I've only played a little bit of Avengers. It was an LE.

My opinion? I liked X-Men a lot more. The shots and ramps flowed really well. The modes were fun and required a LOT of strategy and skill to execute correctly. The combos are a blast to pull off (I love the unique combo names), and the rules are wonderful. I would say X-men is more of an adventure than it is a quick game of pinball. My only beef with it was how tight the Beast shot was on the LE.

What I remember of Avengers was that it's a faster game than X-Men in terms of gameplay (not necessarily flow and speed). I also remember the ball hanging up multiple times. I think that can be fixed with some dialing in, but it IS a known issue with Avengers in general. I LOVE both themes, but I just found the gameplay of X-Men to be more enjoyable.

Are you looking at Pro or LE?

Marvel's Trade Paper Back collected volume of that story is pretty good

Xmen by a mile.

I own both and Xmen is a way deeper game .....

Yeah XM without question for me due to superior gameplay and great code that fits the theme perfectly. Not even in the same ballpark to me. I really dislike the layout on Avengers. Just one dude's opinion here please no one take offense.

From what I've seen, read, and heard...Ha

X-Men:
LE has the spinning Magneto disc, Iceman ramp (which some love, some hate - I think it's awesome), and the Nightcrawler pop ups. The BIGGEST game changer of those three would be the Nightcrawler pop ups. Spinning disc is cool (my wife loved that feature), and the Iceman ramp is a real crowd pleaser (everyone LOOOVED when it rotated). I saw Nightcrawler only a handful of times when I had the LE.

Avengers:
I don't know the differences between versions, I apologize. However I do know that the LE seems to have some weird hangup issues by Hulk that are sort of hard to fix. LE owners can probably help you out. I think the Pro is probably a great buy on this title since it can be found for a great price. But having said that, the LE is going for a really reasonable price, too. Pinside is full of VERY polarized posters - owners of Avengers love it, and those who don't hate it. X-Men had a bad reputation but has regained some popularity - Avengers really hasn't...

I think you'd want to play Avengers before you make a decision on it vs X-Men. If you enjoy a deeper game, I would argue for X-Men in this case. X-Men LE can be found for ~$5-5.5k, whereas Avengers LE is probably in the $4-4.5k range. If you're feeling really ambitious, you can try and hunt down a Pro of each and spend ~$6.2-6.8 and get them both.

Hope this has been SOMEWHAT helpful. I also hope someone who has played a lot of Avengers can weigh in to give you their opinions, too.

Don't have the time in on AV like I did XM (since sold it), but XM has a ton going for it:

Artwork: Stellar
Code: Top Notch

The only downside for me is it's a players machine with some tough shots. And I'm a bit more of an unskilled, flailing type player.

I also wasn't a huge fan of the way Wolverine and the pops took up so much space so far down on the left-hand side of the playfield, but that's pretty subjective.

Most probably don't notice it or wouldn't comment on that aspect. I just happen to like a more wide-open playfield (which is why I need to get me to an IM to try it out and see if that's my next pin).

Good luck with whatever you choose!

I own both in LE format and will be unloading X-Men in a few months. Personally, I prefer Avengers, though I know that will probably end up being the non-majority position in this thread. I bought X-Men NIB and got burned by shitty code, Wolverine toy mounting, board problems, Nightcrawler pop-ups, magnets, all the old craziness. So, I'm probably not the most objective about it. That said, there is definitely a fun difference between the two in Avengers favor that I can't explain. However, the B/W ramp in Avengers really pisses me off.

Yeah, if you want depth and a real experience, X-Men is your game. There is SO much to do in that game, and it will make you WORK for your scores and success. I love how you need to recruit the X-Men in order to really defeat the villains (because otherwise, it feels impossibly hard, haha).

It's seriously an incredible game that I sort of miss. I'll definitely own another X-Men at some point since my wife loved it so much.

How deep would you say Avengers is in comparison to X-Men? Not knowing enough about the rules, I'm curious myself...I feel like if the OP wants a DEEP game that plays more like an adventure than a pinball machine, X-Men has that edge. But I DO want to know more about Avengers personally as the theme is just fantastic.

I have owned TAV pro since Jan 2013 and Xmen pro since June 2013. I have a shaker in Xmen, and a sub on TAV.

1. they are both great games and get equal play.
2. Dots and sound are both very good.
3. Layouts are very different. TAV is more of a fan layout, xmen has more ramps and flow.
4. TAV is way harder, but shallower. TAV will make you a much better player, but if you aren't so good, you will be frustrated.
5. I don't think you can go wrong with either and it seems that TAV is now considerable cheaper.
6. Scoring is much easier on XM.
7. Wizard mods I'd say are better on XM, but still very cool on TAV (and much harder to get to)
8. I think Xmen quality is much better and has required zero tweaking. TAV requires quite a few, but once addressed game play is good.
9. Zdoor's tesseract cube is a must so figure in another $130 or so (pretty easy install.)

If I had to rebuy these games today, I would probably take TAV given the price difference. If money is no object, I might choose Xmen.

