Rich & his family & crew always do a great job with this show! And how about the fact that we made it through a York Show without any rain! All it took was to move everyone inside - kind of crazy how things work out in life isn't it.

Rich - I'll PM you sometime down the road once you recover from all the hard work that went into making another great show happen. Thanks again to you and your family for doing all this work year after year!

Some photos from the show.

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Man, these shows get me confused......yes you're right. Can't beat $350!!! That price must've been dropped by Saturday - I was there Friday.

Great deal with a little TLC to playfield, I'm always loving those older Sterns - simple but fun!!!

There where 2 there, Mine was only $450, not $350, I sold it for $400 on saturday late, I could not believe it lasted that long, wanted to pass along a cheap machine for a hopefully first time buyer, playfield was rough but electronics were solid, even put in NVRAM. and the guys that bought it haggled with me over 10 text's to get me down to $375, I said Hell no go find a working SS pin here for 400 , and they finally bought it, worst sale I ever made, but kept a smile on the whole time

I believe it.
Its really a buyers market at these shows.
Put a good price on a FS and they still haggle.

if you don't say firm on the price tag, they're going to haggle. they probably will even if you do, but at least it's easier to say no then.

I had a great time at the show this year. Great job by Rich and co! Many thanks to the Pincrossing crew for organizing a great tournament!

I got there shortly after 9 on Saturday and didn't have to wait long to play Alien and Total Nuclear Annihilation. TNA is the better pin of the two.

Your welcome and it was a pleasure to meet you also, I wish the time hadn't been so short to chat more. I will definitely tell him, he's been a good friend and great help to me.

And the nicer BG you swapped out of the one I picked up!
Scott

I had something really weird happen at the York show. I wrapped a pinball machine and put a new translite in it. And Saturday we sold a game from the free play area and replaced it with the new wrapped machine from our flea market area. Then later my son finds a flyer had been placed on our my machine from tilt graphics like they made the graphics and were selling them. He took it off of course and actually ripped it apart because my son was proud of the work we had done but, I just thought what a bad way to get business. My number was on the machine if they needed to talk to me.

Jose and Rey were at the Cointaker booth on Saturday but they weren't promoting beyond the flyers they set out on the table in the foyer because they didn't have a booth and also didn't bring anything to sell - only preorders. I don't know but I feel like I can safely say somebody just left their litter on your machine.

I would probably say someone just left it there. Not thinking anything about it. Wouldn't get too worked up about it.

I hope you are right about someone just leaving it after playing, because we have never had any negative experience with any of the shows we attend, Allentown, Louisville, and York, and hopefully Nashville in November.

Also the title of the Eazy-E EP containing this song:

Thanks to everyone that came to the show, brought games, helped us out or was a vendor at the show. I am still waiting on some bills to arrive before making the decision on what dates and hall the show will be in for next year. There was enough games in the hall that had we been in the Old Main Hall, we would have had to turn away the unregistered games. The indoor flea market didn't quite get the response I was hoping for. (However that was probably a good thing as we found out during setup that we couldn't set the hall up the way I had planned.) What I was looking for to happen was an increase in flea market vendors and we did get a couple more than we usually do but still not quite what we needed.

Our survey is up and running. If you have a few minutes and would like to help us make decisions for the show, go to http://surveysilver.com/index.php/468536/lang-en

Thanks
Rich

Filled out the survey. We had a great time and will be back next year. Thanks for all the hard work put into this.

Rich,

PLEASE consider $20 door fee to try to keep things in the new hall. 100% of the people I have talked to think the increase would be well worth it to stay in that bigger building. Being honest I didn't talk to hundreds of people but I did talk to at least a few dozen and all thought new hall was great and would love to see the show stay in the bigger building. Also everyone I talked to thought is would be fine upping the door fee to $20.

Most of them said basically the same thing - "if $5 is going to keep them from coming in they will not be spending much money here anyway". With that said you likely already realize most people I talked to had stuff for sale at the show - either machines or in spaces.

If show is in the bigger hall again next year you will have a better handle on the layout and I am sure more people (including myself) will step up to make the show even bigger & better. I am still upset I couldn't set up this year but you know I'll do all I can to help you in any way possible.

