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(Topic ID: 272125)

Mirco Playfields - WARNING for potential buyers & collective complaint to PPS


By Sprudeldudel

3 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 113 posts
  • 64 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 days ago by Gorgonzola
  • Topic is favorited by 20 Pinsiders

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There are 113 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
15
#1 3 months ago

Guys,

I have thought about whther or not to post this for a while, but I have come tothe conclusion that it is absolutely neccessary.

Recently purchased a reproduction PF from MircoPlayfields and have had the worst experience with it. The quality of the product iscomplete crap - print and holes are massively misalignedand. I am stuck with it.

In response to my complaint Mirco had these things to state:
1. You are the first of hundreds of customers complaining about this (discreditation)
2. All my playfields are like this and even the originals are not better (i believe most of them are, which sucks for him. but not all - straight lie)
3. Read the Terms of service - Return shipping is to be paid by you
4. Make sure there is no damage whatsoever (There wasn't, and adequate shipping insurance, which is VERY recommended based on statement 3 is very expensive, making the return shipment unreasonable altogether)

Mirco would have had several ways to rectify the situation: He could have offered an exchange or a discount. That better PF exist in his stock you can see in several of the restoration threads and even by the photo he has in his shop. He could have sent me a return label from his large volume deal with his logitics partner - I would have even paid for it.

What he did was discredit my complaint with statement 1., lie to me in statement 2, and act rigid and absolutely unhelpfulby statement 3. even, where it would have not cost him a cent, and even make an implicit threat in statement 4.

I now have a playfield with is shit (luckily mainly where it will be covered by the ramps etc.), but is still better than none. I am still open to any suggestion from his side to improve the situation, but not expecting. Until then enjoy the pictures and be warned.

My recommendation is to
1. avoid him and his products altogether
2. If NEED BE only order his stuff through retailers who have leverage on him.
IMG_20200201_193639 (resized).jpgIMG_20200201_193645 (resized).jpgIMG_20200201_193649 (resized).jpgIMG_20200201_193715 (resized).jpgIMG_20200201_194225 (resized).jpg

#2 3 months ago

This does look poor. Sorry for your bad experience.

#3 3 months ago
Quoted from kingfishtr:

This does look poor. Sorry for your bad experience.

I have made my peace with the playfield. I can give it a meaningful playfield-life I can also use it to show what crap the guy is selling and how badly he is acting.

BTW: I can back up all my statements from my email correspondence with him.

#4 3 months ago

When the print is of that much i would check the insert with a flashlight from the underside. Just to see how much it's bleeding around the edges.

#5 3 months ago

Could be worse, look at this blue on a cpr gold that im about to change.

20200510_202109 (resized).jpg

#6 3 months ago
Quoted from Sprudeldudel:

Guys,
I have thought about whther or not to post this for a while, but I have come tothe conclusion that it is absolutely neccessary.
Recently purchased a reproduction PF from MircoPlayfields and have had the worst experience with it. The quality of the product iscomplete crap - print and holes are massively misalignedand. I am stuck with it.
In response to my complaint Mirco had these things to state:
1. You are the first of hundreds of customers complaining about this (discreditation)
2. All my playfields are like this and even the originals are not better (i believe most of them are, which sucks for him. but not all - straight lie)
3. Read the Terms of service - Return shipping is to be paid by you
4. Make sure there is no damage whatsoever (There wasn't, and adequate shipping insurance, which is VERY recommended based on statement 3 is very expensive, making the return shipment unreasonable altogether)
Mirco would have had several ways to rectify the situation: He could have offered an exchange or a discount. That better PF exist in his stock you can see in several of the restoration threads and even by the photo he has in his shop. He could have sent me a return label from his large volume deal with his logitics partner - I would have even paid for it.
What he did was discredit my complaint with statement 1., lie to me in statement 2, and act rigid and absolutely unhelpfulby statement 3. even, where it would have not cost him a cent, and even make an implicit threat in statement 4.
I now have a playfield with is shit (luckily mainly where it will be covered by the ramps etc.), but is still better than none. I am still open to any suggestion from his side to improve the situation, but not expecting. Until then enjoy the pictures and be warned.
My recommendation is to
1. avoid him and his products altogether
2. If NEED BE only order his stuff through retailers who have leverage on him.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

I see a good silkscreen colors, a good clear coat but a really bad cut... and for sure the worst customer service. Nothing new here.

