Curious where you live that a pinball machine could generate bad press and an investigation? Guessing not the US? Makes no difference to me, genuinely interested.

Maybe this is more your speed

The 1930s

I like lamp.

That’s actually a well thought out, salient perspective.

To your point, since TCM was released in 1974, Spooky should have gone with the highest grossing film that year, Blazing Saddles. I think that would have gone over really well with today’s savvy and diverse consumer market.

I think it was very smart of spooky, they were able to do a dream theme for them, and then an alternate for others.

In the recent tcm/lt game, If it would have only been tcm, i would have wished them luckm but never been a buyer. I do think theme matters a lot for me, and with the collection i have, i buy almost every release instantly to let people enjoy it. I had zero interest in TCM, just not for me. But once i saw the looney tunes, i ordered instantly

It would have been cool if they changed up a shot or two between the games. Didn't occur until someone said but they want to license what they like but know its a harder sell. So the other game keeps the lights on. Though we don't have final numbers. I feel like looney tunes done by itself, with unique mechs could have out sold scooby though. Many missed opportunities for wacky mechs.

I agree. This seems like a logical way to be able to release titles that might not have enough broad appeal to the masses to carry themselves alone.

I already own a few Spooky machines and am looking forward to future releases. Hopefully titles like Escape From New York , Bladerunner and Evil Dead are coming in the not too distant future. If demand is questionable for those titles, I don’t care If there have to be family friendly alternate versions.

Nah, but as TCM CE is my first home game I'll respond on this thread when I get it and let you know if it happens.

Hey Phil Lee, rumor has it the next cutting edge theme will be The Prisoner.
HealthyBlackEarthworm-size_restricted.gif

I think I understand your point. I would wager that no- spooky would not try and merge the code for the games and -in good capitalism fashion- one game will die and the other will thrive. If LT sucks and TCM is good or vice versa, the game that sucks won't get sold. End of story. I'm looking at it like this- If Ford released a hatchback and a truck for two different audiences and the hatchback was awful, it just wouldn't sell, people would get a different hatchback or buy the truck point blank period.

Look at HW and Ultraman... HW is good and Ultraman isn't as good. Ultraman CE and BSE are still available on Spooky's site while HW is not.

I think it’s smart the way they’re doing it. You can take your swing with bigger themes solo, but when your making pins about psycotic killers there is no shame in having a plan B. I’m just really glad to see Bug and Luke starting to hit they’re stride on layout. I know it’s just a short clip, but you can see there’s change and for the better. Nobody walks into they’re line of work as a professional. It’s the determination that gets you there. Keep up the hard work men!

Theme plays into a lot if I making a purchase, TCM is a no go for me but I might buy an alternate theme.

It's a very good strategy.

I'm finding the detractors amusing, Stern has done this several times.

Seawitch/Beatles Family Guy/Shrek NASCAR/Grand Prix plus a bunch of "home pins" and boutique titles.

Blazing saddles would be great! We want more funny pins!

I'm for it in the case of horror and music themes, both of which have a potential for losing audience on theme alone.

But I'm particularly for it in the case of proven great playfield designs. I'd love to see re-skins of IM and FF. Given Elwin's status as the GOAT designer around here, reusing his original breakthrough design seems like a no-brainer. IM is really both music and horror pin in one, but mostly it's one of the best playfield designs ever.

I think folks who like horror movies don't really get why some are turned off by them. I like scary movies, but gore just isn't my thing. I watched most of TWD because it was great TV, but had to cover my eyes for half the show! My wife won't watch anything too graphic. Halloween, TWD, TCM could never be in my home.

Do we know that TCM was the "primary" theme and LT is the "re-skin?" I would think Looney Toons would sell better as it's a theme with wider appeal.

Difference is that NFL was released a year later. Shrek is also a reskin, but that Wasn't released at the same time either, like Spooky do.

Gran Prix and NASCAR were released the same month and year.

I wonder how much they save by using the same layout for two different themes with different coding versus making two completely unique machines. Isn’t it mostly just the layout design labor/time that they’re saving? Is that a really significant cost? I suppose for the manufacturing process, it’s easier to assembly if the machines are the same…but once again, I wouldn’t have thought that was a significant cost. What am I missing? I would’ve guessed the main costs are: BOM, coding, assets, art package.

I suspect that if TCM and LT has two different layouts…there’s probably be a few more people that buy both. I know in secondary market, I was tempted a couple of times to buy an UM and only resisted because we already have HWN.

27+ years...

Motel Hell was a good one.

Could be Hot Rods to Hell though Odin

Not a fan of the same layout supporting two different games. Stern did it with Family Guy and Shrek, out of the two Shrek isn’t well regarded. Then Spooky did the same thing with Halloween and Ultraman, Ultraman bombed. I wouldn’t be surprised if one of these games tanks, probably would be Texas Chainsaw as it’s less appealing to a wider audience.

At today’s prices every game should be unique and stand on its own, just my two cents.

From what I have read the issue with HW and UM was they were also sharing the same coder.

Now TCM and LT have both their own coder and own team, so hopefully they both get updates/bug fixes faster.

Smart business decision, but ultimately bad for the creative side of pinball.

Neither theme will achieve the what could have been the ultimate version of themselves.

