(Topic ID: 185260)

2017. The beginning of the end for Stern...April 1st is over.

By Luckydogg420

7 years ago


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    There are 303 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 7.
    #251 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    Well, anyways, to answer your question... barring another major war, coming next would be an increase in attention to physical labor and trade skills, due to the necessity that an entire culture of workforce cannot exist as white collar (hence the worthless degrees), a decrease in the trends that lead away from the physical (smart phones, social media, paths of least physical resistance, etc.) and towards the physical when able, and a general cultural shift towards focus on others. It would be the subsequent generation where such things are considered noticeable, however.

    Coming next is AI and most people's jobs will go bye-bye. Elon Musk has already talked about how a national minimum living wage will have to be implemented because so many people will be out of work.

    How many jobs is Watson alone doing? And it's just an expert system; not true AI. Same with self driving cars....don't go to truck driving school because in 5-8 years you won't have a job.

    #252 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    If a company develops a platform for building homebrews, it would pretty much tank the opposite of that model, which is basically Stern from what I can gather.

    Please stop

    #254 7 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    How many jobs is Watson alone doing? And it's just an expert system; not true AI.

    Short answer: not many yet. Longer answer: Watson is more marketing than reality at this time but that will change. Watson is not currently a product but is instead an analytical workbench that is the front end for highly tailored services engagements delivered by IBM to make it do this analytical wizardry.

    All that being said your thesis is correct in that automation is going to fundamentally change our society, like it does every generation. This change this time is going to be pretty profound and impact the lesser educated and those with tasks that can be automated. I do not pretend to have answers and hope that those that are in a position do can come up with things to help the American population. I see the changes that are even impacting my industry (high tech sales) and am contemplating how I stay ahead of this wave. Irrespective of politics, I hope that we can invest in infrastructure and the retooling of our educational system so that we can give people good paying jobs and develop applicable job skills in our citizenry.

    #255 7 years ago

    Finally up to speed on this thread....Stern is in trouble, but more importantly......Millinnials who are slow....think like Gen X peeps.

    Got it.

    #256 7 years ago
    Quoted from Stones:

    Finally up to speed on this thread....Stern is in trouble, but more importantly......Millinnials who are slow....think like Gen X peeps.
    Got it.

    You forgot everyone is going to lose their jobs and society is turning to a life like that in the movie Idiocracy. Buy Starbucks stock now!

    idiocracy-poster (resized).jpgidiocracy-poster (resized).jpg

    #257 7 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballlew:

    You forgot everyone is going to lose their jobs and society is turning to a life like that in the movie Idiocrisy. Buy Starbucks stock now!

    I like money, let's go find a Starbucks.

    #258 7 years ago

    I could go for a full body latte
    IMG_2753 (resized).JPGIMG_2753 (resized).JPG

    #259 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    If a company develops a platform for building homebrews, it would pretty much tank the opposite of that model, which is basically Stern from what I can gather.

    I think the name of that company will be... Multimorphic. Not that they are going to produce thousands and thousands of games, but that platform seems to have a lot of potential.

    #260 7 years ago
    Quoted from Stones:

    Finally up to speed on this thread....Stern is in trouble, but more importantly......Millinnials who are slow....think like Gen X peeps.
    Got it.

    Because they are further behind the present.

    The really slow ones are hippies lol.

    #261 7 years ago
    Quoted from DaveH:

    I think the name of that company will be... Multimorphic. Not that they are going to produce thousands and thousands of games, but that platform seems to have a lot of potential.

    I originally thought they were what I was thinking after reading their advertisements language, but then saw that what they were talking about was a lot different than I was, at least with the stuff I saw at TPF.

    #262 7 years ago

    Screenshot_20170402-124358 (resized).pngScreenshot_20170402-124358 (resized).png

    -3
    #263 7 years ago

    Screenshot_20170402-115620 (resized).pngScreenshot_20170402-115620 (resized).png

    #264 7 years ago
    Quoted from jellikit:

    Stern Army, 'nuff said.
    Brad

    Blech...What is that, the "C" team?