I like Avengers better. X-Men wins the art category, but I like everything else about Avengers better...music/sound, toys, voices, shots. It's not as deep, I guess...although I don't think X-Men is deep, either. It has a shitload of modes - but IMO that doesn't equal depth...it just has lots of content. That being said, Avengers can be a very long game - but the length seems padded. It's more exciting during the first "half" of the game....the Vs. modes are cool, but when the game becomes non-stop Vs. Multiballs - it gets a bit old.

For me, it's hard to choose between the two. I have an Avengers LE and really like Xmen LE or Pro. I've thought of selling Avengers a few times to fund the purchase of an Xmen LE. Everytime I play the Avengers, though, I really enjoy it and I'm just not ready to sell it. It did require a lot of time tweaking it and the balls still gets hung up every now and again. Still I really enjoy the game and cann't say which is better if you are looking at the LE.

I like the depth and variety of Xmen. I like the Vs modes in Avengers. I find the MBs are harder on Avengers. Actually the game itself is harder than Xmen. When it comes to looks, Avengers LE Blue is the clear winner to me. I love the look of the game. The cabinet trim and artwork are tops. With Xmen I prefer the look of the Pro as it has villains on one side of the cab and heroes on the other. I also prefer seeing the Xmen on the backglass as opposed to Wolverine or Magneto.

If you are comparing the Pro version, it's Xmen all the way. The hawkeye ramp is critical to the game play -- at least to me and is only found on the LEs or Pro. In the case of Xmen, the LE features are nice, but not critical to the gameplay. I prefer Xmen LE, but wouldn't mind a Pro.

Good luck on the hunt.
Duane

I own both LEs and X-Men is definitely deeper than Avenger, and also probably Tron, Iron Man, etc. So, if deeper is your criteria, by all means go for X-Men. FYI, I'm a poor gauge of the game as an original NIB pre-order owner. I've been through the bad code, bad boards, bad Wolverine mounting, Nightcrawlers locked on/off, etc., problems, so I'm not unbiased in my preference for Avengers. I'm also not a great player and X-Men's shots and numerous modes require accuracy that I don't have.

It might boil down to themes in the end. I think both are under rated games, so I don't think you'd go wrong with either at this point, despite my experiences. Avengers is probably a little cheaper in cost though, for whatever that might be worth in your decision making.

Interesting, you find TAV shots are easier than xmen? I think it's the opposite. BW and IM shots can be pretty tough and the blue divider between CA and HE is a nightmare. I find just about every shot on Xmen fairly easy to hit with Xavier being the toughest as Wolvie clearance doesn't give much space. I usually am able to start/complete Hulk, HE and CA the easiest, followed by IM and BW. Thor is pretty easy and multiballs often take care of it. My settings are all medium or hard.

on Xmen, you have to allow hero stacking or you won't get anywhere.

It does take a little time for me to zero in on CA, and BW owns me so I'll agree that Avengers is no gimme. Still, they seem easier to me than Beast and Storm. I seem to be able to hit Xavier all day long, but can never hit Cyclops when on the clock. The beauty of Avengers is that if you stay alive long enough and can hit HE, you're half way there. Thor and Hulk take care of themselves in normal flailing. Iron Man and B/W not so much.

Can not say about AV since I've not seen or played one.

I have XMLE going on 2 years. During that time I was sorely depressed about the code direction for a good year. But now I think it's code is very good, but not perfect but very good.

I was seriously down on XMLE for a while as I was not a good player and thought the shots were too hard but after really playing it over and over I have started to be able to make the shots with more frequency. I would give XMLE a solid B grade, has come a long way in my eyes.

I love Nightcrawler mode, I love the spinning disc magnet not just for start of Magneto Multiball but also used throughout the game to add randomness, I love the Gambit hurry up mode, it's just a simple shot but the way you need to make it just right with a very tight window both on time and the shot you need to hit as well as you need to make the shot with a good amount of pace on the ball. Simple one shot but a lot of things to juggle to get it just so.

One thing, IMO XMLE should tell you better when you make a great shot or defeat a mode more fanfare would be welcome on that regard.

Are you kidding me. Xmen of course.

Hero stacking makes a mess of the game I hate it and think with hero stacking off (default) it provides a good difficulty point to get to danger room. No way I'd classify shots on XM as easy.

I just got an X-Men, so I think it's best.

Robert

Avengers is my favorite game because it's has a very fast pace , Xmen is a game that has a lot of rules , avengers is simple but more fun for me ...

I agree it's harder to follow multiple modes running at once, but I do like it better. I had it off and it was very tough to advance. I have a hard enough time with avengers so I like xmen settings just a bit easier.

I had friends over that play a lot of pinball and are pretty good players early on. They thought it was an absolute cluster F@@@ and hard to follow I agreed. I do like the challenge as well with them off. I'm glad they made it an option since some do prefer it the other way. The more options in menu the better for all of us.

I have both pins now, XM LE and TAV LE. I've had XM a bit longer, but am playing a lot more of TAV lately. I'd have to say I like the Avengers a bit more. Most people that say they don't like the game have not played it enough to give it a chance. I wasn't crazy about it the first few times that I played one at a friend's house, but now that I'd have one for a little while, I really like it.

