

#2178 1 year ago
Quoted from ronaldvg:

He said 1700 LESS than Iron Maiden Pro. 1700 is not the price.

Oops. Oh yeah. Durrrrr

Should read a bit more closely.

I thought that seemed super cheap ha ha ha ha

#2179 1 year ago

I don’t think Mike is going for the players market.

If you compare Thunderbirds gameplay to say TWD, you’re going to be pretty disappointed. It isn’t that.

However ... if you are trying to introduce pinball to a country of 1.5 BILLLLLLION people, 1.49999B of whom have never seen a pinball machine before, then a more simple ruleset is the way to go.

That’s the big picture here ... selling this game to the chinese - as well as the western market.

I talked with Mike about retheming this layout for the Chinese market. Maybe a chinese pop star or something relevant that their market. The actual machine is solid, and well built - the theme can be anything, just draw up some new artwork.

rd

#2180 1 year ago

rotordave or anyone who played TAG in NZ,.. did the machine have the shaker motor running? I played the demo version at the Pinball Warehouse presentation in Brisbane,.. but I don’t recall if it was active or installed on that pin. I have an AFMr LE and that shaker just makes the game talk back to you and become just that little bit more interactive. Interested to know if similar experience with the TAG you all got to play.

#2181 1 year ago
Quoted from jardine:

I can’t help but to think that the longer this machine takes to come out, the more irrelevant it may become?!? Looking at IMDN and even Alice Cooper as the 2 most recent releases

So are you saying if you release a 40 year old theme without much pre-announcement it becomes more relevant?

Quoted from rotordave:

That’s the big picture here ... selling this game to the chinese - as well as the western market.

Where I live, that is called killing two birds with one stone.

#2182 1 year ago
Quoted from rotordave:

Inside the cabinet ....
rd

is that for real?
that is tidy AF

#2183 1 year ago
Quoted from grimnim:

is that for real?
that is tidy AF

For a 1970s EM.

Hopefully you picked up on the joke.

rd

#2184 1 year ago

Is there a breakdown of the rules, modes and general code anywhere?

#2185 1 year ago
Quoted from rotordave:

For a 1970s EM.
Hopefully you picked up on the joke.
rd

nope, too new to pinball.
that is some nice cable porn tho lol

#2186 1 year ago

Check out the service manual for TAG. This from Facebook:

“We have been putting together the service manual for quite a while now. This is a sample we will take to the show next week but it is far from finished. When we are happy with the manual we will have them full colour printed and bound. The diagrams and schematics are on A3 folded pages.”

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#2187 1 year ago

Brains with the spanner is a classic.

rd

#2188 1 year ago
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Maybe a color screen is still considered a extra perk, but I think Thunderbirds might be the only new pin shipping with a mono DMD? The pinball landscape has changed in the 5 or 6 years since you started the game.

Maybe so. But My TWD premium has a mono dmd and is way better than any pin with an LCD color screen that has come out. It really comes down to the layout and rules. There are a bunch of dmd games out there that I would buy before even considering the newer LCD color monitor pins. They have been pretty disappointing so far.

#2189 1 year ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

Maybe so. But My TWD premium has a mono dmd and is way better than any pin with an LCD color screen that has come out. It really comes down to the layout and rules. There are a bunch of dmd games out there that I would buy before even considering the newer LCD color monitor pins. They have been pretty disappointing so far.

Color DMD on TWD absolutely makes it pop. Do it.

#2190 1 year ago

I thought mike said he was never selling it to the USA?

#2191 1 year ago

Sample machine
Sample manual
Did you sell your pre order popbumperpete or have you changed your mind?
when will this saga end up with a FINISHED product?

looks like it is getting closer though
My distributor is getting a SAMPLE machine so look for ward to thrashing it WHEN it is ready.
Damn creepy marionettes

#2192 1 year ago
Quoted from tacshose:

I thought mike said he was never selling it to the USA?

I'm pretty sure it was always his intention to sell to the US. It is just that the US was not his target market for TAG.

The next one, well that might be a different story depending which way he goes with the theme. Mike could decide to try a machine targeted to the Chinese market. Alternatively, he could go an unlicensed theme suitable for all markets.

Just throwing it out there, and I know it's not pinball, but I would love to see him build a consumer version of Ice Cold Beer, or a variation of that style game. He has the ability to manufacture something like that if he chose to do so, and that would be fantastic, IMO.

#2193 1 year ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

but I would love to see him build a consumer version of Ice Cold Beer,

I like that opinion! just no marionettes

#2194 1 year ago

The price makes no sense. This needs to be 4k to compete.

#2195 1 year ago
Quoted from PinSinner:

Irrelevant...hardly. There will always be a market WMS style machines.

I love Williams games and there may indeed always be a market for them, but Thunderbirds would be a poor example of a Williams game. The DMD graphics look choppy and clunky, the game play looks slow, the toys are meh. In terms of what you get for the money, Thunderbirds is more in line with an older Gottlieb game if you ask me. There's nothing wrong with that, I own 2 Gottliebs and like playing them, but I paid less than two grand for them not nearly $5G.

#2196 1 year ago
Quoted from kvan99:

The price makes no sense. This needs to be 4k to compete.

Or less

This product could have completed 15 years ago per specs, now it can only compete per price. 4000 sounds ok if that is shipped to doors.

-3
#2197 1 year ago
Quoted from DerGoetz:

Or less
This product could have completed 15 years ago per specs, now it can only compete per price. 4000 sounds ok if that is shipped to doors.

I disagree. If you're purely talking BOM, looks to me like Thunderbirds has more in it than any of the pre Iron Maiden Stern Pros or pre Alice Cooper Spooky's.

The orange DMD is a minus, but the EL back box sides are cool.

What does TNA have in it at $6K?

Game play and aesthetics are subjective.

12
#2198 1 year ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

What does TNA have in it at $6K?

Large LCD
Extra Score Displays
Extra LED displays
Extra sound system
Laser Cut Armor
Drop Targets and spinners
3 Flippers

TNA is a no compromise build - that's why its not cheap even tho it has only a single level PF.

#2199 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

TNA is a no compromise build - that's why its not cheap even tho it has only a single level PF.

Agreed. Plus it's truly a sight to behold and play.

I don't see how a couple cheap plastic ramps can add that much value to any machine.

#2200 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

Agreed. Plus it's truly a sight to behold and play.

Well, it can get very repetitive though. Imagine if it did have ramps or upper pf.

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