Interesting read. I don't trust these early autopilot systems, there's going to be more problems as similar systems are rolled out. Just wait until one of these autopilot systems drives someone off the road, or the system get's hacked and it happens that way. As for a Tesla...pass.

I recently had a chance to sit in a cousins Model 3, what a cramped vehicle for around $50k. I'm feel pretty good about my recent certified preowned RAM 1500 Bighorn 4x4 purchase. It gets 20 - 22 mpg, I drive into work once a week, it's comfortable to drive, and most of all I feel safe driving it. I'll buy an electric vehicle eventually but will probably wait another 5-10 years. Almost pulled the trigger on a new 2022 Bolt EUV, sounded great until I saw how small it is in person.

Is there supposed to be a positive correlation between roominess and cost?
Don't tell that to the Porsche guys

That was me for the longest time...wanting an EV but waiting on the sidelines for one to come out I could do business with.

The Taycan was a bit of a compromise as I don't like big / 4door cars. It handles really well for what it is though.

“I’m not really sure why, but I regard it as an existential threat to my entire way of life.”

LOL

on the topic of electric vehicles, it's totally a good time to lean into train infrastructure. Look at how good it can be

For sedans, yes. Take performance packages out of the equation though. Those cause a lot of overlap.

Oh boy…

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Charging plugs are locked to the car while charging, so good luck with that.

LMAO

It’s not really that big of a deal. We were already being asked not to run appliances from 3-8pm.

All you do is set your charging schedule to non-peak times. End results are still the same.

You wake up to a car that has more range than your daily commute requires and your fuel price isn’t dependent on a global market.

The Texas power grid issues could be a separate topic for another thread. It’s a complete disaster.

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I wonder if these folks claim they fill up their cars in 3 minutes, far less time than charging an EV…

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for the last two weeks I hit Sam's club at 6AM, NO waiting at that time, and 3 minutes to fuel, adding 400 miles. Then a 30 minute drive to take my step son to his medical appointment at 7am. Note the price is about $.50 per gallon cheaper and that is why you see lines like the one pictured above.


So you could say I was "off peak hours" charging.
Remember that adding 400 miles in 3 minutes, equals 8000 miles per hour charge rate.

I paid $3.65 while ago, which is better, but still sucks. Gas should always be around $1.78. Everyone still makes a profit, and the poor do not suffer so bad.

I am glad that alternative stuff is being done, like I said I would be eager to purchase an EV zero-turn lawn mower, these days most of my money spent for gas is for the mower.

For years I have already been trying to only go to the grocery store and places like that one time a month anyway.

I hate oil companies, and their CEO's making 50 million bonuses, but at the same time I have no need at the moment for some EV car/truck, but a EV awesome zero turn mower, hell yeah!

Your choices are wimpy, wimpy wimpy or this $29k beauty. Think I’ll stick to my 72” Hustler.
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Does that 3 minutes include your travel time to/from Sam’s?

How much of that fuel did you burn to get there and then return home?

What’s the cost these days to fuel up in “3 minutes”?

Your fuel tank is never 100% full when you’re at home /s

I'll speak for Johnny, Hell No!!

ICE Off-Peak charging:

1. Wake up at 5:30am to avoid lines
2. Get dressed
3. Drive 18 minutes (10 miles) to the gas station
4. Pay $3-$5/gallon
5. Drive 18 minutes (10 miles) back home

EV Off-Peak charging:
1. Plug car in whenever (car knows when to charge)
2. Go do other things
3. Pay 12 cents/kWh (<$10)

The Sam's club was less than 1/4 Mile off the highway, my car needed gas anyway, so it was a planned stop. As I said I was taking my step son to a medical appointment, I guess you only read what you only want to read.

Never 100% full. If i filled up there and 15 miles home out of the 485 mile range is just 3% or 1/2 gallon. And 1% from the nearest gas station.
And I could use the red plastic container for my garden tractor to make it 100% if I so desired.

I have read that you should not charge 100% unless you drive immediately after charging. Recommended 80% charge if the car is going to be parked.
Really ??? give up 20% or damage the battery great deal there.

