(Topic ID: 193720)

Yet Another TOM Trunk Thread (different problem, though - I think)

By meeotch

6 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 6 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by meeotch
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

#1 6 years ago

We've got a TOM that randomly and often decides it has a trunk error, when no such error exists. It happens randomly during play (not specifically when the trunk is hit during a turn, a la the 600+ post thread about Ingo's relay fix). But more importantly, it happens during the trunk test as well.

The symptoms are: The trunk test does everything it's supposed to. Trunk optos open/close in the correct sequence, and the DMD icon for the trunk matches the physical trunk face. However, every so often the icon will be replaced by "error", even though the optos are showing the correct status & the physical trunk is doing the right thing.

Most times, hitting the same + or - button again causes the error to clear and the icon to appear again. Sometimes, this is accompanied by the trunk moving a tiny bit (though the opto status continues to be correct, as it previously already was), but sometimes there's no additional "jog", just a cleared error. Once in a while, the trunk will just skip to the next face, instead of fixing the current face.

We've checked the set screw alignment on the opto wheel (which is the aluminum upgrade version). We've cleaned/rebuilt the gear box and lubed with teflon lube. There is a small amount of slop in the mechanism - you can turn the trunk with your hand and it'll "snap" into a new position a couple of degrees from where it was without moving the motor. As far as I can tell, that might be due to some wear on one of the secondary gears. As the opto wheel slits are very narrow, a couple of degrees is enough to change the opto status.

I found this post that indicates that a "mixed signal" or time-out will throw a trunk error, even if the physical trunk is behaving correctly. My gut tells me maybe the slop in the mechanism is causing such a situation - but the rest of me feels like someone upstream should have expected some slop, and that maybe there's a way to get it running properly without buying a whole new gear box.

During play, the problem manifests as normal operation for a while, and then the trunk suddenly ceasing to move and the game rules acting as if it's been disabled. As mentioned, it's not necessarily concurrent with a ball hitting the trunk. Subsequent self-test says "trunk error - use trunk test". The error can be cleared with the test, since the test does not show errors as described above 100% of the time. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Has anyone else observed / solved this issue?

#2 6 years ago

An update, for anyone who's interested: On a hunch, I moved the opto interrupter wheel down on its shaft and taped some card stock around the edge, so that I could try out different sizes for the interrupter slot. By making the slot 2-3x larger, it seems that the symptoms in Trunk Test mode were improved - the mysterious error messages went away.

However, when in play mode, the trunk still fails. I say "play mode", because I tested by manually moving a ball past the eddy sensor, rather than bashing it into the trunk, to rule out issues stemming from physical impact. The trunk will spin correctly once or twice, but then fail, leading to "trunk error - use trunk test" in the diagnostic messages. As mentioned, it fails while spinning, with no simultaneous ball hits.

At this point I'm wondering if smoothing out or buffering the signal from the opto board in some way might help? It seems likely the software is getting signals it doesn't like, but which aren't evident to the human eye.

1 week later
#3 6 years ago

Further update: reflowed the components on the opto & motor boards, per the suggestions on Kimball's Pinballs site. No change.

Even tried building a "skirt" around the opto board, on the off chance that stray IR from all the LED's we've installed was causing optical interference. (You can trigger an opto by shining a sufficiently bright LED flashlight into it. Neat trick for testing the receivers.) No change.

Gah!

#4 6 years ago
Quoted from meeotch:

There is a small amount of slop in the mechanism - you can turn the trunk with your hand and it'll "snap" into a new position a couple of degrees from where it was without moving the motor.

@Meeotch:
If you still have slop/play in the Trunk Assembly after you rebuilt your Gear Box you may have missed tightening up the 2 Set-Screws for the Trunk Shaft assembly as it goes through the Main Gear - these are usually stuck CrAzY tight as B/W used a permanent Threadlocker on these.

You may have assumed they were tight enough because you couldn't move them as they are a real PITA to break loose.
On a few Gear Boxes I have rebuilt I have had to use Heat to get those 2 Screws to break loose to be able to re-tighten them to remove ALL SLOP/PLAY between the Shaft and the Main Gear it goes through.

There should be VERY little play in the complete GB Assembly - there should be NO PLAY WHATSOEVER between the Trunk Shaft and the Main Gear it goes through.

PM sent.

Keep PinSIde posted ;-})

Kim

#5 6 years ago

What trunk opto-board do you use? Original?

#6 6 years ago

german-pinball - yes, I believe the opto board is the original one. I'm actually the guy who PM'ed you about buying a board. Just sent another PM a minute ago.

Pin_-_K - thanks for the info. We discovered that the set screws you mentioned were in fact loose. The trunk mechanism now has almost no slop at all. (Unfortunately, it still exhibits the same weird error behavior. So now I'm leaning toward the opto board as a potential source of the problem.)

Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
$ 11.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
 
$ 69.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Hookedonpinball.com
 
$ 1.00
Pinball Machine
Pinball Alley
 
From: $ 55.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Pinball Photos LLC
 
$ 29.50
Playfield - Plastics
Pinball Haus
 
$ 69.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lighted Pinball Mods
 
$ 47.99
Lighting - Interactive
Lee's Parts
 
€ 150.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
TheDudeMods
 
$ 35.00
Cabinet - Other
Rocket City Pinball
 
Wanted
From: $ 10.00
Playfield - Protection
UpKick Pinball
 
$ 275.00
Lighting - Interactive
Professor Pinball
 
$ 38.00
Cabinet - Other
Pinball Mod Co.
 
8,900
Machine - For Sale
Sandy Springs, GA
$ 130.00
Playfield - Plastics
Pinball Haus
 
$ 29.99
Lighting - Interactive
Lee's Parts
 
$ 69.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lighted Pinball Mods
 
$ 33.99
Lighting - Interactive
Lee's Parts
 
$ 30.00
Playfield - Other
YouBentMyWookie
 
$ 84.99
Playfield - Decals
FlyLand Designs
 
From: $ 17.99
$ 119.99
Cabinet - (Alt) Translites
FlyLand Designs
 
$ 79.99
Cabinet - Armor And Blades
PinGraffix Pinside Shop
 
$ 109.99
Lighting - Led
Lighted Pinball Mods
 
$ 329.99
Lighting - Other
Lighted Pinball Mods
 
$ 9.95
Eproms
Pinballrom
 
€ 40.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Pino Pinball Mods Shop
 

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/yet-another-tom-trunk-thread-different-problem-though-i-think and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.