New York, NY
No, it couldn't
People make pinside look bad with threads like this.
(Topic ID: 167943)
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Ghostbusters (LE)
Stern, 2016-
Ghostbusters (Premium)
Stern, 2016
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Stern, 2016
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It's just a terrible game to play. Now I know that isn't important to everybody, especially those who just want something that looks cool and costs $6000-8000.
But the game is an absolute mess from a player standpoint. Some of the issues can be addressed in software (like cleaning up that atrocity of a multiball) but nothing is gonna save that playfield layout.
RD is right...there are literally hundreds of games that are better pinball games. I own 15 right now and each one of my games is better.
But admittedly a beat up Stern Stars might not look as impressive in a finished suburban basement as a brand new GBLE. It's about 20X more fun to play though.
Quoted from dmbjunky:Stars beats Ghostbusters in a lot of features. Code is complete. Playfield, Cab, and backglass art is better. Similar number of shots. Double the amount of spinners. Better sound package. Easy to learn but hard to master rules. It has a Kirk post.
I think you guys just need to put a 100 games on Stars so you understand it better.
It's really indisputable that's Stars is better than GB
Stars is absolutely addictive - you always feel like you can do a little better, blow it open. You keep coming back. It virtually impossible to play only 2 or 3 games of stars. It's incredibly easy to end up in an hour-long stars jail.
GB doesn't have this. You never feel like you will do better. Yeah, eventually you have a good game but there's no sense of accomplishment - you just feel like you got really lucky.
I saw two people walk away in disgust from ghostbusters today, after playing it several times.
Nobody ever walks away in disgust from Stars because it's such an awesome game. When it kicks your ass you don't feel cheated.
Also, I've never seen a stars with ghosting. The gble I saw today that was built in August 24 has ghosting on the Tobin insert.
So I think we can all agree that stars is better than ghostbusters, which clearly means ghostbusters can't be the best game ever.
Quoted from Who-Dey:So people like me give Pinside a bad name because I ask if GB could be the best pin ever made, but you say a 1978 Stern Stars is better than Ghostbusters and you are great for Pinside. Makes sense to me! Bwaaaaaa haaaaa haaaaaa haaaaaaaaa....
Sounds like Ghostbusters kicks your ass and thats why you hate it. Maybe you need to get better at pinball?
Really dude? Bwaahahha?
With those kind of mad skills you are gonna be winning as many flame wars around here as the bengals win playoff games.
And I don't "say" stars is better than ghostbusters, as much as I just report it. It's an established fact, not mere opinion or hyperbole. Much better game all around.
Now you are really digging your own grave.
I'm neither a jets nor giants fan. But I'm smart enough to know they've won a combined 5 Super Bowls to the bengals GOOSE EGG.
Why dey? Bwahahahaha
Quoted from Kiwipinhead:I watched a couple of Stern Stars videos to see what it was all about..... nodded off while watching.
Watch bowen's tutorial! It's pretty exciting.
Even if he is teaching a growing generation of Stars players to approach the game the wrong way (I ain't giving away my secrets!)
Meanwhile if you want to drive yourself nuts play the new GB Ghosting Edition LE at sunshine in Brooklyn.
Of all the games that needs the "sunshine harder settings, one tilt warning, tight tilt" treatment, it sure as hell ain't this one. I think even the biggest GB lover around here would concede you need to be able to move that game a little for it to be any fun at all.
Quoted from iceman44:Better question for sure.
The potential for greatness is there.
It's already a blast to play and that's all that matters.
The "pinball elites" will never like anything newer than 1980 Sucks for them.
NBA fastbreak was built in 1997!
Quoted from timballs:Ghostbusters:
If you miss your super skill shot = jail. Might as well have thrown that quarter in the trash (assuming game is only 75c/play) because you aren't going to break 10m for this ball. Your only choice in the game is to shoot that stupid ghost target which is designed to drain left outlane every time (or if it's designed to go inlane it doesn't matter, because the inlane rails are so short it will hop over!) Then slimer comes down and dear god are you in trouble. If you're lucky enough to be playing a Pro instead of the godforsaken LE you will have to shoot the ball into a shot-that-isn't-a-shot random hole in the middle of the game which maybe sorta goes to pop bumpers??? Then if you can shake it out to the right side you have to hope that the emergency gate works they had to put on the game after it clearly wasn't tested too well. If it works.. your ball will finally return to the flipper. If it doesn't... good luck...
Hopefully during this fiasco you somehow survived 2-5 ghost target shots and 1 slimer shot. Did you do that? great. Now hit slimer 3 more times. Oh by the way he rarely registers now unless you use the older code with no debounce time.. now he registers so often that you get stuck in an infinite Mass Hysteria loop and you can't even lose if you tried. Fun!