EV Charging:

Drive how far to find a super charger that is not in use or broken AND... wait 30-45 minutes for 80% charge.

At Home plug in and wait 8 hours give or take for 80% charge.

85%. And it's not like charging to 100% immediately damages the battery, it's about daily usage patterns over time.

BTW so far this month I've driven 1256 miles and spent $33.22 charging at home.

Takes me about 5 minutes to get to Costco, the golden time is 6AM, almost never any wait. I get up every day at 5:30 so no issue there. Side note, if you get there early, say around 5:40-5:45, there is always a lineup. But for years at least at our local Costco, they always open up the pumps around 10 til 6, sometimes even earlier. So if you roll in right about 6 or a little after, all the early birds are cleared out.

I usually stop at Starbucks for a treat just for the heck of it, and it’s right on the way home so I don’t burn excess gas. Then I park in the driveway and kick back for another month or so. Luckily I only need to drive a few hundred miles a month so I get away pretty cheap even with $6 gas.

There have been various claims as to how much energy waste there is from EV deadheading (extra miles driven from the assigned path to find a charger). It’s one of those things that should be fairly investigated and quantified. It will of course improve as the charging network expands.

ICE car: Spend at least 20 minutes schlepping to a gas station, filling up, then heading back, twice a week, every week, week after week after week, no exception. At least 2 hours every month, at least 24 hours a year.

EV: Spend 1 minute plugging the car in at night and unplugging it in the morning every day. Spend about 20-30% of the total trip time charging up on trips over 250 miles (round-trip). So that's 365 minutes (around 6 hours) spent plugging in and unplugging, plus about 1 hour spent charging for every 4 hours spent driving on road trips (being conservative; for more modern EVs it's more like 30-40 minutes charging for every 4 hours driving).

To get to 24 hours spent charging in a year, you'd have to drive on long trips for about 72 hours. At 60mph, that's over 4,300 miles of long-distance driving per year, or about 360 miles per month.

If you are going on 360-mile road trips every month, then sure, you will probably save some time overall sticking to an ICE car. But you sure as heck won't save money; at 30mpg and $4/gal fuel, that 360-mile road trip will cost you $48, where as at 4miles/kWh and $0.31/kWh (current Electrify America member rate), the same trip would cost $28 in an EV.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/drive/mobility/article-will-charging-my-ev-to-100-really-damage-the-battery/

there are a lot of opinions on this, but it will take long term studies on this

I have a GM EV, and I charge it to "100%" every night. Been doing that for 5 years now. No damage that I am aware of.

Ever priced an engine replacement at 200k?

Batteries will last twice that or more.

EV batteries are warrantied for a minimum of 8 years, unlimited miles. There are Teslas out there pushing 200,000+ miles on their original batteries and still going strong.

Still plenty of EV models out there that basically totaled due to needed battery replacement.. and plenty of Teslas suffering from reduced range. The Leaf is a good example of excessive loss at scale across the consumer base - https://electrek.co/2018/03/26/nissan-leaf-battery-pack-replacement-program/

I mean, it's a real issue - it's not uncommon for many cars today to be 10-20yrs old or more. The AVERAGE in the US right now is over 12yrs old.

Maybe our cars don't last as long as they used to.. or to do it they will need major overhauls.. will the consumer market adapt to that? We don't know yet. It's not going to be an easy topic as long as the ideal EVs are still priced well above alternatives.

The people that buy new cars every 3-8 years.. no biggie to them. But the majority of the population still buys used cars. Used car sales units are more than DOUBLE new car sales in the US. So cars that don't last as long or suffer significantly with relatively low age.. is a disruption.

This thread cracks me up - its almost as bad as reading about politics. I Posted that far side comic for amusement. I’m not for one side or the other; heck, I have 2 hybrids, I guess you can say I go both ways

The main thing is I am waiting for my local dealer to carry them, for parts and service through the years.