#7 3 months ago
Quoted from legendpin:

but a really bad cut...

Actualy the cut is accurate, but the print is stretched and misaligned.

#8 3 months ago

Sorry about your field.

My experience was frustrating also. I sent my original WW as the template for his new production run. Since my field was the basis, I expected no problems with the new playfield during installation.

1. Dimples were not in the correct locations
2. The alignment of the trough kickout was several millimeters mis-aligned with the shooter lane
3. One insert decal was completely missing
4. I received my replacement field months after it was promised

When contacted, The response was that all the current playfield runs are missing the insert decal, and no comment on the dimples or trough alignment.

No offer to make things right.

I now suggest to others to buy a playfield at a show where you can inspect it first.

#9 3 months ago

What a tool bag. I can’t believe he would even allow that to be sold. Hopefully this thread will be the end of his business.

It’s plywood. He should trash it.

#10 3 months ago
Quoted from holminone:

What a tool bag. I can’t believe he would even allow that to be sold. Hopefully this thread will be the end of his business.
It’s plywood. He should trash it.

Considering he still does play fields for several of the manufacturers, i doubt this will put him out of business. Sorry this happened though - I remember being irked that i had to pay extra for someone to hand-pick a good example from a batch of
His play fields (also MB). Now I'm glad I did. Between this and the clear issues, this ain't great news.

#11 3 months ago

Could a potential buyer request photos of the exact playfield he would be receiving prior to sending money? I'd want to see the exact playfield I'm buying with close up photos of all the details.

13
#12 3 months ago
Quoted from PoMC:

Could a potential buyer request photos of the exact playfield he would be receiving prior to sending money? I'd want to see the exact playfield I'm buying with close up photos of all the details.

Been there, done that. Got sent pictures of a perfect playfield, gave approval and was then sent one with defects.

Complained about misrepresentation and was told the standard line that they are normal anomalies in manufacturing.

Never buy direct from Mirco for playfields. Always through a retailer where you can get some recourse.

#13 3 months ago

If anyone has messed up playfields from this guy, feel free to post photos and share

#14 3 months ago

My CV playfield had an extra hole in a place where the ball freely travels. And I only realized this after I got it back from Kruzman for re-clearing. He was incredibly defensive about it (it is literally never his fault). I had to fashion a metal plug to make it work; thankfully the extra hole is under a plastic.

I'll vote with my wallet in the future and support other playfield manufacturers who provide better customer service.

#15 3 months ago

I've heard the guy is difficult to deal with. The whole situation is a double edged sword. Its great that someone is replicating these play fields so users can bring their games back to life. Yet on the other hand he charges a lot of money for his product, and doesn't really care about quality control or customer service. I'm not sure why he doesn't inspect these play fields and rate/price them appropriately. Bottom line in this hobby most people are fine paying top dollar for a high quality product, and are pissed when it shows up looking substandard

#16 3 months ago

CPR Playfields are no picnic either. Clear them & out the door. Even cured, lots of dimples after a month of play.

#17 3 months ago

Reported issues for years with this guy...

#18 3 months ago
Quoted from Sprudeldudel:

I can back up all my statements from my email correspondence with him.

Your pictures do the talking! The only way I give him a pass, Is if he said OOPS, Very Sorry, Lets get you a new one and a small refund for your trouble!

#19 3 months ago
Quoted from Sprudeldudel:

Actualy the cut is accurate, but the print is stretched and misaligned.

that's really the much more important part. at least then it's usable. would be infinitely worse if the cuts affected the gameplay. just on the bright-side. doesn't make it acceptable.

#20 3 months ago

Very sad;

I am sure there are weirdo perfectionists in the hobby who browbeat anything less than absolute perfection, but there is a line somewhere and it seems to get crossed too often with these reproductions.

For the Shadow Playfield, I can see being disappointed in the blue, but if I was replacing a blown out original I would be happy to have it.

For the Monster bash, if you can post picks of it being lit up from behind it would be helpful. Even though the flaws look awful when the playfield is naked "probably" things would not be noticeable if installed. Unless it is so off the lights bleed through the inserts...

I installed a "budget" misaligned playfield into my rat rod Flash Gordon rebuild and you can't tell. One color was shifted over the rest, and there were some other imperfections. When the game is populated it is not the first, second or even 10th thing a normal person would notice. But the price reflected this; for ~$300 or whatever I paid I thought what the heck! It didn't make sense to pay triple or more for a "perfect" one. And taking a step back, when you looked at the blown out playfield I started with my "imperfect" playfield was a definite upgrade.

