I truly hope you are right!

by troll you mean truth ?

plenty of studies on both the problems with noise pollution and emissions on developing brains

GM government motors ?

or SEC and Mary Barra ?

must be missing something

Never mind.

Edit: Best to keep my mouth shut.

Fisker Ocean - who's in on a reservation?

Fisker Ocean (resized).jpeg

GM has put up a new site called EV Live that offers live one-on-one and group video sessions to explain the ins-and-outs of EV ownership and assuage any concerns. I feel like some people here could use a resource like this.

Sounds like a propaganda hotline to me. Man if they have to do that to try to convince people to buy a product nobody really needs, the product must not be very good

It's more a counter to the disinformation streams out there.

The cars sell themselves.

Obviously it is designed to help GM sell more EVs. But it does so by helping combat EV disinformation. They are basically doing the job that dealership salespeople should be doing but aren't.

Experience the digital wonder of our innovative Revolve rotating center screen. This exclusive, optional 17.1-inch touchscreen has the power to swivel from a Control Mode – a portrait view - to Hollywood Mode – a landscape 16:9 widescreen format allowing you to enjoy movies and videos, complete with 360° sound, in an immersive cinematic experience.

OH GREAT they will let you to watch a movie while you drive..

More tactile controls, fewer touchscreens. They are flatly unsafe while driving.

I wouldn't touch Fisker with a hundred foot pole. He's a great exterior designer, but his Karma showed he doesn't know how to deliver the full package. Kind of like JPop and his pretty box of lights.

Yep - although he apparently started his (first) EV company 20+ years ago, I had never heard of Fisker until just recently, and based on that endeavor, his strength seems to be style rather than substance.

Not sure regarding its technical reality, but his EMotion model does looks pretty cool to me! But then again, most new luxury EVs do as I currently drive a 2013 Leaf.

He was the Astin Martin lead designer when they were so G D eleagant. He also did the BMW Z8 that had mixed reviews, but now considered a classic. Wouldn't trust him outside exterior design. However, some of his one off stuff doesn't look that great. I really liked the styling of the Karma, but the inside sucked.

Neither is your battery since it's at 80% normally.

"Uneducated morons" those would be EV owners by your definition.

There are uneducated morons everywhere. Buying an EV is a smart decision, but not every EV buyer is a smart person.

Only if you have it set to do that. You can easily have it set to charge to 100% any time you want.

It has been to 100% several times, but don’t tell anyone.

The problem with EV's for many is still price. I just bought a 2 year old certified preowned truck and to get a comparable Ford Lighting it would cost me $75k (XLT with extended range battery, no pro model). The Lighting would cost more then double the price of the used truck I bought and have a 320 mile range versus the 500 miles I can get out of a tank of gas. I have family up to 6 hours / 400 miles away that I can drive to in my truck without refueling.

For a lot of potential EV buyers, including myself, people will jump into the EV market when they can buy a 2-3 year old certified preowned at a good discount versus buying new. How far is that away though? When could I buy 2-3 year old Ford Lighting XLT with an extended range pack for say $45k used versus $75k new? For that to happen a lot of EV vehicles need to be produced and purchased. It's going to take years, maybe 10 or more in my opinion for those scenarios to happen.

On another note gas at my local Costco just dropped to $3.90, with their credit card at a 4% discount (cash back) that's $3.75 a gallon.

listen to your logic though..

You're saying to get popular.. the used prices need to come down. The reason used prices are high, is because they are already in such demand. You can't lower used prices and have increased popularity. You can't buy a used model 3 for 60% off MSRP because they are already too popular

What your argument really is.. is simply price point. And companies are already trying to address that with lower end models.

I mean your example of a 45k dollar truck is ironic, because 45k isn't that much of a drop off from new truck prices... because... trucks are also popular

omg apologies to you both wow I think I've been mistaking you for each other

Are we allowed to start a separate "The 'I hate "The I Hate EVs" Thread' Thread"

Can a pin fit in a Kona or Ioniq 5?

I've considered it!