Ok so 2 more shots to the stupid slimer toy, well, what else is there to do? Oh. I guess I could hit this captive ball and nice! got 1 hit and regained control.. pass over to the right flipper and shoot the captive ball again and it... bounced into the Scolari Bros. start... oh no the "best game ever" has decided that it wasn't hard enough so it decided to put 2 drop targets up in front of the only 2 shots worth shooting in this game. How do they block them? With airballs! The ball doesn't just reject like a normal game with normal drop targets. no. it hits the glass maybe takes a ride down the left side plastic over the captive ball area into the drain, maybe it hits the LE's habitrail and goes outlane, maybe over a flipper. The fun of ghostbusters is that the better you play the worse you do! If I wanted to play a game where nothing I do determines my outcome and I'm going to waste my time and money I'd just drive down to Atlantic City and play one of the Big Bang Theory slot machines.
There are 3 scores on Ghostbusters.
1m-10m. This only happens to players who don't short plunge. "Play better" by spending 2-3 minutes per ball skillfully draining.
50m-200m. This score is what you get from playing 2-3 modes and 1 worthless storage facility multiball.
1bn+ This is the score you get 1 game out of 50 where you're "not quite sure what I did" but you've deluded yourself into thinking it was cool because when you looked up the score was very large. "The flippers seemed to swap sides that was pretty cool right? I dunno I was in multiball it just kept giving me balls and everything was lit so I shot it."
Now stars has some great features that Ghostbusters doesn't have. The first thing you will notice is that there is rubber on the playfield. This is important because it gives the player a tool to control the ball when they aren't using flippers. Does ghostbusters have rubber? Nope.. not really.. just on the slingshots unless.. oh wait.. you're playing an LE? I'm so sorry. Magna-slings have decided to take away your ability to use the slings to your advantage at all! Fun!
Stars also has: a center post. Now you may be saying... why does this matter? Most games don't have center posts. Put your ghostbusters out anywhere on location for players to play and then check out the floor later. If you have any good players they will be making sweeping slide saves to prevent center drains constantly.. especially if there's a bad scoop feed in either scoop which there has been in every Ghostbusters I've played so far (4: 3 pros 1 LE)
In its current state with code, Ghostbusters is not a top 10 game. If there are no massive changes to the software of the game, there will be no chance it will remain popular. Can the game get better? Perhaps.. but it needs to become playable and fun from start to finish. It needs flow and code. I don't want to play a game where I have to keep checking my surroundings to see if perhaps I died and was sent to a very specific layer of hell for pinball players.
Just when the starters were getting tired, another top 100 player comes off the bench to nail it with a stellar critique of the many issues that are preventing GB from joining Stars in the strata of elite pinball machines!!!
Nice job timballs!
Quoted from trunchbull:My issue with the flipper gap is the left pops exit, which usually drops the ball literally straight down the middle, as well as the left and right scoops/saucers, which often fling the ball just past the ends of the flippers, and the return on the right orbit. If the half gate is stuck in the up position, then a ball coming out the right side of the pops bumps against the orbit wall and often right down the middle, and left orbit shots return hugging the left side of the wall and go right down the middle. I also feel like a lot of the shots are a lot more kludgy and easy to brick than on CFTBL - GB feels like playing ping pong with yourself, the ball is constantly flying back in your face.
Creature is a masterpiece. I have a hard time reconciling how the same designer came up with ghostbusters.
My only conclusion is that it was either dumb luck, or that Trudeau had a ton of help over at Williams on that particular project.
Quoted from jar155:I get that you're trying to be hyperbolic on purpose, but several things are inaccurate with your complaints. It's easy to get into modes via skill shot. You can miss many times and the skill shot stays lit, so you can keep trying. The skill shot stays lit until you hit a different major shot, which will only happen if you're flailing.
But see, this sums up the whole GB experience.
You get to start EVERY BALL by soft plunging about 8 times, draining invalidated balls, and struggling to get control so you can take a chance at a skill shot.
And this is just to avoid missed skill shot jail, before you've even taken a meaningful flip.
It's not fun.
Quoted from iceman44:You guys are cracking me up!
I agree, pins set up poorly on location don't make for a good experience
I guess if I lived up north I could use my GBLE for firewood this winter
You guys can knock yourselves out having fun hammering GB, while you are doing that I'll be having a blast playing my LE!
After beating LMS again yesterday on TWD, GB provides a great challenge to work through
Some funny reviews but you aren't playing the same pin I'm playing. Just saying
The location excuse is ridiculous.
Our ghostbuster pro is set up FINE. It's level. Tilt is fair. Slimer actually works. And we have access to keys to fix or adjust issues.
Game still sucks bro.