Dual themes makes tons of sense when one is a horror theme. I think Spooky is being too Midwest nice though in still offering multiple trim levels. Just offer CEs and root out quality issues instead of supporting 6 variations.

Spooky must be doing something right. I've never bought one and they look and feel cheap to me, but there is no denying they are producing games that people want. Who would have thought they would be selling so many more games than JJP and especially AP? They also seem to be better than CGC at actually producing the games they sell. Pinball is not easy. Actually getting the games out the door the way Spooky does for a smaller startup is amazing to me and proves they are well run. So yes, I think they are "smart". And some day I do want a Rick and Morty if the prices ever become sane.

They could end up with two different good games too. They each will have their own dedicated team on it, working on them, and if done correctly will be taking feedback and developing the games to their audiences liking. Both designers on each game has proven themselves, and it's also best they are focusing on their own games and theme as that was a chief complaint with HWN/UM, that UM folks especially felt like the game wasn't really made for the theme, it was a Halloween game, even early code had HWN references in it. Here, the designers can be making the game their own.

One game might be liked better than the other? So what? This is no different from any other two pinball releases.

Some tape and a piece of paper would have gone a long way there instead of selling it… just an excuse buyers use to move their games!

I agree that Spooky is smart, that being said, in your second statement you missed part of their genius. If you are going to reuse a playfield, never, I mean never, make it two titles that target the same audience. Kiss and Aerosmith was a fine example, Stern foolishly hurt sales of both. Rush and Van Halen would be the same. I would buy both if they had two different layouts, but only one if the layout was the same. I own a Rush

Dunno what to think...
Keep checking their website and don't see any new pins...

I already have it designed.
Seriously, too obscure. I doubt there are many people left who watched it or even know what it is.

https://www.spookypinball.com/shop/

I think they're really smart with the dual themes for sure.

I'd kill for a reskin of iron maiden. Such an amazing layout based on a band I don't really care for.

Not sure if stern would make many more sales with a new theme but I'd be interested.

Pretty sure Texas Chainsaw Massacre grossed out a lot more people than Blazing Saddles.

Seems like it would be to me. We'll see.

Stretching what they've got without being too devoted to these "B" list themes. Utilizing the manufacturing savings in both costs and labor in developing a second playfield is smart, but I also believe it's likely difficult to provide both titles the same amount of love and inspiration. The teams will naturally gravitate towards one or the other as the priority.

While they nailed the appearance of TCM, I'm not sure I agree with the decision to play as the killers. Yes, it's a game, but it's pretty sadistic to work through a mode just to add Pam to a meat hook. Something I can't personally find any excitement to do.

Which leaves me Looney Tunes. Huge fan of those and hits the nostalgia box big time. However, watching the trailers and stream I can't help but feel LT is the secondary effort in this equation.

I'm looking forward to taking it out for a flip, but can't plunk down without playing first and ensuring it's won me over to the point of bringing it home.

I like that Spooky takes chances with the ip's, but when they are doing these dual themes in one playfield I also think it gives them a cushion. Debatable whether it's good or bad for their games...

Great stuff, cheers

I mean the name of the company is spooky. They historically focus on spooky themes. LT doesn't even feel to fit their model.

Well it's already proven that people will buy based strictly on theme, so who cares if one of the themes actually had the priority. I guess.

You could argue being in the pin industry right now isn't smart, so whether it's smart or not I'd just say more so it's greatly appreciated that the games are being made.

I think its smart as some have said previously. Not everyone will be in to a horror theme. I do wish there was more difference between the 2. The meat grinder mech didn't need to be in Looney Tunes and it could have been changed a bit. It wouldn't have added much to development cost to change things up just a tad between the 2. But what the hell do I know....

Didn't Stern do this already with Family Guy and Shrek? The only thing I remember Stern being crucified over with over this was the constant loop of "All-Star" by Smash Mouth playing on Shrek, in which case the crucifixion was well deserved.

Sarcasm, people.

It wasn't mostly home market then. Or constant pinside bitching

And both are bad games.

Doesn’t help the case.

And I don't think grand prix was released in 'Merica?

This is correct.

Look, people want to keep bringing up weird one-off examples of the past. Everybody HATED all the whoa Nellie and home reskins when they came out (even if those are apples and oranges comparisons that were private contract jobs). Shrek was a weird one off that came out a year after family guy. Grand Prix was a necessity for a bad game with a theme that was unrecognizable overseas.

Yes. Those things exist. No, I don’t think it’s a great idea for a company to base its entire game plan on making multiple versions of their cornerstone models. Spooky is the only modern company who are doing this.

If you haven’t noticed, the NIB pinball market is enduring a major downturn, and it might behoove companies to narrow their focus at this time- maybe one focused theme with broader appeal will do better than two with limited appeal. These games aren’t just instantly selling out like they did in the Rick and Morty days. Sales appear to be very slow by old school FOMO standards.

It’s just like, my opinion man. If you think it’s a great idea, hey good for you. Pick the one you like and buy it. Or buy both. Enjoy.

Warner Brothers has HUGE public appeal going back several generations as a brand it's very well known.

Two themes per pin is a great idea when the theme is weak. I don’t like the Venom theme at all and won’t buy it. If it were Megadeath though, I’d have an LE. It works with weak themes.