Actually, that was the 2nd main thing, the first main thing is for the price to come down a lot first.

is it truely 100% or is it 80% of actual capacity but shows as "fully charged"

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/tesla-limits-charging-to-80-at-some-in-demand-supercharger-stations-185252.html

And why do tezla superchargers stop at 80% unless the owner tells the system to go to 100% or start a second charging cycle to go to 100%

The Supercharger network is one of the biggest assets Tesla has and the main reason its vehicles are so successful. The charging experience is said to be the best in the industry, but things started to worsen fast as more Tesla cars get on the road and clog the charging stations. It wasn’t long until some Superchargers in the U.S. got so busy that Tesla owners queued for hours to get their car an energy boost.

One Tesla owner posted on Twitter that he wished he could pay $6/gallon of gas and be on his way than waiting in line at a Supercharger. He would’ve been surprised to see ICE car owners wish to have an electric vehicle, too, just to escape the long lines at gas stations. Even so, it is clear that Tesla needs to build more Superchargers, as waiting for hours to charge is not an option for many people.

The situation is bad not only in the U.S. but also in Australia, a country where electric vehicles are still rare. Tesla owners discovered a strange message on their car screens as they hooked up to a Supercharger station. The notification says Tesla automatically restricted their charge limit to 80% because the Supercharger station was deemed as “high-usage,” according to The Driven.

This was recorded at several locations, including at Broadway in Sydney, Pacific Fair at Broadbeach on the Gold Coast, and Knockrow in the Northern Rivers region of NSW. In most cases, the Supercharger station was fully packed, with people waiting in line. This is interesting as Tesla operates the most extensive charging network in Australia and it’s limited to Tesla cars only.

Although it sounds alarming, Tesla owners discovered that they could override the settings. This is useful for people who charge for a long road trip. For all others, the automatic setting is better because an EV charges a lot slower beyond 80% state of charge. Many EV owners are also not aware of the fact that Li-Ion batteries wear out faster when charged above 80%.

Because the last 20% takes significantly longer than the first 80% - and if they are in a high demand spot it's a good intersection of needs. Best optimization of time per customer and making best availability for everyone.

Because the last 20% takes longer than the first 80%. It is an enforcement mechanism at heavily-trafficked superchargers to keep uneducated morons from clogging the system for everyone.

Don't bother reasoning with Bob, it's a waste of time

Let him post his boomer memes from fb and ask his anti-ev questions which he truly has no interest in hearing the correct and rational answers that crap on his agenda.

Current Motor Trend future car issue is about 90%+ Electric.
You can hate them as much as you want but manufacturers are switching over.
My guess is it's more about $$ than caring about the environment.
Seems a MFG. can build just about their entire EV line up off of a 1 EV skateboard platform

I am excited for the EV future
For those that are not, there is the F150 Raptor R

Good, I’m gonna need all the fuel I can get my hands on to drive all my loud polluting vehicles ‍♂️

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Ok, have fun driving around in your *****.

Yeah noise is a huge pollution, I would say more then the affects of exhaust on a child’s developing brain.

I’m sure all of the emissions controls have been removed from your rigs . So when around kids you can rev up that poison and everyone will know the member is micro .

.

Those skateboard systems are crap and hard to make . Government motors will go down in a ball of Biden bail out flames . Mark my word .

Why the SEC isn’t investigating Mary Barra is beyond me. Except that the two are soo closely related

This has to be a troll comment, right?

Got to be

The more people switch to EVs, the more the demand for gas drops which will make fueling your collection cheaper!

I doubt that. I’d think we’d have less oil because there wouldn’t be as much drilling and jobs in the oil industry causing the price to go up

avatars like these are why I can't keep anyone straight...

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Refried confusion is making itself clear.

Guy’s arguing with himself!

I don't think so. Look at the pandemic, when gas dropped under $2. Production was shuttered all over the place. The price of a gallon of oil literally went to zero; people on the wallstreetbets subreddit were trying to scheme ways to take delivery of it and store it somewhere, lol.

I'm the uglier one

hahaha so true … might need to switch that now haha