THANKS for another GREAT SHOW! And no rain for the first time since you took it over likely because no one was set up outside? Crazy how things turn out isn't it!

Thanks everyone. I enjoyed being in the flea market area. I ended up renting two spaces rather than one. I was near the beer so that had to be a good thing. My wife even enjoyed helping me for half of Friday and all day Saturday. Basically what you saw in my space was about 5 or more years of stuff gathering dust in my basement. I am grateful that I got rid of most of it and it all went to good new homes. I did not have any pinballs this year for sale. I did bring some slot machines. I did not expect any to sell and I was not disappointed. I did get many comments on how nice they looked and played. Thanks! I enjoyed being there. It was great to be indoors and see a lot of people. I look forward to simply being a spectator next year since I probably won't have any treasures to sell.

Michael

In my personal opinion, yes, I don't think an extra $5 will turn away any regulars or people interested. But at the same time (something I may disagree with u on), I don't think it's necessary to raise any costs just to keep the show in a certain building. At the end of the day, it's still a building. UNLESS the flea market and or free play area will grow in the new building, I think the show should be in the old hall to keep the costs adjusted. All in all, unless the attendance gets higher next year, I don't think a $5 increase should be needed to keep it in the same building.

Instead of upping the entry fee, why not up the vendor fee instead? I would imagine that some people would complain about an increase in the entry fee, but I cant imagine a vendor complaining about it, considering that if most vendors sell 1-5 items in their booth, that their booth is paid for. Just food for thought, from a 17 year vendor (who missed this one for the first time in 17 years ).

-Mike

Mike,

I think the problem with upping the vendor fee is it will not amount to much money compared to upping the entry fee. I don't know the vendor or paid entry count but if there are 1000 people paying to get through the door $5 extra per person amounts to $5000 extra revenue. On the other hand if there are say 40 vendors there rent would have to go up $125 a space to generate the same revenue. Every other show now charges $20 or more so why not have York in line with other shows. Maybe a vendor space increase also and put more into advertising, etc?

To me it isn't about the building as much as it is about letting the show grow. Like Rich said in his last post "if they were not in the bigger building he would have had to turn freeplay machines away". The show wants to grow and unlike Allentown the fairground has room to let it grow so why not let it get bigger? I don't want to keep going on about this because I always get accused of sounding like a broken record but York is our best hope for a HUGE show sometime down the road. Allentown has maxed out all available space but there is no way we could ever run out of room at the York Fairground.

If the show moves back into the smaller hall the indoor flea market will be gone and the number of freeplay machines will be limited again. If it stays in the bigger hall there will be more machines & more vendors next year. People who came to the show this year now realize there is room for more machines so more people will likely bring machines for freeplay. And since every vendor I talked to was happy with sales I expect there will be more people looking for vendor & flea market spaces next year also.

I promise I will not talk anymore about this but I just love the idea of the York Show growing however I don't think the cost of that should be on Rich & his family. Enough said!

The cost to get to York is always higher than the door charge.. so I wouldn't sweat if the door charge went up a tad to keep the show going in a positive direction.

I think the indoor flea market is great, but would have liked to see the outdoor setup the show normally has too.

The show had a great mix of vendors. I only wish we had a GPE or equivalent on site

Agreed with you 100% on this but on a different outlook. I used to run a show for 3 years (non-pinball) upping the charge on vendors is the exact opposite of what a show promoter wants to do. You need the vendors there to draw more spectators. If you lose the vendors you will lose part of the attraction. Look at how many pinball arcades charge $20 for a few hours of play. The bigger hall brings in more freeplay games for people to play. If needed, and only if needed I would raise the entry fee to keep the bigger show.

$20 for singles; $30 a couple.

...or pre-sales which are made easy with eventbrite.com. If you want to get fancy I think you can do timed entry to control crowds and also do premiums for 'all access'. Note that not every pre-sale actually shows up at the door on event day.

