(Topic ID: 293848)

Gottlieb Big Shot Repair

By Flip-it-good

2 years ago


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#8 2 years ago

Gotta get that N relay unstuck. That's your 10 pt relay. In the snippet below, that relay is turned on by your kicking rubbers or any other 10 pt switch on the pf. Since your relay is locked on, I suspect it's one of the red switches. There are only 3 - the red one marked "N" is the locking switch that's actually on the relay itself - it's working since its job is to lock on the N relay, and that's happening. Look at that switch anyway to make sure that it opens when the relay relaxes. I'd guess the problem is one of the other 2 red switches labeled "ON ADD 1ST. TENS" and "ON ADD 2ND. TENS". Those switches are normally-closed switches that are on the 10's score reel for each player. They should open when the plunger pulls in and that should open the circuit and relax the coil. That's not happening, so I'd look there first. Use the wire colors to identify the correct switches on the score reels - look for a normally closed switch that the plunger opens when it pulls back into the coil.

That'll be a start.

Big Shot N relay (resized).JPGBig Shot N relay (resized).JPG

#9 2 years ago

For your control bank not resetting, the circuit that fires those 2 big solenoids at the bottom of your playboard is outlined in red. There's not alot to it - a 10 A fuse (and it's holder), a Motor 3C switch and a switch on the U relay. Is your U relay firing at all?

Big Shot control bank reset (resized).JPGBig Shot control bank reset (resized).JPG
#15 2 years ago

Yes, the H and R relays are supposed to stay on. Hopefully, they're not too buzzy. So it sounds like you're getting close - you have to figure out why the U relay doesn't fire.

Good job with the switch on the N relay. Just as a general rule, switches aren't ever supposed to always stay either open or closed...there wouldn't be any point to having a switch then. They should always change state when a relay is energized - going from open to closed or vice versa. One of the nice things about working on an EM is that you can move the relay actuator by hand and watch the switches opening and closing to verify correct movement. Visual connection of the contacts doesn't necessarily mean electrical connection, but I like being able to verify that the contacts are touching or not.

If your playfield lights are out, you might want to check the lower fuse of the two shown (in red) in the snippet below - it'll have a white wire on one side, and a white-red wire on the other. Check that the fuse and fuse holder are both good. Or that yellowish wire that you took off in your first couple posts might be involved (although I think the wires that the yellow wire was connecting to weren't either white or white-red?) Anyway, check the fuse first.

Big shot pf light fuse (resized).JPGBig shot pf light fuse (resized).JPG

#18 2 years ago

You have a short somewhere in that playfield light circuit. They can be kind of tedious to find unless you get lucky. Look very closely at every light socket and see if you can spot anything wrong - look for 2 metal pieces touching where they shouldn't be, insulation missing off wire somewhere, wires pinched really tightly..anything where metal is touching metal.

As HowardR mentioned, a 10A circuit breaker soldered to a fuse that you can just plug in will save you lots of fuses! I know most people don't just have those lying around, but if you feel like investing 20 bucks, they're very valuable for chasing down shorts without going through a million fuses:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PKP3LG1/ref=sspa_dk_detail_0

I got lucky using a resettable circuit breaker one time, which took about 3 or 4 seconds to blow after the power went on. I put the breaker in, turned off the room lights, and then turned power on to the machine. I was able to see a small, bright glow under the playfield just before the breaker blew - pointed me right to the short. Might be worth a try, though a normal fuse might blow too fast for that to work. I think you'll just have to be patient and observant and track it down visually unless someone else out there has a better idea.

Who knows what that hack wire was supposed to do - if it was hooked to the motor 1A, then it wouldn't have anything to do with lights. I wouldn't worry about it for now.

#19 2 years ago

By the way, that unit in the backbox that you're touching is the player unit - not the match unit. Very important stepper, that one - routes scoring to the correct player, keeps track of which ball you're playing, involved in resetting scores to zero when the game resets.

#22 2 years ago

Good catch on the light socket! Now to figure out why the U relay isn't firing....

#31 2 years ago

So in the last video you posted, your bonus was (mostly) working....has that changed now?

#32 2 years ago

For your player 1 100's reel at reset problem, this is the circuit that's involved in the reset. The Motor 4A switch is working since other score reels are getting pulses to reset. That only leaves the P3B switch on the player unit (do you know how to find that switch?), and the 1st. "Hundreds" Runout switch which is on the score reel - and should open when the score reel reads zero. If you're not sure how the score reel switches should work, compare to the reel next to it, which is working correctly.

I'd guess one of those two switches is staying open all the time, or you have a broken solder joint and resulting loose wire somewhere in that circuit.

You're doing great so far! Finding that missing spacer on the score motor switch was a great find - that affects the timing and opening and closing of the switch, as you saw - so it's important that all those spacers are there. They drop off occasionally and are a bear to find and figure out....so good for you!

Big Shot 100's (resized).JPGBig Shot 100's (resized).JPG

#34 2 years ago

Here's a picture of a Gottlieb player unit (in the backbox). So P3B would be the 3rd plastic cam from the steel ratchet side, second switch up from the bottom. There's usually a screw in the upper right corner of the player unit that will come out and allow the whole unit to fall down 90 degrees on a hinge that will help you see things better, if you need to. OR-BL and OR-RED wires.

Player unit (resized).JPGPlayer unit (resized).JPG

#35 2 years ago

Using the alligator jumpers is a way to short parts of the circuit to eliminate switches from it. If the circuit doesn't work normally, then works when you've jumped some switches, then one of the switches you've jumped is the problem.

For example, in the bonus circuit for your machine that Howard posted, the idea is to fire the C relay. You do that by making a connection through all the switches closing between the left and right vertical lines, which are 28V power lines from the transformer.

If C isn't getting power, then one of the switches Howard marked in red isn't closing. If you hooked the ends of your alligator jumper to the green "X's", you would be shorting all the switches between those 2 points. If C suddenly fires, then you know one of the switches you have jumped across was not working. If it still doesn't fire with the jumper in place, then the problem is one of the switches to the left of the left green X. In your case where the "Ball Return Switch" was dirty, the C relay would have fired, so you'd know the problem is one of the 4 switches between the green "X's" that you jumped. You could move the alligator clips around to narrow your search. But you're always just jumpering over switches to try to find the one that isn't working.

Big shot bonus circuit (resized).jpgBig shot bonus circuit (resized).jpg

#41 2 years ago

Regarding your jumper wire, the green X on the right is on the other side of the ball return switch - should be a RED-WH wire.

According to the schematic (ignore the hand-drawn part for now), the left X should be a SL-BLK wire on one side of a switch on QB1 - not sure what the other side's wire color is. Hopefully, you can find it.

#48 2 years ago

That's good info, bonzo. I would probably make sure all the drop target switches that are involved in counting the bonus are making a good connection too. This will take some testing, but see if each drop target registers individually when counting bonus, or if there's some consistency with the miscounting. When you drop all 15 targets, do you always get the same amount of bonus? Or is it inconsistent?

1 week later
#100 2 years ago

OK...who's gonna post just to get this thread to 100 posts? Anybody?

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