(Topic ID: 247924)

Undocumented Gottlieb VS Pinball machine “short videos added”

By N80G80

4 years ago


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  • 205 posts
  • 87 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by flip78
  • Topic is favorited by 58 Pinsiders

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10 key posts have been marked in this topic

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Post #52 Initial comments from Jon Norris Posted by Isochronic_Frost (4 years ago)

Post #101 Gottlieb closing, auction information. Posted by pinballguru (4 years ago)

Post #110 Jon Norris provides information on why Premier ceased operations. Posted by pinballguru (4 years ago)

Post #168 Summary of information up to post 168 in the thread. Posted by N80G80 (4 years ago)

Post #179 More photos. Posted by N80G80 (4 years ago)

Post #180 Video Posted by N80G80 (4 years ago)

Post #181 More video. Posted by N80G80 (4 years ago)


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#125 4 years ago

Very nice find

The date "1995" is printed on the right side of the playfield.
2019-07-26_10h27_31 (resized).png2019-07-26_10h27_31 (resized).png
Very interesting and fun to see that there is a bill acceptor installed inside.

There is also some technical details to notice:
- this game has both specific display boards, for the the 7-segment LED panels. It can be seen on the first picture that two long ribbons depart from the CPU board (A1) and goes to the displays on the aprons.
- sure that with such display system, the bookeeping/configuration is limited.
- there is a small board missing, visible on first picture near the CPU (A1) board ...

Referencing to others SYSTEM-3, like "Barbwire", the size and location, this missing board is probably a communication (A27) board used for printer.

As Isochronic_Frost said, the most important thing to do : MAKE A BACKUP of ALL EPROMs (CPU and SOUND).

#163 4 years ago

Finding the documentation will certainly be an impossible mission.

The best is certainly to be based on that of the SYSTEM-3 :
#743 - SHAQ ATTAQ
#shaq-attaq
which this cocktail table takes many items such as basketball panniers, or domes.

If you are looking for the detailed mechanical schematic of the baskets, they can be found on page 75 of this documentation:
2019-07-27_08h49_32 (resized).png2019-07-27_08h49_32 (resized).png

Note that the SHAQ ATTAQ has also been designed by Jon Norris.
@pinballguru

About the hardware:

I'm pretty sure that the boards used to display the scores on the 7-segment LEDs are the same as on the SHAQ ATTAQ (MA-1768), or at least, built on the same principle.
♦ How and where are these boards connected?
We see two long ribbons, which seem to be connected in parallel.
♦ Which connector on the CPU does it arrive at? A1P6 (like on the SHAQ ATTACK) or A1P3 (normaly, used for DMD board)?

About the configuration/bookeeping:

On the photos, we see that there is a test button, so access to a configuration/bookeeping menu seems well planned.
On the other hand, there is no screen (DOT).
What happen if you press the TEST buttons ? nothing ?

Maybe Jon can clarify this point, but in my opinion they have not developed a special code to use only LED displays as "common display". Normally, on a SYSTEM-3 the menus appear on the DOT screen. It would have been very complicated and very long to rewrite code to translate this into a very limited 7-segment LED display. So, may be I'm wrong, but I doubt that menu/configuration/bookeeping can be accessed using the "simple" LED display.

• This is only a hypothesis, but it is likely that to access the configuration, you must connect a DMD card + an external DOT on the CPU board.

The problem is that Gottlieb video boards are specific to each game, and finding one for OneOnOne is illusory. I think that if it works like this (with the need for an external video board), using an ATTAQ SHAQ would definitely be the solution.

#165 4 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Even then--wouldn't similar era display ROMs work since you're just accessing the menus, rather than trying to display the game dots/graphics?

Yes, indeed, but it was just a hypothesis. There may be no need for another display if they have made a specific development with a very restricted interface.

This is not impossible because we also see that some boards are not "standard".
Obviously, there were savings made by not mounting certain components.

It is obvious on the driver board, where we see that it lacks MOSFET and some CI.

Same on the audio card, where the whole part of the YAMAHA circuits has not been mounted (U9, U10, U11 - YM2151 + YM3014).

It's very much true to the Gottlieb tradition: to do something new with old, and to remove components to make small savings.

1 week later
#188 4 years ago
Quoted from goatdan:

… Finally, is it not a redemption game?

Sure NOT ! there is even a "Dollar Bill Acceptor" inside

What is also remarkable about this table is that although it uses the same baskets as the SHAQ ATTAQ, it is closer to the first SYSTEM-3 with 2x20 VFD display than those with DOT display.

Indeed, according to the videos, we see that the display is alpha-numeric type. The two displays are apparently, wired in parallel and there is no need for external display for configuration menus and bookeeping.

• So, they had to make a very specific development for this game.

I have never seen this kind of display block on another Gottlieb pinball.
In fact, there is one that has also used 16-segment displays :

➡ This is VEGAS (SYSTEM-3 from 1990).

It uses a MA-1451board with three 16-segment LED displays (yes, actually 16 segments and not 14 as on the VFD 2x20).

VEGAS - MA1451VEGAS - MA1451

To my knowledge, this kind of display has not been used on any other Gottlieb pinball machine. All other from that generation, use additional digital displays that are 7-SEGMENT classics (like on Hoops, Title fight, Deadly Weapons, and many more).

The board used in the OneOnOne has height characters, but the schematic and logic, should not be far from the MA-1451 board that was used in VEGAS.

Usually the additional LED displays are connected to the A1P6, but here the two blocks are connected to the A1P3 which is dedicated to the VFD or DOT display boards.
This is not so surprising, because already on the first SYSTEM-3, the VFD displays had been simplified compared to those of the SYSTEM-80B: we no longer find the 10939/10940 and the multiplexing is done by the A1 CPU board and no more automated by the VFD module.

Control of a 16-SEGMENT LED module by the CPU was therefore possible from this connector, but they had to do some development, if only for the character generator which no longer has 14 segments (VFD) but 16 in this case.

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