-Rob
-visit http://www.kahr.us to get my daughterboard that helps fix WPC pinball resets or for my Pinball 2000 H+V video sync combiner kit

I felt the new building was much nicer than the old one. Better bathrooms, more open food area, taller ceiling, more room to move around in overall (less cramped), lots of side doors great for moving games in and out, etc. I personally wouldn't have a problem paying more to enter the show if it came down to that.

Maybe that would be something we could talk Rich into? Rich isn't the one that wants to increase the price - it is actually several of us in the local pinball group who have talked to him about the idea. Rich is a great guy and really hates the idea of charging more money but those of us that know him fairly well know how close he is working as far as the money end of things with the show and we hate to see him & his family not at least covering to cost of running the show.

If you talk to Rich he will tell you it is all OK but then if you actually think about some of the stuff he has said it doesn't take a genius to realize things are tight when it comes to funding the show. More money would help him in man ways - advertising - rent - etc. And more space helps the show get bigger & better. So in my eyes a few extra dollars to get into the show just seems like a great answer.

It wouldn't have to be $30 a married couple - even if it was $30 or $35 if two people came in together? Father & son, husband & wife, a couple buddies, etc. It really wouldn't matter it would still end up with some people paying a little more to help support the show!

Rob,

Another GREAT idea - $15 pre-paid and $20 at the door! Again giving people a chance to save a little money but also increasing the revenue Rich takes in. I am really hoping Rich will take the advice of his friends and think about himself for a change! Maybe if he sees a few more post here supporting the idea of a few more dollars to make the show even better he will at least think about it.

Thanks Guys! Keep the GREAT ideas coming!

i'd also try to work in a little more incentive to bring games for free play. what about a vendor discount or one-time coupon towards a vendor purchase? doesn't need to be much; 10% off a single item or $20 coupon. i've been on the fence a few times now about bringing a game, and i just need a little push to fall over the edge.

that's what needs to get better: the free play area. you fill that thing up, you can charge people anything you want at the door.

Am I the only one who wouldn't want to see a price increase? I think for most casual people who go, $15 is the sweet spot. Especially when they're coming with a group. Any more than that, and it gets a little rich for people's blood--especially when the quality of the games can be questionable. There were 3 Rollergames at the show, but only one of them actually played well enough to warrant any time spent on it, and still too many people shuffle around games throughout the day and take them off the floor early. That's just the nature of this kind of show, where so many people are buying and selling--I have nothing inherently against it.

Just my 2 cents.

Here's how I think about it... It's a two hour drive for me. About $25 in gas round trip. I'll spend another $20 on food likely during the day. Let's say I spend $50-$100 in something I buy. That's $100-$200 that's gonna happen regardless of what it costs to get in the door.

So spending $5 more dollars to make sure the show actually happens, and/or is BETTER... Yes, why not.

It costs $20 to see a movie and get a soda here.. and I can do that 7 days a week on demand. To get to go and experience a hobby show that takes a ton of commitment to happen... $15-$20 is child's play.

Imagine paying $40.00 just for a Saturday.This is the prices for the Texas show.
What Time and How Much?

Friday: 5pm-1am
Adults $30, Kids $15

Saturday: 10am-12am
Adults $40, Kids $25

Sunday: 9am-2:30pm
Adults $25, Kids $10

Weekend Pass:
Adults $65, Kids $4

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can someone explain the background on this guy? Was he really there and what's up with him? Sleeping all the time....

Yes please aware on this guy. I saw him at the show on Saturday. Is he a Pinsider?

If possible extended hours does help attendance. At Pintastic we offer a late afternoon discounted price and that seems to bring another wave of people in.

Lots of people work on Friday and Saturday so it's a great way to bring those people in. The one catch is you need to make it worth it for them and extend your hours. Maybe not as crazy as we do but they need to see the value in making the drive.

The issue with extending Saturday is that it takes us 3- 4 hours (if all goes well) to pack up. If we are in the building past 12 we would end up paying for a Sunday rental.

The majority of vendors and people that bring games are facing a 2 + hour drive home. A later time would force them into another night at a motel.

We had exactly 3 admissions after 3 PM on Saturday, so the general public is definitely not interested in being there late either.

