(Topic ID: 35049)

TECH: Generic Coil Question - *Fixed* thanks for the help!

By bdaily1983

11 years ago


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  • Latest reply 11 years ago by bdaily1983
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#1 11 years ago

Excuse me if this is a dumb question. I have a game where a couple coils won't fire. I took out all the fuses and they checked ok. I started checking controlling transistors and they seem okay as well. I looked at the coils that aren't firing and they don't seem to have a broken wires. I checked the resistance on the coils and they are 4 ohms. I next checked the power to the coils. They both have power (the outhole has 30V--I am concentrating on this one right now). I next turn on the game and short the ground lug to the ground braid on the inside of the cabinet and the coil will not fire. I also tried going into the diagnostics menu and doing the same thing...nothing. The coils don't work in game or through diagnostics test.

The game is DE TMNT.

Questions:
1. Can a coil ohm out "OK", have power, and still not work?
2. What the heck else should I do?

Thank you!

#2 11 years ago

Not a dumb question as the situation you describe doesn't seem to make sense to me either.

You have power at BOTH coil lugs (on the same coil), right? If you correctly measured the 4 ohms on the coil, then the answer has to be yes.

Try grounding the coil lug (with the non-banded side of the diode attached) to the backbox ground plane. It's possible that the braid in the cabinet is not connected to the games actual ground plane.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#3 11 years ago

Thanks for your reply Chris.

Quoted from ChrisHibler:

You have power at BOTH coil lugs (on the same coil), right?

yes I have power at both coil lugs on the same coil.

Quoted from ChrisHibler:

Try grounding the coil lug (with the non-banded side of the diode attached) to the backbox ground plane. It's possible that the braid in the cabinet is not connected to the games actual ground plane.

I didn't think about that. I will try it tonight when I get out of work. Thanks! Seems weird but I can short the ground lug on the slingshots to the braid inside the cabinet and they work fine...although they aren't on the same circuit.

Another weird thing, the manhole VUK coil which is powered by the same line as the outhole and trough works just fine in game and in diagnostics test.

#4 11 years ago

If grounding the non-banded side of a sling coil on the braid makes it fire, then grounding any coil to that braid should work. You may have something else going on, like a marginal solder connection to the coil on the non-banded side.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#5 11 years ago
Quoted from ChrisHibler:

You may have something else going on, like a marginal solder connection to the coil on the non-banded side.

Thanks. I'll reflow the solder tonight. If that doesn't work...I'm stumped Oh, another question...when grounding the ground lug on the coil, should I be disconnecting the corresponding connector to the transistor on the CPU? Seems like a long shot but maybe something goofy on the CPU is preventing me from pulling it down all the way?

#6 11 years ago

Nah...When you are grounding the non-banded side, you are simply providing a "short circuit" to ground, bypassing the normal "switch" that resides in the transistor.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#7 11 years ago

Ill have to check the outholes on my DE SW, but the launcher coil is at 72v. Whats the voltage on the ones you have working? Might be a bit low.

#8 11 years ago

Could be a problem too. I thought the outhole for tmnt was 32v. I'm getting around 30.

#9 11 years ago
Quoted from SiLeNtNiNjA1:

Ill have to check the outholes on my DE SW, but the launcher coil is at 72v. Whats the voltage on the ones you have working? Might be a bit low.

So now it's acting really funny. Didn't do anything else. I get a really varying voltage from 11-20 volts. Twice it "stabilized" to 34 but before I could test the coil it would drop. Reflow all solder on common power?

#10 11 years ago

Anybody have any suggestions? Seems like the voltage on the ppb varies a lot....so it seems the coils are.

#11 11 years ago

You have a power problem. Unloaded voltage on a coil should be 65-72V. Your voltage drop means there is a resistance somewhere in the wiring (nicked wire or lousy solder) or the power supply itself is faulty. You have voltage albeit low but when you ground there is not enough current to pull in the coil.

#12 11 years ago

I think the voltage on that particular coil should be 32v. Goes to j6 pin3 on ppb. Yeah def have a problem somewhere. Trying to find where on the ps that voltage comes from. Cn3 pin 5?

#13 11 years ago

Ok that was it. Wire was loose in connector. Thanks for all the replies everybody.

Now does anybody know if its common for f5 to blow on the ppb? It's the 50 volt line for the flippers.

#14 11 years ago

No, that's not common. Suspect the bridge rectifier.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#15 11 years ago

Thanks for the reply. This is a new rottendog board. You think one of the diodes dr1-4 is bad? I would have guessed I damaged one from a problem on a coil....however I don't know much about this board

#16 11 years ago

Oops. Well, don't know much about that one and don't have schematics. But yes, test those diodes.
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The new place for pinball repair info

#17 11 years ago

Will do thanks Chris.

#18 11 years ago

Anybody have a rottendog PPB? Looking at their site, a picture of the board shows the diodes that replace the bridge rectifier are band oriented the same. Wonder if there are different revs or is mine an error? Here is a picture of mine:

diode.JPGdiode.JPG

#19 11 years ago

ok yep. That diode is reversed. That should fix my problem. Thanks all for the help.

#20 11 years ago

I couldn't find a picture of sufficient resolution to prove that, but it sure does look like it. Did you find a good picture?
--
Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
http://www.Team-EM.com
http://webpages.charter.net/chibler/Pinball/index.htm
http://www.PinWiki.com - The Place to go for Pinball Repair Info

#21 11 years ago

I found a picture and ended up calling Jim at rottendog to confirm. Thanks for the help. Works great now

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