Jupiter, FL
Quoted from zacaj:They don't feel very good. Everyone I've ever talked to about it feels the same, across multiple copies of games and for every JJP. Generally weaker and a big soggy, even when at max strength, and they seem to lose power near the end of the stroke which makes outside (orbit) shots harder to hit. Especially bad in any sort of low power/line voltage conditions. They're probably the worst feeling flippers of any current manufacturer.
AP pins have a similar feel, but not as pronounced
JJP, AP, and Spooky use williams mechs, but none feel quite like williams games.
My experience as well. Hard to believe that in 2021, no pinball manufacturer has been able to best (or duplicate) the B/W flipper system architecture. The flippers on my STTNG feel so perfect. FWIW, even though Stern flippers don't feel like B/W flippers, I still like the flipper feel/strength.
I played a GNR SE this week and couldn't believe how awful the flippers felt...weak, limp. My assessment wasn't unique. I recently sold my DILE, whose flippers felt much better than the GNR I played. So...maybe the GNR SE just hasn't been dialed in? Who knows...you'd think the flipper mechs/code across JJP games would be the same.
I have a R&M (my first Spooky game) and the flippers required some tweaking (EOS adjustment, bushings needed lowering, etc.). People have speculated that the problem is related to P-ROC (the pinball controller hardware), the lack of dual wound coils, or the Spooky specific microcode. Who knows? Whatever it is, I'm confident Spooky will figure it out (they are still actively tweaking the code). Awesome company/game/support, btw.
Lastly, flipper fans are starting to become the rage (on Pinside, at least) to deal with flipper coils that can hover around 200 degrees F after playing a game for 30-60 minutes in a home use environment (https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/aw-jeez-official-rick-and-morty-club/page/235#post-6181887). Based on information from other threads (and my own measurements), flipper fade kicks in @ ~125F (so at 200F, flipper fade is miserable). Makes you wonder if pinball manufacturers are even testing/measuring how hot these flippers get...
I've been in this hobby for 17 years and have owned many games. While I understand that coils getting hot is not a new phenomena, the flippers on my 60+ games over the years have never gotten hot enough to dramatically effect flipper strength (or the ability to make a shot). I've hosted many tournaments, and players rarely complained about flipper fade (where the games might be played for 3-6 hours fairly continuously). With some of the newer games, this isn't the case. If it becomes impossible to make key shots after 30-60 minutes of use, there is something wrong with the flipper system architecture IMHO. Just to be clear...the existence of flipper fans doesn't bother me at all. Great to have a tool for more extreme pinball environments (streaming, free play arcades, etc.). What bothers me is having the flippers fade to the point where the flippers are useless during a 20-30 minute "breakthrough" game.