Bob Thurman - very long time member of the local pin community
See - https://www.facebook.com/groups/pinballenthusiasts/permalink/1673785519321035/

The repeated posting of these photos is making me think someone is attempting to shame or mock him and isn't cool.

I know what you're saying, and I don't disagree, but here's the way I see it:

$20 is the admission to Pinfest, which is usually a considerably larger show. The York show has always been a smaller more intimate show with fewer games and vendors and better deals. $15 is still the sweet spot in my opinion.

This year, the show was dominated by EMs and older SS that were either beautiful or trashed--there's nothing inherently wrong with that, but $20 would seem a pricey in comparison to other shows with a larger quantity and greater mix of games.

The bottom line: Would I pay an extra $5? Yea. Probably--but that's because I'm obsessed. But will my two friends? Probably not. They'll just wait 'till Allentown rolls around for the bigger show. And there goes $30 bucks York could've had.

I have some ideas I want to run by Rich sometime over the next few months but my ideas will require some money to be spent to try to attract more SS freeplay machines to York. Basically what I am hoping for is to get York on par with what Allentown was a year or two ago by next year and then try to help it grow each year after that if Rich is OK with some of my ideas.

So you wouldn't be paying extra money to attend the show at the size of freeplay this year at York. Freeplay would likely grow in size by 20% and maybe also try to attract additional vendors to pack that hall in 2018. So what I am talking about is a few dollars extra to attend a bigger York Show.

Not to take anything away from Allentown but we have a problem at Allentown that really can't be fixed. Ivan is pretty much out of space unless something like a big tent would work at that fairground. So in my eyes the next logical thing to do is to try to grow York to make it more like Allentown and maybe even beyond Allentown a few years down the road. I don't even know if Rich would consider letting it grow that much but at least at York their is room for growth.

This post is starting to get long so I'll post a few ideas here publicly a little later but please understand I am not trying to pick peoples pockets for the "same old York". I am thinking new bigger hall could end up being a much bigger show with just a few tweaks. That is if Rich is on board with some of the ideas.

Rich,

If you happen to read my post - once you rest up a little drop me a PM - I have a couple things I want to run by you for 2018. For years York has screamed "missed potential to me" and now might be the time to make things a little bigger if you don't think that would put too much on you and your family. Don't worry my "crazy ideas" are not all that far out there. But it might involved a little extra work for someone on your staff.

I would love to see another 40 or 50 freeplay machines and a few more vendors next year and I have a couple ideas on how that might be able to happen with little to no cost to you. No rush - we have 9 months or so but I keep thinking what else can be done to get more machines to the show and that got me thinking about a couple ideas that might work.

With all I have posted I still love the laid back feeling of the York Show and one concern I do have is if it grows it might loose that feeling?

And to everyone here on Pinside - sorry I am becoming "too-many-post" again instead of too-many-pins!

At the end of the day, I don't really care what happens. I trust that Rich has all the information and data he needs to make the right decisions, and us pawns on pinside arguing over what should be done is more or less a moot argument. Rich will do what he needs to do either way to move his show in the direction he chooses.

All I know is, I love the York show. I love that it's smaller, and that it's got better deals on games. I like that I don't have to wait in a line to play literally any game that isn't a crappy throwaway EM (like you pretty much have to do at Allentown). I like that when I brought a game for the first time this year, the staff was INCREDIBLY helpful and did far more in accommodating me than I had expected (being that I was pretty clueless). (Thank you!)

I'll continue to support the show regardless of the direction it takes.

One of the reasons I put a couple of my post up asking questions is Rich has a survey up on Facebook looking for suggestions. I thought asking some questions here might help him get additional information to make his decisions for next year. I know he likes to see what other people think and looks to everyone for suggestions on how to improve the show.

Both Rich & Ivan had done a fantastic job since taking over the shows a few years ago and I love both shows for different reasons. I hate to see York change but I would love to see York grow. My main fear is if it grows some of what people like about York might get lost!

Anyway - keep ideas & suggestions coming. I know Rich checks in on this post from time to time and I am sure he is happy to hear anything anyone has to say.