(Topic ID: 83541)

RESOLVED! Yet an other Johnny Mnemonic hand issue!

By gbak

10 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 12 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 10 years ago by Leo13
  • Topic is favorited by 5 Pinsiders

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#1 10 years ago

I'm new here and hope I post in the right forum!

I bought my JM for one year ago everything worked fine (even the hand), but now suddenly the hand have stopped working. This pin is really a favorite so it must be fixed!
I have read "all posts" regading hand issues but I cant find my problem anywhere so I hope someone out there have seen this behaviour before....

It started with the error msg Hand mechanism Y- no progress.
So I checked the magnet and the wires was partly burned so replaced them and thought this woud fix it, but not!
The hand works fine in both X and Y directions when running the selftests, but when I press the blue flipper buttons (Y-directions forward/back) then the hand immidiatly seems to "hang" and stops working.

If I reset the hand by doing a hand test, JM boots up normally without any error msg.
But as soon as the ball gets into the hand and I try to move the hand (by the flipper buttons) in any Y direction the hand stops!
It cant be a wire issue as the hand works when JM runs the hand, must be something else....?

- All switches (X, Y & hand) and the four photo couplers have been checked and they all works.
- I have resolder the Dual relay motor driver board, back of the playfield.
- The magnet works and holds the ball.
- All connectors near the hand have been reseated.
- The both drive nuts/screws seems not to be worn at all.

Dont know where to search anymore and where to look!
Can anyone give some advice, Thanks!

#2 10 years ago
Quoted from gbak:

- I have resolder the Dual relay motor driver board, back of the playfield.

Let me preface this by saying I am no expert. There are others on here who could probably chime in with more helpful info, but I did just have some JM issues, and I went through several of the steps you mentioned. Does the glove stop working entirely once you hit the Y buttons? So you can move it right to the matrix, hit the y button, and it just sits until you reset it?

First thing, have you gone into switch test and made sure your blue flipper buttons that control Y movement are registering properly? When you push and hold do they stay firm as being activated? A bad switch there could maybe explain your Y problems?

From my experience I would really think that your problem is somewhere on the dual relay board. Your comment mentioned this was at the back of the playfield. Are you maybe referring to the encoder board with the opto on it? That is at the back of the playfield on the back panel/wall behind the hands. The relay board is on the bottom of the playfield kind of under where the matrix sits. My problems were coming from this board. Make sure your wires a seated well in the connector and that the connector is firm. I know you probably did that already, but I messed with mine 3 times before my problem went away last time. Good luck.

#3 10 years ago
Quoted from Dr_Spaceman:

Does the glove stop working entirely once you hit the Y buttons? So you can move it right to the matrix, hit the y button, and it just sits until you reset it?

Yes and yes, the glove stops working entirly when hitting any Y button.

I will check the blue flipper button, might be a bad button as you mention!

My first though was that the dual relay board under the playfield was causing this with a bad soldering.
But the glove works fine when running the handtest, shouldn't the signals from the Y buttons go the same way (thru the same relay board)?

Just thinking....could a broken diode on the Y button cause this issue?

#4 10 years ago

Do a switch edge test and see if the buttons work. You could have unplugged them. J207

#5 10 years ago
Quoted from gbak:

Yes and yes, the glove stops working entirly when hitting any Y button.
I will check the blue flipper button, might be a bad button as you mention!
My first though was that the dual relay board under the playfield was causing this with a bad soldering.
But the glove works fine when running the handtest, shouldn't the signals from the Y buttons go the same way (thru the same relay board)?
Just thinking....could a broken diode on the Y button cause this issue?

Yes, the dual relay board manages both x and y. If you look at the manual it says which connector goes where. My glove would work fine during the hand test, but when I would put a ball in lock the hand would move all the way to the right on its own without picking up the ball, and then get stuck. Had to reset it with the hand test where it would check out fine only to mess up again the next game. I reflowed solder and put on new connectors and so far so good. I don't know exactly what fixed it, but my problem was with that board. Your problem sounds different, but somewhat similar. The glove can be tricky apparently. Gives the buttons a test first.

#6 10 years ago
Quoted from donjagra:

Do a switch edge test and see if the buttons work. You could have unplugged them. J207

All switches (buttons) have now been checked and works fine, so the issue can not to be found there!

I have also looked a little bit closer to the glove's magnet.
The magnet catches the ball and keeps it as long as the X-motor runs (or the X-buttons are activated)
But if I touch the Y-button the magnet immediately dropps the ball, the X motor stops and the Y motor
never starts.
Earlier I assumed that the Y movement stopped as I touched the Y-buttons, but it might be that the ball dropps out from the magnet first, and because of that, the X & Y motors also stops (as the machine expects a ball in the glove to run the motors)

What can cause the magnet to loose it's power?
(The glove switch works, there are new and thicker leaders)

Just guessing now:
Could it be a voltage drop to the magnet when the motor starts to build up energy for thr movement?
Do these two have any common connection?

Edit:
I just did the T16 Hand Test.
Self Test =OK
Home= OK
Move= Failed, X motor works fine as always, but the Y motor doesnt move at all when pushing the Y-buttons.
I can hear the relay clicking so the signals from Y-buttons comes to the relay, but there it stops....

#7 10 years ago

Today I removed the complete hand asm with it's motors and drivescrews.
When everything was out I started to check leader by leder with my multimeter.
And suddenly, there it was! A broken leader.
It was one of the the leaders to the Y motor, the insulation looked ok from outside, but inside the wire was broken.

I also found an issue with the drop down target (in front of the ball popper).
The switch could somtimes get stuck in it's bottom position. Maby this switch would affect the magnet to drop the ball.....??

So now Johnny is up again

Thanks all for the help!

#8 10 years ago

How hard it was to remove completely the hand assembly ? I have to do it on mine for a complete restoration but I'm looking for tutorial.

#9 10 years ago

No problem to remove the hand asm.
Just get a set of screwdrivers similar to this.
http://www.powerandmotoryacht.com/sites/default/files/pictures/1305/nut_drivers.jpg

You have to loose six screws, disconnect some (seven??) connectors, cut some straps, unsold (or cut) the wires to the right red flasher.
Then you can lift the asm out. Took me 15-20 minutes to remove it.
Take some photos before removing it so you know how to put it back and be careful when lifting the asm out so it want fall apart.

#10 10 years ago

thanks, good to know ! I did not know however that a wire has to be cut for removal. It's weird there is no connector for this flasher.

1 week later
#11 10 years ago
Quoted from Leo13:

thanks, good to know ! I did not know however that a wire has to be cut for removal. It's weird there is no connector for this flasher.

You don't need to cut any wires to remove the assembly. That flasher goes into a connector that is part of the back board harness. Here's a guide to rebuilding the hand assembly:
http://quinndunki.com/blondihacks/?p=1615

1 week later
#12 10 years ago

That's awesome, MANY THANKS !

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