    #265 7 years ago
    Quoted from DBLM:

    If you are half a decade to a decade ahead of your peers, that means you helped lead the charge on ironic PBR drinking, horrible facial hair, riding penny farthings, and other general hipster douchebaggery. What trends do we need be prepared to see unleashed in the wild based upon your efforts? Gen X and above wants to know.

    You forgot the latest, greatest MAN BUN! Better known by the Gen X as the bob knob.

    #266 7 years ago

    Only weirdos wear those.

    #267 7 years ago

    So was this an April fool's thread??

    I usually just put Saran wrap over the toilet

    #268 7 years ago
    Quoted from CNKay:

    So was this an April fool's thread??
    I usually just put Saran wrap over the toilet

    No it was not. OP is trying to rid himself of the drama. Which wound be a shame - thread of the week so far

    #269 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    If a company develops a platform for building homebrews

    http://pinballmakers.com/

    As a Gen-X, who sits forgotten and quiet between two self-centred, egotistical generations, I guess I'd rather "do" than just talk about it. So, there's your homebrew link.

    #270 7 years ago
    Quoted from DerGoetz:

    thread of the week so far

    Strange that it's the thread with the most ignored user comment messages for me

    #271 7 years ago
    Quoted from jwilson:

    http://pinballmakers.com/
    As a Gen-X, who sits forgotten and quiet between two self-centred, egotistical generations, I guess I'd rather "do" than just talk about it. So, there's your homebrew link.

    I've looked at that before. Still not really what I'm thinking of.

    You originally from Canada? I've been to Toronto before. Went to some zoo. Watched some clowns perform some anti or play in French.

    #272 7 years ago
    Quoted from chadderack:

    Strange that it's the thread with the most ignored user comment messages for me

    Are most of these people typical dbags?

    #273 7 years ago

    I don't know if Stern goes to bankruptcy but financial people get the lead in this company and money like unique industrial objective is dangerous in long term even if competition is weak currently. Quality (playfield) and creativity lowering, price increasing, some remade to earn easy money, are some telling signs.
    But Competition is organized, they are more numerous and all the money they earn doesn't go in Stern pocket.

    #274 7 years ago

    Lesson from this thread: If you want a thread with awesome responses, make sure to use a title that riles people up.

    #275 7 years ago
    Quoted from dmbjunky:

    Lesson from this thread: If you want a thread with awesome responses, make sure to use a title that riles people up.

    You could've learned that lesson on 4chan

    #276 7 years ago

    Just a final thought for interested parties.

    If there was another actual "major war", pinball would be significantly effected both in materials and construction. Even potential apportionment and redirection of manufacturers for war support as has occurred in the past. It might even stop. Parts suppliers are also effected. Afterwords, you see a return of the industry.
    It is cyclic.

    Think about it.
    It is one of the most exciting things about pinball.
    People repeatedly have kept saying it was "dead" over the past 60 years alone, but it keeps coming back reinventing itself for new generations?
    Intriguing, if you watch it long enough.
    I personally have heard the following quote quite few times since the 1980s, "Wow, when did they start making these things for real?"

    Historically pinball sales, if available, generally do poorly during extended war periods (the TFGW was very short but provided economic benefits), even though there is growth for GNPs. This does occur every 10-15 years in world history.
    Stick around and watch what happens, watch political developments, global crisis, economy changes as it affects this particular niche entertainment industry.

    However, In order for major war impacts to occur in full bloom in effecting the United States and the pinball industry, it would have to be conventional, which is today is quite rare, as no one wants the long term collateral impacts.

    What really is the largest area hurting the pinball industry more than any other right now?
    Manufacturers failing to fulfill responsibilities, expectations, or features and new potential owners that trust them exclusively on their word.

    #277 7 years ago
    Quoted from dmbjunky:

    Lesson from this thread: If you want a thread with awesome responses, make sure to use a title that riles people up.