Hence, my previous post: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-i-hate-evs-thread/page/39#post-7001239

Not necessarily. I would argue that the majority of EV's are leased (approximately 80% according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance). When they come off lease there is still a residual value to the vehicle that must be recuperated by the lease holder. The leasing companies will typically sell these vehicles to dealerships, auto auctions, etc., which in turn need to sell at a profit. I imagine these factors play a large role in the EV used vehicle pricing (as well as ICE).

Not sure about the Kona (though I'd love to find out), but should be no problem in an Ioniq 5.

If the cars would not sell at that price - they would lower their prices until they do. The wholesale prices are again driven by the demand in the market. No dealership is obligated to buy the lease company car at a price that works for the leasing company. Dealers buy wholesale with the intent of making money at retail. They buy based on what they think they can sell.

The limited availability with the high desirability keeps those market prices up. Doesn't matter if a dealer is into a car for 40k wholesale... if the market won't pay that price he won't get it.

Today, the market is willing to pay those prices... because the demand is there.

Not with Tesla, they want the car back after the lease is over, hint hint if you’re a buyer.

propaganda ae ? is that why you have a huge portion of TV add space dedicated to selling trucks with names like raptor nightmare and tornado velociraptor goliath mil spec and henniseee . with the super cool plastic bits and extra tall loud exhaust ? and why every man needs one . cuz he's hard working and a bad ass . lol

the big 3 including Government motors has always had to convince people to buy their garbage . they have never sold them selfs .. TESLA sells itself, hence why you never see ads from them and that creates heaps of media hate, so the media loves to ramp up the personal attacks on the greatest engineer/disruptor to ever live. Elon Musk

They'd definitely like to get this one back.

teslacrash (resized).PNG

so they can edit the computers memory top prove that it was not on autopilot at the time.

AKA the 37 minutes of silence of the Richard Nixon tapes

As a software developer...I implore all of you: do NOT trust software to drive your car.

Sure use it as an aid to reduce driving fatigue. But never give it full trust, EVER.

I've seen way too much sketchy code in my life.

Elon continues to say they are limiting lines of code for this exact reason , there is actually very few lines of code in the program ..it vision based .

driving with the FSD on is still many time better than a average human driver .. and thats a fact son

I saw a YouTube video of FSD completely flummoxed by a picture of a stop sign on a truck. That right there was enough to convince me the edge cases are limitless and will never be solved. FSD is a pipe dream.

Full self driving car?

You go into the car with full self driving car?
Full self driving car go onto the road?
You go onto the road?
Other cars, signs, bridges, ravines, etc on the road with full self driving car?

Farewell and adieu to you fair Spanish ladies

And how do you think the raw materials that are used to make a Tesla are derived? I seriously doubt the mining of all the metals was powered by solar excavators. Goes back to what I said multiple times previously. If you want an electric car for whatever reason, then I have zero issues with your decision, and you don't even have to justify it to me (again, I encourage and applaud the innovation). However, the moment you project your moral superiority over me for doing so then we have a problem.

I think we're on the same page then.

I do not drive EVs to save the world. I drive them because they are faster/more fun (subjectively), and lower cost to run and maintain.

As long I can have my car for way less than a EV. Why would I care buying one ?

It might be harsh but that's the way I feel about it. Not judging anyone….if you can afford and like these cars why would you not buy one. To each his own.

So let's have the same rule that you have to drill, pump, and refine your own gas. If you are going to refuse technology, then refuse it ALL.

It's an issue - I'm the prime target for driving an EV, but I cannot justify the price. I want an EV, but all my life I've always bought on the secondhand market for a lot less than a new car. For reasons already discussed, it's going to be a long while before my markets start seeing used EVs at used car prices.

It's a deal, we'll start next Monday.

.

Not Zero emissions....methane gas, oh my!

cow (resized).jpg

I don’t know any EV driver who argues that they are morally superior for driving one. That is an imaginary persecution complex that EV haters use to project their moral superiority. “Look at me, fighting for us poor, beleaguered ICE drivers against those smug EV driving assholes! I’m so amazing!”

But this is a normal human reaction to any counterculture. Vegans, Linux/Mac users, EV drivers and, somewhat ironically, car haters; all get accused of projecting some sort of moral superiority because of their counterculture choice.