The "top 100 player" burn is also stupid. Just because we don't like it doesn't meant we suck at it. You can dislike a game while sill figuring out a way to muddle through it - sometimes that's what tournament play is all about.
Or I guess I just made this myself?
But enough about ghostbusters...I thought we were discussing Stars?
Well, love it or hate it, I want to applaud all parties for resisting the urge to start a post with...
"Well, we know you HATE ghostbusters, but..."
Quoted from CaptainNeo:for me TZ and TAF have always been the greatest games ever made. I've gone back and forth on which one is better, but they are so close it's hard to put one ahead of the other. Only reason I deem TZ a little better, is because it has some better toy ideas. The power ball, magnetic playfield, gumball machine are just a little better than, playfield magnets, thing, and bookcase. but both are awesome and if it wasn't for TAF, many of us probably wouldn't even be here today.
First games that got me hooked were High Speed and Cyclone, but no doubt Addams was the one that REALLY got me into it a few years later.
Who is Ghostbusters gonna hook? Nobody. It's great for people who love the theme but no novice is gonna play a couple games on it and then start seeking out every machine they can to play, which is what happened with countless people with TAF.
Quoted from Max_Badazz:Will not be the best ever...but could be "one of the greatest" if it holds the tests of time in 5-10 yrs from now
Well you know what Sammy Hagar says:
"Only time will tell if we stand the test of time."
Quoted from Guinnesstime:It must be a nostalgic thing for STARS, but for me, hitting 5 shots and wailing on a spinner is not very fun. I'm really happy with GB so far.
Who plays Stars like that?! That Bowen guy?!
I love to approach Stars with the bonus - inlane passing to build it up and then drops for 2X. Once I've built up a nice bonus bank, then I'll start to chase the STARS targets. It's really not much of spinner game for me that's not how I like to approach it.
And best of all, Stars is ready to kick ass out of the box, you don't need to add silly mods to it just to make it playable!
Nothing nostalgic about it, as I was 3 when it came out.
Quoted from Jeekayjay:Really enjoyed my games on a GBpro last night. Awesome to look at lots to shoot at. Love the tighty righty ramp.
Playfield issues aside I don't see what's to hate about it.
Best ever? Not as long as Hobbit exists
Your taste is...suspect.
Quoted from Who-Dey:How about this guys, is it possible that Ghostbusters could be the best STERN games ever? Now I certainly believe that is a possibility guys. Its easily going to be a top 5 best Stern games ever once its all said and done.
NO goddammit...give up this stupid fantasy already. Ghostbusters won't even be the best pin released this year.
Games that are clearly better than GB and always will be:
Tron, Metallica, walking dead, kiss, Star Trek, tspp, Lotr, AC/DC...oh, and stars and about every stern made between 1978-1981
get the picture?
This thread, however, does have a shot at top 5 stupidest ever "once all is said and done", so at least you got that goin for ya.
Quoted from jar155:There is absolutely nothing exciting about KISS' layout. It's the most bland, unchallenging, uninspired layout we've seen in at least a decade. The only risk was the head, and that's a flop.
But it "shoots great!"
When did people start saying this about pins? It reeks strangely of Kaneda.
Quoted from Who-Dey:Wanna know what's really stupid Levi? You keep on reading it lol
Go take your meds and leave us big people alone, or better yet go play your Stern Stars!
Ah the old "but you keep responding!" gambit.
So...what you are telling me, is that you made a post, and I responded, and continue to make more posts, to which I continue to respond to.
Huh...as if that isn't the complete and total point of this place. Well, you win, I guess!
Quoted from Rarehero:Really? You never heard that term? .
Before I started hanging around here, I've absolutely never heard the term or people talking about how a game "shoots."
It's a pinside invention, it's a newbie invention.
Quoted from Rarehero:I've been hearing I was a newb 10 years ago - usually it's a way to compliment the layout about a game before you complain about it. Example - "T3 shoots great, but it's too easy and the sound is terrible."
So, we are at least in agreement that it's an essentially meaningless barometer of how good a game is, kind of like an argument in an ad about whether or not a beer's best qualities are that it "tastes great" or is "less filling."
LOL @ "shoots great." What in the everloving Hell is that supposed to mean?
Quoted from Rarehero:I just told you! Lol
It's a comment about the physical nature of the game, regardless of the whole package in context.
Shoots great!
Better Flowing!
Shoots great!
Better Flowing!
Quoted from Gryszzz:"Hey man, wanna shoot some pinball ?" just sounds more manly than "Hey Chazz, wanna play some pinball ?"
It's one of those subconscious masculine re-enforcers that makes us feel all lumberjack. Just my 3 cent.
"Chazz...you shoot great!" also has a nice masculine subconscious subtext that makes us feel all brokeback.