That MB playfield could help a game out there somewhere, but yest disappointing for the price. And the customer service is just...

#21 3 months ago
Quoted from Jrotten:

CPR Playfields are no picnic either. Clear them & out the door. Even cured, lots of dimples after a month of play.

At least the guy provides a rating system....Mirco makes the assumption that everything is Gold standard and doesn't back his product when its not

#23 3 months ago

WOW. It's one thing to get a bad product, but to have the company producing the bad product just act like the shit quality is acceptable and not make the customer whole/fix the problem is another. Glad I saw this, I was looking at a EBD playfield.

#24 3 months ago
Quoted from Cobray:

Glad I saw this, I was looking at a EBD playfield.

One soul saved. This provides me with satisfaction

#25 3 months ago

Similar issue with My BK2K upper playfield with the pops not being center to the artwork. I ended up modifying my playfield to resolve it. I will see if I can dig up some pictures.

#26 3 months ago
Quoted from Cobray:

WOW. It's one thing to get a bad product, but to have the company producing the bad product just act like the shit quality is acceptable and not make the customer whole/fix the problem is another. Glad I saw this, I was looking at a EBD playfield.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/eight-ball-deluxe-playfields-july-2020-released-at-cpr

CPR just opened theirs!

#27 3 months ago
Quoted from cavalier88z24:

Could be worse, look at this blue on a cpr gold that im about to change.

Quoted from BC_Gambit:

For the Shadow Playfield, I can see being disappointed in the blue, but if I was replacing a blown out original I would be happy to have it.

I’m guessing variable color fidelity is an issue with many repro playfields, even accounting for variety in originals which may have been made by different mfrs using different inks over the game’s run. For instance, the recent CPR Sorcerer run has much darker skin tones than any original I’ve ever seen. That said, I’m very happy to have one to replace my worn original, and would be much more upset with borked registration than with a bit of creative color choice on CPRs part.

#28 3 months ago

I have stopped purchasing from them as well. My AFM clear was ridiculously (and obviously) flawed including bubbles, divots, a quarter sized valley int he clear that never got polished out, dust etc. in the clear and I ended up having to have it re cleared. Best part is they ignored every attempt to contact them about it.

#29 3 months ago

Shame...

Is it just me or did he not have these issues five years ago?

I remember he used to do good work but last few years the quality is poor and the customer services is even worse.

#30 3 months ago

That would drive me nuts! How long have you had it? If you're in Germany, can't you return it under your EU consumer guarantees since the consumer has the right to return most items or cancel a service within 14 days? https://europa.eu/youreurope/business/dealing-with-customers/consumer-contracts-guarantees/consumer-guarantees/index_en.htm#:~:text=EU%20law%20also%20stipulates%20that,you%20to%20provide%20longer%20guarantees.

Given he shipped faulty goods, that might pressure him into repairing, replacing or refunding some money? Otherwise, I would be contacting my credit card company for quality and performance issues.

#31 3 months ago
Quoted from Sprudeldudel:

If anyone has messed up playfields from this guy, feel free to post photos and share

Indiana Jones is wrong, too. The art is clearly different on willie, and I don't care how much he denies it, the black keylines show signs of autotrace in Illustrator (fatter and longer than original art). Willie looks like a vampire because most of her teeth in the middle are missing on his.

On the non-glitter playfields, the "Y" in shorty is wrong, the yellow just disappears and you can see the art underneath.

Lots of stupid stuff like this that could have been caught by the community if he had let more eyeballs on the art before he ran them.

Shorty-comparison (resized).jpgWillie-Comparison (resized).jpg
#33 3 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

On the non-glitter playfields, the "Y" in shorty is wrong, the yellow just disappears and you can see the art underneath.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Not sure that is true in all cases as the "y" is correct on mine.

952d59c9523ae4545e2785745fcf0bda9229197a (resized).jpg
#34 3 months ago

Not the first and won't be the last. I dont care if I have a game with a completely roached pf, I would never buy from this guy based on everything I've read from so many other people. Just a simple search here will yield several threads in regards to him.

#35 3 months ago

This picture is from Mirco’s pinside sale site for Whirlwind playfields. The missing insert decal is highlighted.