    Or if you want >75 downvotes on a single post.

    #278 7 years ago
    Quoted from DerGoetz:

    No it was not. OP is trying to rid himself of the drama. Which wound be a shame - thread of the week so far

    Take it however you'd like. Hopefully im not the only one smiling over this thread.

    Quoted from dmbjunky:

    Lesson from this thread: If you want a thread with awesome responses, make sure to use a title that riles people up.

    Hell of a title, eh.

    Quoted from dzoomer:

    Or if you want >75 downvotes on a single post.

    Didn't expect that many. Ah well. Don't really care.

    Quoted from xTheBlackKnightx:

    Just a final thought for interested parties.
    If there was another actual "major war", pinball would be majorly effected both in materials and construction. Even potential apportionment and redirection of manufacturers for war support as has occurred in the past. It might even stop. Parts suppliers are also effected.
    Historically pinball sales, if available, generally do poorly during extended war periods (the TFGW was very short but provided economic benefits), even though there is growth for GNPs. This does occur every 10-15 years in world history.
    However, I order for this to occur in full bloom in effecting the United States, it would have to be conventional, which is today is quite rare.

    Thank you xTheBlackKnightx I really enjoyed your posts the most. I actually learned a thing or two along the way.

    #279 7 years ago

    Was it Frax that made that Pinside dick of the day shirt?
    Just wondering if that's available in a week--month--year dry erase/velcro model.

    #280 7 years ago
    Quoted from Luckydogg420:

    Hell of a title, eh.

    I up voted you just because you typed out eh. Made me chuckle.

    #281 7 years ago

    I forgot about the man bun. If you wear one, are you for or against Stearn?

    #282 7 years ago

    Hilton wanna make 10 easy dollars for 1 hour of your time to be on a talk radio show?

    #283 7 years ago
    Quoted from DBLM:

    I forgot about the man bun. If you wear one, are you for or against Stearn?

    For Stern.

    #284 7 years ago
    Quoted from DBLM:

    I forgot about the man bun. If you wear one, are you for or against Stearn?

    Well shit, I messed up then.

    #285 7 years ago
    Quoted from Astropin:

    Well shit, I messed up then.

    It's cool, you can always cut the man bun off. No harm, no foul.

    #286 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    If a company develops a platform for building homebrews, it would pretty much tank the opposite of that model, which is basically Stern from what I can gather.

    Sounds like the P3, no?

    #287 7 years ago
    Quoted from Law:

    Sounds like the P3, no?

    Thought so originally, but upon seeing it, their mods are higher level. I was thinking lower level standardization and end-user ease of use for modification.

    I sent the following to a friend of mine who is more into all the IT stuff than I am. (Don't feel like reformulating my thoughts for this audience)

    "Well, like right now on new and old machines, you pull up the playfield and it's a ton of wires that are all like analog electronics back to circuit boards and lights and junk. But it seems to me like in this age, you should just be able to go to a hobby store, buy a cabinet/playfield kit that's the wood with grid marks on it, buy some packs of bumpers, targets, lights, spinners, flippers, etc., go home, open up an app on your phone, drag and drop all the various parts onto a virtual snap-to grid playfield, cut/drill the holes on the actual playfield where the virtual one's snap-to grid, screw the parts on from the bottom, plug in USB cables into each part (instead of the 5 million analog wires) and then into the designated USB hub attached to the small box inside the cabinet that main power supplies to and has the memory/cpu junk, get back on the phone app and set score values and rules and such, xfer from phone via Bluetooth to the pinball box, and then start playing and modifying your scoring and rules and such as you go.

    Could just print out art to stick on the crap via online service or a special printer.

    But like $150 for the main kit materials, a few hundred more for the playfield parts, usb cords, a few hundred more for the control box, a free app, a couple days on the weekend to assemble, and you have your own custom pinball machine.

    Like... simplified, end-user based, standardized parts and game software, so you can make your own custom one for cheap."