Quoted from Rarehero:...but the toys suck or the code sucks or....it usually comes with a "but".
Ahh so it's kind of an "with all due respect..." of pinball.
Quoted from Who-Dey:I agree! Most of these people hating on GB suck at pinball and its just too hard for them and they hate it. The exception to that would be Levi but he doesn't like anything, thats obvious just by reading his posts.
I like Stars.
That's obvious by reading my posts.
Quoted from Rarehero:That may be true, but they are not linear. You're never forced to do anything in a particular order on those games.
The software on Afm is so elegant, everything works together and feels right. Totally incomparable work GB.
GB the software is currently a total mess. Everything clashes with Everything else, nothing blends together. You can almost see the seams in it.
The multiball is a total disaster. No clear goal, a total mishmash. The add a ball is ridiculously hard to achieve and it's just a flailfest.
Looping supers is the most fun thing in the entire game, but you can start it in that chaotic multiball?! What a waste. No fun and ruins both your multiball and your loopin supers.
Loopin supers should also freeze the modes, since you won't be chasing the modes at all. You'll be chasing the supers. So you do. And then loopin supers ends, and your mode has now timed out too which means you are in "no mode jail" again, which of course sucks ass. And of course, loopin supers can be disrupted if you have locks lit. Good luck getting your loops going again after the ball kicks out.
The playfield is bad enough but the half-baked software isn't helping. It needs to be refined in a big way, which would help make this game more fun and less of the disaster it currently is.
I can't think of another dmd game with such messy software. It feels like it was assembled by committee with no sense of purpose. Jury is out cause it's a work in progress but they need one person with a clear vision to tie the software together and refine it.
Quoted from jar155:Levi, the more you talk about the code, the more obvious it is that you don't know it well. Seriously. Also, you're an accomplished player, how are you so bad at this game? I'd love to actually know the answer to that question.
I'm not bad at it. I got a billion on a pro yesterday.
I've played 100s of games of ghostbusters. I'm practically an expert. The software is a mess and needs to be refined - more so than any other dmd game I can think of. Please re-read my previous post if you care to see why, I provided plenty of examples.
It's not too late. I bet in future code revisions you'll see many of the issues I brought up addressed. Hopefully anyway.
Quoted from jar155:The problem is that you mention stuff like looping Mass Hysteria (not possible),
I never said that. I said you can start it during multiball.
Quoted from jar155:incorrect number of hits on Slimer,
I never said anything about that either. It's amazing how people just make up whatever they want to make up when they have an agenda here.
Quoted from jar155:Don't start modes with your skill shot, that's not a good idea either.
You are out of your mind. That's the only way to approach the game. If we played I would beat you every time with your brilliant "start every ball in no-mode jail" strategy.
Quoted from jar155:Edit: That said, I can't blame anybody for being frustrated with the game's difficulty.
I'm not frustrated by the game's difficulty. Ultimately I don't think it's fun due to it's many flaws.
Quoted from Circus_Animal:What for? The answer would still be no.
He should try "Could Ghostbusters End Up Being Sterns Best Pin With Ernie Hudson On It Ever?" to really narrow it down, and to give the answer to his question at least a decent shot of being "yes."
Quoted from iceman44:Not even close. GOT layout is awful, one of Ritchie's worst imho. Forget the artwork.
But it's your money, to each his own!
I don't understand how anybody could possibly complain about the GOT layout. It "shoots great!"
Quoted from Concretehardt:I like GB better than GOT, I hope this doesn't make me a bad person?
Yes.
You are worse than HItler.
X-men sucks, but not as bad as ghostbusters. It's just kind of uninspired and ugly.
Fish tales is decent.
Ghostbusters has some problems.
Quoted from Rarehero:Do you think GB has hope if the code ends up being tweaked & more balanced with the design? Can you see yourself liking it if constructive criticism is implemented?
Hey you never know. I wasn't a fan of walking dead at first.
Thay layout is always gonna have some problems, I really don't understand what Trudeau was going for with it.
Quoted from Rarehero:Against Pinside rules.
I know!
And yet, typing "BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!" is totally legit.
Incidentally, besides being a good game, Fish Tales has probably the best Color DMD conversion at this point.
Quoted from jar155:Wow.
You can be sexist, racist, homophobic, troll, and a general jerk, but you try and have a little harmless fun and THAT'S AGAINST THE RULES.
Pinside has become a joke.
Well, I mean, we have rules, dude. This isn't 'Nam.
Quoted from Air_Pinball:I love people who say the Scoleri Brothers should be removed because they are a nuisance.
Earth to Pinsiders.....they are SUPPOSED to be a nuisance!
Earth to air pinball: they kind of suck. If a giant hole in the middle of the playfield was "supposed to be a nuisance" it wouldn't make it a desirable design feature.
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