Probably explains my 340 mil score. I would never get that with stacking off.

Xmen is way better

Ive owned Xmen LE & Pro; and avengers LE. Here's how I rank them: AVLE > XMEN PRO > XMEN LE

AVLE: Better call outs, better music, better sounds, fun as hell multiballs.
Xmen Pro: Xmen's rules are better than avengers but that's about it. The pf art is better too, but dam magneto and wolverine are so ugly, they ruin the beautiful art of this game. I give xmen pro the nod over the LE for flow. Plus, iceman ramp shot feels better and nightcrawler mode seems more fun going for bright yellow inserts.

Protip - my wife is not good at pinball, but she LOVED X-Men LE. She also loves ST Premium. She did NOT like TRON. X-Men is busy but approachable for a newbie.

I have yet to play an Avengers that has not went into ball search several times in a three ball game due to the ball getting hung up. (I have played a few examples) So I can not fairly judge it.

XMEN LE is curently my favorite game of all time.

Man I wish you kept your XM Pro until last update hit really adds some good stuff to it including combo incentives like Deadpool. Made it a much funner game I was going to move it before but after I decided it will be staying. Funny how we all have our different preferences. You and I both like XM but I boarder line despise Avengers. What a great time to be a pinhead though so many pins coming out nowadays it's not hard to find something new you like.

Such an unhelpful post with regard to AV. But hey buy the AVLE for $4k! So amusing. XMEN LE has sold around $5k and under forever. AVLE bottomed out around $5,200. But all games are a little lower now.

Oh pinside.

AVLE now is IM in 2010. Only there are 600 fewer avengers le's. In a few years it will be a hot game. In today's pinball climate, if you trip outta the gate your just screwed, and that's what happened with AVLE. But the game is very good and will earn the respect it deserves in time. Why people that "don't really know" venture an opinion is absurd.

I like both but I love Avengers LE.

Most X-Men owners are like crazy radicals so most likely you'll never get the opinion you're looking for. Their "game" will never amount to a METLE or TRON.

The code could include a porn star coming to my door wanting to hang out all night for free. The game would still suck. Hence the reason you aren't seeing LEs above $5,200 unless the seller was dumb enough to put another $500 in mods to the game.

Look X-Men loyalists we get it, you love the game. But "most" of you are arbitrary little slugs looking to take pot shots on every single thread that points out that X-Men really isn't a very good game.

Time for you little kiddies to move on and get a better game. Unless you didn't mind your brother insulting your first ugly girlfriend then by all means keep the game.

Good LORD you're <edited> - did you even READ my entire post? The hell?!

I said VERY clearly that I hope someone who has played a lot of Avengers could weigh in and give their opinion!

E: And I even apologized in advance for my lack of knowledge on the game. I simply gave a few little anecdotes that I've either read or experienced. Hell, the ONLY suggestion I gave that was AGAINST Avengers was that if he wanted a deeper game, he should consider X-Men.

_{Post edited by moderator: No personal attacks please.}

We do a lot of things on Pinside. One thing we don't do? Insult another member directly.

You're right - apparently we insult them indirectly! Heh.

Whatever, my bad I guess.

But I stand by my original assessment that he was being ridiculous in his approach to my VERY respectful reply to the OP.

The left loop Loki multiball exploit on the Avengers pro seems to be a poor rule design.

I seem to recall the right inlane switch was once entirely removed at a tourney for the sole purpose of avoiding that exploit.

Can you elaborate for those of us unfamiliar with this exploit and is it only a problem with the pro?

Spelling LOKI from the lower 4 lanes lights the locks for LOKI multiball. So keep hitting the left loop over and over and over, changing the letters as needed when the ball drops into the right return lane and work toward the locks. After a lock, when a ball is ejected into the shooter lane, short plunge, allow the ball to feed the right inlane and go back to work on the left loop. Good players can do this over and over as there is nothing but controlled shots.

To my knowledge, on the LE there is a crossover ramp so the technique is not exactly the same, but if there is a way to get the ball back on the right flipper easily, then it is a similar procedure.

Because eggbert52 is an Xmen <edited>. Any thread on Xmen you can be sure he will be there spreading his misery.

_{Post edited by moderator: Please no personal attacks.}

OK, but a lot of games are like that. LotR comes to mind.

LOTR is similar however it requires shots from 2 flippers because of the right left ramp sequence rather than a single repeated shot. On Avengers pro, the left flipper could theoretically not exist and LOKI multiball can be achieved.

Back to LOTR, when the ball is locked and another enters the shooter lane, there is not an automatic potential feed right back to the flipper like exists on Avengers from the short plunge. The player has to figure out how to get the ball back under control off the plunge. The Avengers allows for a much easier method.

But yes, I agree the basic technique is similar.

On default setting don't you only need to complete the lower lanes 1 time to light the lock for all 3 locks? My trick was to light plunge and get one letter and let it drain...then soft plunge the ball save and you already have 2 letters of the 4 needed before the game really starts.

Of course that doesn't mean a lot to me as most shots for me brick on Avengers.