    #288 7 years ago

    New video posted by Stern, they look very busy. could do with more cabinets, assembled playfield lying around all over the place.

    #289 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    But like $150 for the main kit materials, a few hundred more for the playfield parts, usb cords, a few hundred more for the control box, a free app, a couple days on the weekend to assemble, and you have your own custom pinball machine

    The P-Roc and P3-Roc hardware are really as close as you're going to get to that, for now anyways. The P3 platform with customizable slide-in assemblies and a rear module that you can customize on a work bench, plus an open software developer kit sounds pretty close to what you're asking for as well, or at least the closest that actually exists at this time. In the future, who knows?

    USB sounds friendly but realistically it probably isn't going to work in an environment with any kind of EM interference and suffers from latency and addressing issues. 10 or 20 USB cables going back to some kind of hub sounds no bueno to me. No matter what you do you're also still going to need to deal with power supplies and driver circuits too, so you're back to these "analog wires".

    #290 7 years ago
    Quoted from Law:

    The P-Roc and P3-Roc hardware are really as close as you're going to get to that, for now anyways. The P3 platform with customizable slide-in assemblies and a rear module that you can customize on a work bench, plus an open software developer kit sounds pretty close to what you're asking for as well, or at least the closest that actually exists at this time. In the future, who knows?
    USB sounds friendly but realistically it probably isn't going to work in an environment with any kind of EM interference and suffers from latency and addressing issues. 10 or 20 USB cables going back to some kind of hub sounds no bueno to me. No matter what you do you're also still going to need to deal with power supplies and driver circuits too, so you're back to these "analog wires".

    The upper playfield mod drop-ins seems like "meh... close but no cigar" to me, but, as you say, they may end up developing deeper.

    The USB seems like it would work to me. You'd just have to make sure all the stuff had adequate supports/suspensions. If they break after a while? Cords are cheap, and standardized parts would be cheap enough probably. They supply power, so they have the capabilities for that. The bunch of USB cords would just rely on building the hub capable of handling it to send a singular stream from there to the control box, which would basically be a mass manufacturered mini computer in a box specifically designed for such. Have like say 10 USBs per hub, a power cord for hub, an Ethernet between hub and control box, and potentially a few different tiers of control boxes that could handle more Ethernet connections to more than just one hub for an increase in price.

    Not really sure why it wouldn't be able to be done. All sorts of other stuff is computerized. Currently, pinball machines are just giant custom computers. Surely there's a way to localize the computing and have peripherals for the inputs/outputs. P3 already has one peripheral.

    For the software, I was thinking of RAD software. Most tech companies at some point develop software that people can learn to use within a day or so that does all the lower level programming work for them. Seems kinda goofy to be making pinball machines for decades and programming each one from actual programming language.

    #291 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    Thought so originally, but upon seeing it, their mods are higher level. I was thinking lower level standardization and end-user ease of use for modification.
    I sent the following to a friend of mine who is more into all the IT stuff than I am. (Don't feel like reformulating my thoughts for this audience)
    "Well, like right now on new and old machines, you pull up the playfield and it's a ton of wires that are all like analog electronics back to circuit boards and lights and junk. But it seems to me like in this age, you should just be able to go to a hobby store, buy a cabinet/playfield kit that's the wood with grid marks on it, buy some packs of bumpers, targets, lights, spinners, flippers, etc., go home, open up an app on your phone, drag and drop all the various parts onto a virtual snap-to grid playfield, cut/drill the holes on the actual playfield where the virtual one's snap-to grid, screw the parts on from the bottom, plug in USB cables into each part (instead of the 5 million analog wires) and then into the designated USB hub attached to the small box inside the cabinet that main power supplies to and has the memory/cpu junk, get back on the phone app and set score values and rules and such, xfer from phone via Bluetooth to the pinball box, and then start playing and modifying your scoring and rules and such as you go.
    Could just print out art to stick on the crap via online service or a special printer.
    But like $150 for the main kit materials, a few hundred more for the playfield parts, usb cords, a few hundred more for the control box, a free app, a couple days on the weekend to assemble, and you have your own custom pinball machine.
    Like... simplified, end-user based, standardized parts and game software, so you can make your own custom one for cheap."

