(Topic ID: 49168)

Who do you have to bribe these days to get someone to publish a rulesheet?

By alveolus

11 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 64 posts
  • 28 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 years ago by Don1
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

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There are 64 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 2.
#51 10 years ago
Quoted from Geocab:

This may be a silly question, but why aren't there already rulesheets made for ALL tables that have been released by the creators of the tables themselves? Why do all we get are what's printed on the apron cards?

There are instruction cards, rudimentary rules in the manual, and Williams had basic rules on at least their WPC-95 games which are still kept at Planetary Pinball. I know of no other "official" source of rules beyond that. Anyone know of anything else?

#52 10 years ago

That's what I'm asking, why is all that is released are “basic" rules?

#53 10 years ago

I understand your desire to want to know all the rules and nuances of a game. I'm the same way -- you'll see me frequently in rules discussion threads.

But I'm glad Stern doesn't publish the rules when the games are released, or after updating. Part of the fun is discovering the rules while playing the game, and then discussing it with others or watching others discover/use rule nuances of which you weren't aware.

Further, if you're a business/manufacturer, and your customer base already has an established community that documents/discusses the rules (albeit sometimes disjointed and difficult to see them all in one place), would you want to have employees spend time ($$$) producing a rule sheet?

The disjointed nature of various aspects of the rules being contained in different resources/threads also supports players primarily learning the rules as they play, and only using the interwebs to supplement that learning.

Last, PAPA / pinball.org / pinballnews.com already do a very good job of publishing gameplay/rules/video/commentary on all new games. Even the commentary of tournament videos -- while not formally "tutorials" -- contain nuggets of wisdom on how to play the game and/or how to play the game in a competitive setting.

#54 10 years ago
Quoted from Snailman:

would you want to have employees spend time ($$$) producing a rule sheet?

The programmer already does this,right?

#55 10 years ago
Quoted from Snailman:

I understand your desire to want to know all the rules and nuances of a game. I'm the same way -- you'll see me frequently in rules discussion threads.
But I'm glad Stern doesn't publish the rules when the games are released, or after updating. Part of the fun is discovering the rules while playing the game, and then discussing it with others or watching others discover/use rule nuances of which you weren't aware.
Further, if you're a business/manufacturer, and your customer base already has an established community that documents/discusses the rules (albeit sometimes disjointed and difficult to see them all in one place), would you want to have employees spend time ($$$) producing a rule sheet?
The disjointed nature of various aspects of the rules being contained in different resources/threads also supports players primarily learning the rules as they play, and only using the interwebs to supplement that learning.
Last, PAPA / pinball.org / pinballnews.com already do a very good job of publishing gameplay/rules/video/commentary on all new games. Even the commentary of tournament videos -- while not formally "tutorials" -- contain nuggets of wisdom on how to play the game and/or how to play the game in a competitive setting.

I find playing a machine much more fun if I know what the hell I'm doing. Trying to comprehend the rules while trying to keep the ball in play is not easy at all, and I don't find it that much fun, personally. Particularly if your also paying for the learning curve on location.

Some of us just want the rule sheets, and I will continue to try and facilitate that. I am going to try to consolidate the campaign again, so please look for the new thread.

Shawn

#56 10 years ago
Quoted from analogprincess:

POP rep here. We take paypal (follow the donate button on pinballoutreach.org) or if you want to mail a check we get 100% of the $ that way.
I'm happy to manage the donations and let you guys know when the goal has been met. If it's not met I'm also happy to refund.
Brilliant idea here guys

PM and e-mail sent

#58 10 years ago
Quoted from alveolus:

Also, don't get me wrong, I love the tutorial videos and watch them religiously. They are certainly complementary to a written rulesheet, but are not a replacement for one.

Nor is a rulesheet (or video tutorial) a replacement for playing a game.
I don't really see anything that important that can't be figured out through play.
Except song bonus, and that is covered already.
What do you really want to know?
VIP? Add-a-Ball?
Or do you just want to know about Encore?
I heard Lyman mention that he planned to do a rulesheet for this game (when finished), but that was some time ago, and he may be too busy programming all sterns games to do that now.
Play On!

#59 10 years ago
Quoted from DNO:

Nor is a rulesheet (or video tutorial) a replacement for playing a game.
I don't really see anything that important that can't be figured out through play.
Except song bonus, and that is covered already.
What do you really want to know?
VIP? Add-a-Ball?
Or do you just want to know about Encore?
I heard Lyman mention that he planned to do a rulesheet for this game (when finished), but that was some time ago, and he may be too busy programming all sterns games to do that now.
Play On!

Ha! Spoken like a true elite player!(which,of course, you are)

This is not AFM we're talking about. For average players like me with say, 40s ball times, how many plays do you suppose it would take to make sense of AC/DCs rules on basis of in-game trial-and-error alone, particularly with on-location play? My guess is several years worth. To me, that is just a lot of unnecessary frustration and missed opportunities for enjoyment. Just let us mere mortals have our rule sheets. I promise you will still kick my ass at the TPF every year

#60 10 years ago

If you're averaging under a minute ball times, even on a pro, a rulesheet ain't gonna help. AC/DC is littered with sucker shots. If you haven't learned those yet, learning the rules isn't going to help. Get your ball times up, then look at the rules.

I don't think an AC/DC rulesheet will be as helpful as say the TSPP rulesheet. Even if Bowen writes it. He's an awesome writer, but the nature of the game is very different than TSPP. Learning the rules on AC/DC won't be as advantageous as learning the rules on TSPP. Part of this is longer ball times on TSPP, but still, two very different beasts. I don't recommend anyone starts placing any bets based on any upcoming rulesheet.

#61 10 years ago
Quoted from phishrace:

If you're averaging under a minute ball times, even on a pro, a rulesheet ain't gonna help.

Point conceded. I was mostly trying to illustrate the difference between Donovan tackling a pinball machine and us normal folks.

Otherwise I strongly disagree with your point about TSPP. That game's rules are much more straight-forward and intuitive, as complex as they are. AC/DC is a new and entirely original beast. Reading through that long rules thread still has my head spinning.

#62 10 years ago

Well, good luck with the rulesheet fund.
In the meantime, just try different strategies and try to find one that works for you to get higher scores.
Lots of different players use different strats. when playing AC/DC, but they all kinda lead to the same thing, big song jackpots and kicking it's ass!
When the rules come out, you may then feel tied to a way of playing the game that might not really be your style, and results in lower scores.
Wouldn't that be a kick in the pinballs?

#63 10 years ago

Seems like we all just need to take up a collection & send it to KME for a add on or disc 2 to pinball 102 exclusively dedicated to ACDC. I'd love to have seen the rest of that 1.4 bil ball 1 game.

#64 10 years ago

Having a rulesheet simply to have better scores isn't the point. Pinball will continue to alienate new players as long as there exists a steep learning curve, why make it even steeper? You wouldn't suggest publishing zero rules for a game and telling people to just pay attention to the lights and sounds and figure it out because it's more fun that way

The programmers certainly have the rules recorded, though perhaps not in a nice format ready for public consumption. I think the reason we don't have them available is because the manufacturer's market is the operators not home users, and operators aren't pushing for lists of rules.

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