are we now even for the medieval madness remake? Plenty of guys in the US that have yet to receive their WOZ

Nice rant. No idea what you're talking about.

Does anyone know how many WOZ Bumper ordered and how many they paid for ? JAck has been known to trust distributors... Dont hang him here quite yet.. It may not be a easy as you think to sort this out... I will BET bumper did NOT send Jack all the cash... Why did Jack ask for money up front?? To BUY parts to make machines?? could be.. He had quite a bit of start up cost just to set up a factory

Can't you keep this to the other bumper thread?

Narrowing your base of support is a good idea?

This is the first that I've heard of people not getting money back from JJP if they've asked for it.

Troll thread? New user.

Don't be surprised if you get attitude. New user. First post. Heavy Rant. Many of us know ZERO of what your talking about and your posts so far did not tell much of a story. Very broken up. Maybe just call Jack. He's always been great so far. Good luck.

I think you need to drive down to your local distributor, or whoever you handed your hard earned $ to in good faith, & have a heart to heart with them. I don't see any good coming from this rant on this forum. Just my $.02

Then you need to take legal action against the distributor you paid $ to. JJP is not involved.
That's like saying Ford Motor Company owes you $ because your local car dealer screwed you over.

LJ, who did you pay the $$$ to, isn't that the guy that you have recourse against, what is the resolution that you are asking for specifically?

Sorry, but read your own posts above.........

Ask yourself, "What would Batman do?".........You cannot always wait for justice.........It doesn't always come, you need to take the matter into your own hands........Bring on the "Batman" justice.

And this is a rational way to respond to us? Do you realize that most of us in the US who have ordered games do not have them yet? I hope you can work out your issues with the distributor. We are not the enemy, just as Jack is not the enemy either.

For those wondering what he is talking about it is in this thread.

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bumper-action-amusements-pty-ltd-in-liquidation/page/11#post-1076140

There is a lot of he said - he said going on down under right now. We will probably know more soon, we hope.

LT, you are telling us you are one that is involved and want others to post their info. I do not see yours. You might get a better response if you post your info that you are asking others to post.

And whom should they get in contact with ?

I'm not well versed in Australian law. I would think the distributor has been involved with a legal body of some sort, and that would be who claims should be made to.

So who exactly should anyone who paid the distributor, get in touch with ?

Thank you.

LTG : )

It seems to me this is the PERFECT place for the aussies to do this. Kudos for speaking up. We need a record of what happened as this could be the largest scandal in pinball history.

AussieArcade apparently will not allow free discussion of this topic, extending to lifetime bans for merely posting about it on that forum.

They need a spot to talk about this, Pinside is perfect. So - speak on brother and get your friends, we want to see how deep the rabbit hole goes.

edit:My bet is a lot of buyers thought they were buying from JJP. Caveat Emptor? Sure but for the whole Australian market to get screwed seems like a crisis for the manufacturer as well as the customers. IMHO

Its a terrible situation for all the guys who have not only waited all that time, but now have this big scare to deal with. I hope it is resolved and all the Aussies and Jack can hopefully find a win-win for everyone.

Not quite sure what your trying to accomplish by attacking JJP. He can't control what a business does, nor doesn't do. You didn't pay JJP a dime. So, why does he own you something? He trusted the dealer and so did you by buying it threw them. Still trying to figure out why Jack is at fault?

He added info, it is not directed at JJP. It is a call for the old Bumper customers to try and make contact to try and get details.

Nothing wrong with that. I totally understand being ticked off. I would be very upset and hope they get their money back and stick the guy to the wall who did this. I just see allot of post that blame JJP and I just do not get that part.

Seems like a dig at Jack to me.

From who?

I've been following the Bumper thread and I'm certainly no expert on the deal but I think the summary goes something like this:

An estimated 73 customers in Australia placed orders with Bumper Amusements for Wizard of OZ machines. Now supposedly this distributor only sent forward $100,000 initially and then $50,000 as a secondary payment to JJP. So if I follow all of it, $150,000 has been paid to JJP for WOZ product. Assuming those were all early purchases of ECLE WOZ at $6,500, that covers only 23 machines.

Supposedly, Bumper Amusements was keeping the *rest* of the money in some sort of a trust fund as they "felt safer keeping it in Australia than with JJP".

Then Bumper Amusements goes out of business, kaput. Sells some part of itsself to the former general manager of Bumper who then creates a new company, named almost identical, as Bumper something or other. (yeah, it smells pretty damn fishy).