    Your prices are crazy low!!!
    Even a cardboard pinball DIY starts at $50: http://makezine.com/2016/02/09/building-pinbox-3000-cardboard-pinball-machine/

    #292 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    The USB seems like it would work to me. You'd just have to make sure all the stuff had adequate supports/suspensions. If they break after a while? Cords are cheap, and standardized parts would be cheap enough probably. They supply power, so they have the capabilities for that. The bunch of USB cords would just rely on building the hub capable of handling it to send a singular stream from there to the control box, which would basically be a mass manufacturered mini computer in a box specifically designed for such. Have like say 10 USBs per hub, a power cord for hub, an Ethernet between hub and control box, and potentially a few different tiers of control boxes that could handle more Ethernet connections to more than just one hub for an increase in price.

    USB 3.0 supplies maximum 900 milliamps (.9A)per port. Flipper drive power for one flipper is usually 4A+ at 40-50V. Not even the same ballpark.

    Even with a separate power supply, USB does not work reliably in environments with fluctuating magnetic fields (such as inside pinball machines).

    I agree that it's a cool idea, it'd be awesome to see a plug-and-play platform.

    #293 7 years ago
    Quoted from Law:

    USB 3.0 supplies maximum 900 milliamps (.9A)per port. Flipper drive power for one flipper is going to be ~35A at that voltage if it'll even work. Not even the same ballpark.
    Even with a separate power supply, USB does not work reliably in environments with fluctuating magnetic fields (such as inside pinball machines).
    I agree that it's a cool idea, it'd be awesome to see a plug-and-play platform.

    Ah, so what do fluctuating metal fields stuff use for data?

    #294 7 years ago

    Understand where you are coming from but as we have seen with JPOP, SKIT-B, and every other company out there, building pinball is hard. Very hard. You have physics, physical construction, wiring, logic programming, safety, etc to all accommodate for. Most people would not have the ability to do even a little bit of what is involved and those that do (Rosh, guy that build Total Annihilation), etc have spent tons of money and time building these things. i don't think you will ever get to the point where you can grab pieces and put them together like "little bits" and some of the other plug and play modules out there.

    #295 7 years ago
    Quoted from Jeremy8419:

    Ah, so what do fluctuating metal fields stuff use for data?

    Dedicated wiring for things like cars, boats, and aircraft, all of which have fluctuating magnetic fields.

    #296 7 years ago
    Quoted from T7:

    Your prices are crazy low!!!
    Even a cardboard pinball DIY starts at $50: http://makezine.com/2016/02/09/building-pinbox-3000-cardboard-pinball-machine/

    Crazy low for what? The existing market of pinball?

    Cool link.

    #297 7 years ago
    Quoted from DBLM:

    Understand where you are coming from but as we have seen with JPOP, SKIT-B, and every other company out there, building pinball is hard. Very hard. You have physics, physical construction, wiring, logic programming, safety, etc to all accommodate for. Most people would not have the ability to do even a little bit of what is involved and those that do (Rosh, guy that build Total Annihilation), etc have spent tons of money and time building these things. i don't think you will ever get to the point where you can grab pieces and put them together like "little bits" and some of the other plug and play modules out there.

    Quoted from DBLM:

    Dedicated wiring for things like cars, boats, and aircraft, all of which have fluctuating magnetic fields.

    It does look hard, which is why I am thinking about the facilities of operation to make them easier to build lol. You know? Like SS from EM.

    Hmmmm.... hmmmmmmmmm....

    How about fiber optics?

    #299 7 years ago

    I think we are way off topic on this....

    -1
    #300 7 years ago

    Not if it tanks Stern lol

    There are 303 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 7.

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