And throw in some of that nifty armor while your at it

If it's true that the LE is already sold out - and from what I hear it is - why should they?

They probably should have charged more in the first place.

Also throw in all the other upgrades/mods you will be selling for LE owners. And while your at it, throw in a second Pro model for free

Courtesy reach around should be included as well.

You must really like this title. Opting for the reach around vs the courtesy tea bagging. You heard it here first, Kiss LE, Centerflank approved.

So don't buy it

Stern won't include extra items such as a topper, a ColorDMD (should be a larger LCD at this point...), shaker motor and an invisiglass / PDI type glass until they see a drop in sales and people demanding more at the LE level. For $8k those items should be included in all Stern LE's.

An LE in should come with every option created for the game in my opinion.

Its a nice topper

The LE is already sold out. People spoke up, they'll pay for it as is. Why would they change a thing?

The LE is supposed to be the Crown Jewel....a notch above the Pro/Premium. For $1200-$1900 more the backglass, foil decals (whatever that means), number, and Gary's signature just don't add up for the differnece. At that price it should be signed by all 4 origianl members......that would set the LE apart from the Pro/Premium......The topper is the least they SHOULD include with the LE......the armor would be nice too and the LE buyers have already paid for it anyway........they could at least throw in a shaker but not really sure it fits the game play until I get to play it. I still give props to Stern for bringing us a new Kiss pin!

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Nothing more needed if they sell out that fast! Could have sold the balls separately.

Should have upped the number of LE's run I guess.

At this point, it's hard to argue with you (though the definition of "sold out" simply means distributors have purchased the games).

The collectors I've spoken with felt like I do...KISS LE wasn't very compelling when compared with the Premium. I think even throwing in a shaker would have improved the situation. Throwing in the topper or armor would have been even nicer.

I feel like LE's should sparkle (...even if they increase the price a tad). Let's face it, most collectors buying the LE have some money to burn. If they don't, why bother?

My 2$

They should also ship their games in less han 2 years after you pay for them.....

Oh wait a second.

People are also paying for time. To get it earlier. The premium scheduled shipping date is, I think, September? Please correct me if I'm wrong on that.

You're not wrong, but it sounds like they're pretty difficult to find with distributors now too.

Way too far off.
They usually run about 400-500 pros, then do the LEs. Then another 100 or whatever demand is for the pros and then premium. SO it's true that they are kind of last to get made, but probably early august would be my best guess when premiums start shipping.

THe upside to that is any mods the LE needed will be installed on the premiums from the factory [looking at you bicycle girl ramp] AND it gives you a chance to play one before you decide to buy it.

I was told my LE should ship by the end of June. It should have had upgraded armor!

Highly doubt your le ships at the end of June. They are starting the premiums in July.

As for the topper or any of the other mods being offered by stern and if they should be included, what gives anyone the right to say that?

First of all, the price we pay for a game is irrelevant to what should be included with the game. Why is this always brought up?

Second, extras are not included for free with any other purchases we make in our lives so why does it apply here? That is why they are called extras or mods.

Finally, what's included is very clear, if you don't like it that don't buy the game and shut up already. How many times are people going to bitch about shakers, invisiglass, lcd, toppers, blades, etc? They are NOT included in the games, you don't get to decide what is included. If you don't like it purchase a pin from one of the other manufacturers. Seriously people, shut up about the extras, they will not be included, thus the term extras.

FYI, kiss le sold out in 7 mins.

Sounds like you are willing to step in if Stern can't deliver.

That's what I did for TWD. Ordered an LE...then Stern came out with their mods and side armor not included in my 8k purchase...I cancelled.

It's the first Borg LE I didn't buy...Kiss will be the second

Really...
Try here (Or any other distributor)
http://gameexchange.biz/collections/new-stern-pinball-free-shipping-special/products/kiss-pinball-limited-depoit

Maybe you're thinking Metallica LE?

Just fork out the cash for a stupid topper or dont. I did for my TWD,& still wonder what I was thinking?! Stern has,& never will give stuff like this away. They're in it to make $,not play games. No pun intended.

like Aurich said they sold out, why lose money on the table and give it away. If you have 8k for a pin, you've got $400 for a topper. That's probably what Gary is thinking. Is he wrong?

With Stern to stingy to include a manual with a Pro, there's no way they would include a topper on a L.E. Like someone said, I'm surprised they aren't charging extra for the balls.

Bingo. There needs to be more included to justify the $1200-$1900 over the premium. For that price including a ColorDMD, topper and shaker motor makes sense as everything on the playfield between the premium and LE are already the same. I bet Stern is making more profit on the LE's then the pro's / premiums.

The two substantial extra's on the LE that are nice over the premium are the foil decals and mirrored back glass. Are those two items worth $1200-$1900. No way. Maybe those two items cost Stern $400 so they are making maybe $1500 profit off the extra price of the LE alone. How much would a ColorDMD, topper and shaker motor cost Stern? $600? Fine. So they are still making $500 in profit from the LE price increase over the premium alone.

The game looks amazing, looks fun but I think Stern does not justify their LE prices with enough features.

I would, but he still owes me for the last one

Yep, and the artwork on the back glass isn't even unique. I just couldn't justify wasting the money. It's all about the license and the low build number. IIRC they are building 600? And I've heard Gene Simmons took 100 of them?