Jersey Jack (according to the new Bumper) has dropped them as a JJP distributor. (not sure if this is true or not either)

No one seems to know the status of the rest of the customer's money that was paid for WOZ product. Not even sure if JJP ever got any of the end-customer's information so not sure if they even know *who* the machines were bought by.

So the $325,000 question seems to be where's the rest of the end customer's WOZ purchase money.

Quite the quandry as JJP has been paid for 23 machines but jeez, does *anyone* trust anything to do with Bumper old or new to send the machines to THEM and let them dole them out?

Hopefully the original customer's info can reach JJP and all of this mess can be converted into direct purchases from JJP, assuming that someone can find the rest of the money that Bumper whatever has/had.

Global preorders fully paid 3 years in advance will result in casualties.

The lifespan of a business is certainly finite.

OP best of luck in your attempts to collect what is yours. Seems to me the Distro took your money & that's your enemy to square up with unless he sent some of that money to JJP.

If JJP received payment for your game via some Aussie entity no longer in existence perhaps you stand a chance in recovering a % of your money.

Sounds like a legal mess for JJP, you & etc however.

Best of luck man

Holy cow, talk about a Clusterf*ck!

To be quite honest, each and every Aussie that was involved in this needs to get in touch with JJP, forward any and all info/paperwork they have to help prove what part they had in this. Posting on an independant forum like this may feel helpful, but putting the end customers in direct contact with JJP is going to accomplish a lot more.

Thanks for the summary Gary, what a mess, that's terrible, sounds like the "trust fund" money is gone......

I was unaware. Holy shit! I'd be calling dateline ASAP.

From the OP.

Surely you (several posts up) see how this will affect JJP (or insert name of any manufacturer of anything) ? Blame does not really matter, if 70 people plus, or the bulk of Australia gets screwed out of their order that would be MAJOR news for pinball. If you were an aussie buyer and lost 8k plus, would you ever buy again?

But surely all this is still speculation? Is there any hard evidence that prepaid buyers will not get their machines? Have they come down with some sort of ruling or something that says only 26 machines were paid for? and now the rest of the buyers are SOL? last i checked they were still deciding.

Well see that's part of the problem, the new Bumper is telling people everything is fine, no worries, relax. ;(

If this is for customers down in Australia how come this thread isn't on the Australian pinball forum? I know that there are users from all over the world on this forum but it seems to me that most pinball enthusiasts from Australia who are on Pinside would also be on the Australian pinball forum.

Well here is another problem for the legal experts.

If ( and I don't know if happened ) JJP was paid money. Who ever is dealing with the legal side in Australia. They might want the money back to pay off other issues. And not games.

This stuff is best left to the experts. And anyone in Australia that paid a distributor for a game, should be seeking legal help and going after who ever is dealing with the distributor's assets in Australia.

And the original poster hasn't provided info yet who anyone concerned should contact.

LTG : )

That sounds like a good plan. Good luck with getting what you paid for. Sorry it went down this way but I know if Jack can do anything he will. He's a great guy and I know is not happy about what has expired.

If this goes down I am NEVER prepaying for a machine again. Except for the 6 I already...CRAP

Agreed completely. It gets even more obscure because the business law of Australia is seemingly quite different from the US. They (The new Bumper) is trying to say that it's common business practice to essentially dissolve an old business, selling the assets to a new business, (operating under almost the same exact name) while being able to dump all or most of their liabilities.

Sounds like a load of BS to me.

Anyway, I really feel for any Aussie that ordered a machine through Bumper. I certainly hope that they don't all get screwed over but "I've got a bad feeling about this".

Just a reminder everyone, Pinside is not a court of law:

I do not pretend to speak for Robin but I am not sure he would want Pinside to be the rallying center for a dispute between collectors and JJP.

I assume that the people who bought from Bumper have a voice on the JJP WOZ forum that he hosts. I would suggest people inquire there first before spreading any panic or discontent here. That is just my suggestion, I am not weighing in on the matter as I do not know Robin's view on this point at this moment and it is 5am his time.

Thank you.

If this is for customers down in Australia how come this thread isn't on the Australian pinball forum? I know that there are users from all over the world on this forum but it seems to me that most pinball enthusiasts from Australia who are on Pinside would also be on the Australian pinball forum.

Apparently this Bumper company is a significant sponsor of the Australian Pinball forums. They are supposedly killing all threads about this issue over there and giving users a lifetime ban for talking about it.

Supposedly.

It's hard to tell what's true and what isn't from this great a distance but the BS meter is off the dial on this one...

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