BCEE4BA2-69D0-4F53-A61F-1078711E531F.jpeg
#36 3 months ago
Quoted from xfassa:

Not sure that is true in all cases as the "y" is correct on mine. [quoted image]

But yours is a glitter playfield, right? This is only on non-glitter as far as I know.

#37 3 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

But yours is a glitter playfield, right? This is only on non-glitter as far as I know.

No glitter on mine. Too flashy for me.

#38 3 months ago
Quoted from xfassa:

No glitter on mine. To flashy for me.

That makes even less sense, unless he fixed it on later runs. Since these are digital prints you can't have screening errors because it's all laid down at once.

Well, at least you got Vampire Willie.

#39 3 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

That makes even less sense, unless he fixed it on later runs. Since these are digital prints you can't have screening errors because it's all laid down at once.
Well, at least you got Vampire Willie.

hmmm.... maybe he is trying to correct mistakes. Dunno. I can live with Vampire Willie. My family/ friends will never notice. I gave up chasing defect free playfields, there is no such thing. Like I said in the other thread, just glad we still have vendors making repro parts.

All that said, I do agree that playfields with major defects should be replaced.

#40 3 months ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

At least the guy provides a rating system....Mirco makes the assumption that everything is Gold standard and doesn't back his product when its not

Let me show you my "Gold" CPR ES playfield. I personally won't buy Gold again. I'd rather expect a number of defects and be pleasantly surprised vs. the alternative.

I appreciate what they do though. As the Skit-B folks might say, "Reproducing playfields is hard!"

#41 3 months ago

Check this crap out....
Original Williams.

15936448103971812942717334450261 (resized).jpg
#42 3 months ago

Oh, no. And dimples on my original CV..
Impossible. That didn't happen back then..
Prob just needs more plays to flatten out, right?
Right.

20200701_191041 (resized).jpg
#43 3 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

Indiana Jones is wrong, too. The art is clearly different on willie, and I don't care how much he denies it, the black keylines show signs of autotrace in Illustrator (fatter and longer than original art). Willie looks like a vampire because most of her teeth in the middle are missing on his.
On the non-glitter playfields, the "Y" in shorty is wrong, the yellow just disappears and you can see the art underneath.
Lots of stupid stuff like this that could have been caught by the community if he had let more eyeballs on the art before he ran them.
[quoted image][quoted image]

He turned her into a Vampire

#44 3 months ago
Quoted from Jjsmooth:

Check this crap out....
Original Williams.
[quoted image]

Damn. That’s off center.

#45 3 months ago
Quoted from Jjsmooth:

Oh, no. And dimples on my original CV..
Impossible. That didn't happen back then..
Prob just needs more plays to flatten out, right?
Right.
[quoted image]

Stop looking at it and get to getting your GC back. It’s embarrassing.

#47 3 months ago

Issues like the kind Mirco seems to be having (lack of attention to detail, missed quality checks, very poor communication) are the warning signs of a failing business. I've seen this type of thing time and time again, and usually the business doesn't last long once issues like this start.

When stuff like this happens it usually means that the business is either having financial difficulties, or that the owner has lost interest/motivation. In either case, it's bad news, especially for their customers.

#48 3 months ago
Quoted from DakotaMike:

Issues like the kind Mirco seems to be having (lack of attention to detail, missed quality checks, very poor communication) are the warning signs of a failing business. I've seen this type of thing time and time again, and usually the business doesn't last long once issues like this start.
When stuff like this happens it usually means that the business is either having financial difficulties, or that the owner has lost interest/motivation. In either case, it's bad news, especially for their customers.

I have not bought any reproduction playfield before and do not know how Mirco operates or what the lead times are but it may not be any of the reasons you mentioned and could just be that he has too much work to do and wants total control of it all and its hard for him to delegate. It sucks because we all take on way too much work sometimes that it just overwhelms you and starts effecting your work. I am guilty of it and have to learn to take a step back and focus on getter better with lower volume instead of taking way too much than I can chew. I will take on too many clients at work myself where its just becomes unreasonable and things go to shit.

#49 3 months ago

It's the best worst job you'll never have.
You can never make everyone happy so there isn't much of a point in trying, and you'll sell every PF you make no matter what.

#50 3 months ago

You can return poor playfields- EU goods
Act.. Wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if you got a lawyer involved.

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