Agree Panzer. With this release, i'll get a premium [if I really love the play] and put whatever color armor I want on it. Couldn't care less about the backglass mirror. TWD LE's isn't that great anyway. Same for the decals. True that IMVE and mustang LE cabinets look really sweet with the metal/foil look, but the only part of the cabinet you really ever see in my lineup is the front anyway. Even after changing the armor I'm still saving roughly $1k over the LE and to me that makes it a better choice.
if you're a diehard kiss fan [i'm not] I can totally see getting an LE though. just don't buy one thinking it's the next ACDC BIBLE and will go crazy in value.

Obviously we all want more stuff for our $, but why would Stern want to give away something that they're producing in order to make more money?
Ridiculous thread. You might as well just ask for a lower price.

My only beef that's of a similar nature is that the LE should have the upgraded armour. Seems like a massive waste if you buy an LE, then remove it to pay for the "upgrade". At the very least, it would be nice if you could trade up or something so that you don't pay to own an extra set of pieces that sit somewhere, gathering dust.

The le sold out in 7 mins. It's a fact. I can't seem to understand why you guys don't realize that to stern it is considered sold out when all of the games available were purchased by their distributors in 7 mins. Of course the distributors still have some available, but as far as the manufacturer is considered, they are sold out.

In today's Pinball world, anybody that buys an LE thinking its going to to be the next Ac/dc Bible is going to be really disappointed, and why would you want that anyhow? I think there were 200 LTBR's and 300 BIBLE's and you can usually pick one up at prices that are falling today and will be lower in the future.

600, if that's the number is not "limited". You can slap a plaque on it and call it limited all day but its not. If you just like the style better and don't care about the money, then go for it.

I bought my TWD LE because I was told it was highly unlikely that Stern was going to make a premium version. Oh well, I'd much rather have the premium but I love the pin anyhow!

As for the topper, to think it should be included with the pin makes zero sense. If Stern can sell 500 of them at $400 a pop, why not?

Btw, I bought the very cool TWD topper for $400, my conclusion is while it looks great, its not worth it and yes it has all the color changing and pin interaction capabilities as well. Guess what? Stern hasn't coded much into it.

I love Borg games, and can't wait to play it, but the video looks less than inspiring to me as far as gameplay but I'm sure the "fan" fanatics will love it.

"Requires" the purchase of a topper??

I haven't bought a topper in 2 years.

These threads make me laugh.

LE buyers don't care about value, or software or gameplay, or frankly much of ANYTHING except getting the title they like and get it first.....

Stern laughs all the way to bank when it comes to this segment of their customer base.

Doubt they are laughing at the people giving them a paycheck.

Of course they are!

On one hand you have people complaining about Stern serving up incomplete software and other complaints, but then you have this group of "shutupandtakemymoney" buyers that trip over each other and can't spend their money fast enough.

They also love these guys because they add a couple hundred of bucks into the BOM and they make it up about 4-5x. Sorry, but these are the buyers you laugh about- just not to their faces....

You are right I'm buying the KISS topper to display, it should come with the pinball

They may as well not include them. How many people use Stern balls? I certainly don't. All my NIB games get Pinball Life premium ultra-gloss.

I'm just laughing at you because your trolling.

Hahaha toooo funny.
What makes people think that we could get a free topper with the Kizz LE,
when we cannot even get decent mirror balls or even decent balls fullstop with a new STERN machine..

Hopefully we'll at least get a Stern T-shirt with our KISS LE purchase like we did with our Metallica LEs. That's as good as a topper...isn't it?

300 Stay in the states
200 Go overseas
100 Went to Kiss to be customized and sold through the KISS catalog
60 addtl German version

Pretty low number here in the states.

So Stern moved 560 units in 7 minutes....pretty damn impressive

Let's face it. Stern has realized things have changed. Operators used to be the market. Now the home/collector market has become big enough and aftermarket mods are popular. It only makes sense they capitalize on it since they have the license to do it. There are few mods that will not have licensing/copyright infringement so don't expect to see a ton of mods with the likeness of Kiss or logos. People that make one offs for themselves will be fine. Stern is a business and they are here to make money like any other business. By making aftermarket mods that fit pros and premiums they can sell as many as people will buy. The LE was a good idea but profit is limited by the number set to make. Why would any company limit their profits??? This could be the death of the LE altogether..........

Exactly.

I am so used to just using the pinballs from PBL that it's been years since I've even looked at the stock Stern balls as I don't even open the package. Are they still the same crap? I have a new set sitting in the coin box of my TWD Premium.

Ditto!

You bought it without the armor so blame yourself as to why they didnt include it.

Quoted for the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

Same crap as of a year ago at least. Instant toss and replace.

And yet I'll be able to find one tomorrow, next month and for the foreseeable future, at lower prices than today, imo.

It's the same story, again. I'll take a premium if its any good and I'll wait until I play it and the code is close to being finished.

I have to give credit to Lyman and Stern for getting TWD updated finally. I doubt it was a coincidence with the release of Kiss. Because TWD is so good I'd consider buying a premium with Kiss after I play it.

Damn Stern for giving us the option to buy a pro a premium or a limited edition.