(Topic ID: 174124)

Xenon club...Members Only~Try Xeeeenon


By Yesh23

3 years ago



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  • 570 posts
  • 107 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 hours ago by vec-tor
  • Topic is favorited by 36 Pinsiders

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There are 570 posts in this topic. You are on page 10 of 12.
#451 86 days ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

I'm going to assume that the plastic cover is for the early production and the metal cover is for later...
A collection of serial numbers could add insightfulness to the variations to the two outhole trough design.

Serial number from mine with the plastic cover over the trough switches is 4099

#452 86 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

I've seen a metal cover too - this one is a different metal variation to what I've seen:
https://images.pinside.com/e/1d/97/e1d976f4171d504b3d465e2ac6e73d4cd3169748.jpg

Thought that looked familiar. My PF pic!

#453 86 days ago

My Xenon serial number with metal cover = 7188

#454 85 days ago

I've had 2 complete Xenon's plus parted out 2 PF's and all had the metal cover. My current cabinet is #11404. Near the end.

#455 84 days ago

I honestly don't know what that trough switch does. It confused one of my xenons where it was putting 2 balls on the shooter lane. Apparently this was a common problem. I disconnected the switch and the game worked fine after. So I never did reconnect it.

#456 83 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

I honestly don't know what that trough switch does. It confused one of my xenons where it was putting 2 balls on the shooter lane. Apparently this was a common problem. I disconnected the switch and the game worked fine after. So I never did reconnect it.

When you lift the playfield, the ball in the outhole rolls up to the trough area. When you lower the playfield that second ball is still sitting in the trough area activating that microswitch so the game knows where the two balls are next time you power up. It is important to get those switches properly setup so the game doesn't get confused with that microswitch being activated too long when the ball rolls across it, otherwise the game spits out two balls like you were seeing.

There could be some other reason for that trough microswitch but that's where I found it played it's part.

#457 83 days ago
Quoted from Quench:

When you lift the playfield, the ball in the outhole rolls up to the trough area. When you lower the playfield that second ball is still sitting in the trough area activating that microswitch so the game knows where the two balls are next time you power up. It is important to get those switches properly setup so the game doesn't get confused with that microswitch being activated too long when the ball rolls across it, otherwise the game spits out two balls like you were seeing.
There could be some other reason for that trough microswitch but that's where I found it played it's part.

I guess my switch was improperly adjusted but like I said, after disconnecting it out frustration, the game worked fine without it. Weird. I had 2 Xenons, the first one had no issue with double firing. The second one did and I swapped both PF's.

#458 83 days ago

Does anyone know where you can buy new metal clips for the bottom of the rollover targets? I snapped one in half while doing a play field swap. Thanks

#459 83 days ago

Try:Push on Nut Washer Lock Clip Faterner Retainer Kit For Metric Round Shaft M3-M12

#460 83 days ago
Quoted from vec-tor:

Try:Push on Nut Washer Lock Clip Faterner Retainer Kit For Metric Round Shaft M3-M12

Thank you!

#461 78 days ago

Finally getting a chance to swap my poor old worn out playfield and install my mods in something worthwhile.

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#462 77 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

Finally getting a chance to swap my poor old worn out playfield and install my mods in something worthwhile. [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Cool! Let us know how you like them.

#463 77 days ago

LOL... it would be a biased assessment, I made them myself ....

#464 76 days ago

Anyone have an extra inner Backglass laying around? 1 of the curved mirrors is broken on mine.

#465 76 days ago
Quoted from Jr99svt:

Anyone have an extra inner Backglass laying around? 1 of the curved mirrors is broken on mine.

You can cut the mirror off using a razor blade and replace it with one from the auto parts store.

#466 76 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

Finally getting a chance to swap my poor old worn out playfield and install my mods in something worthwhile. [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

I've never seen pop bumper LED rings like that. What are they, and where did you get them?

#467 76 days ago
Quoted from Orbian:

You can cut the mirror off using a razor blade and replace it with one from the auto parts store.

That's true. I talked to Greg Kmiec years ago about that. They were in fact the same cheap stick on mirrors sold at auto parts stores for extended viewing angle.

#468 76 days ago
Quoted from Orbian:

You can cut the mirror off using a razor blade and replace it with one from the auto parts store.

Quoted from Lovef2k:

That's true. I talked to Greg Kmiec years ago about that. They were in fact the same cheap stick on mirrors sold at auto parts stores for extended viewing angle.

Thank you

#469 76 days ago

Yea, Bally was all about low cost at that point.

#470 74 days ago
Quoted from indypinhead:

I've never seen pop bumper LED rings like that. What are they, and where did you get them?

I build them myself. I haven't listed them in the storefront yet but I have them in several colours and patterns. They have a vibration switch on the board that triggers a pattern change upon ball strike and I even have the patterns change after a pre-set number of strikes within a preset timeframe.

You can make an entire game out of just trying to get the patterns to change ....

This is just a static loop test ...

#471 73 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

I build them myself. I haven't listed them in the storefront yet but I have them in several colours and patterns. They have a vibration switch on the board that triggers a pattern change upon ball strike and I even have the patterns change after a pre-set number of strikes within a preset timeframe.
You can make an entire game out of just trying to get the patterns to change ....
This is just a static loop test ...

These are freaking cool. I want a set for my xenon that I'm restoring soon. Can you run them in attract mode as well?

Any idea on price per cap?

#472 73 days ago

To keep them simple (plug and play) each bumper has its own control board, that way you just replace the existing bulb with the cable from the board. I have adapters for both the #555 and BA9S and the cable just plugs into a connector on the board so it's not a permanent mod.

I suppose if I extended the counter reset timer on the firmware I could have it go into attract mode after so many minutes of not being hit.

I put these together last year for a buddy to take to Allentown but never got a chance to get back to the project afterward.

I'm ballparking $35CAD per cap (about $25USD) or 3 for $90CAD (4 would be $120CAD) but I really haven't looked at current pricing on the parts lately.

#473 73 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

To keep them simple (plug and play) each bumper has its own control board, that way you just replace the existing bulb with the cable from the board. I have adapters for both the #555 and BA9S and the cable just plugs into a connector on the board so it's not a permanent mod.
I suppose if I extended the counter reset timer on the firmware I could have it go into attract mode after so many minutes of not being hit.
I put these together last year for a buddy to take to Allentown but never got a chance to get back to the project afterward.
I'm ballparking $35CAD per cap (about $25USD) or 3 for $90CAD (4 would be $120CAD) but I really haven't looked at current pricing on the parts lately.

I'm in. I will be at Allentown this year. Hit me up if you have them finished by then.

#474 72 days ago

New to Xenon and sure loving her.

Thanks to the tips here, and on jeff-z's page, I was able to resolve all of the stucky ball issues, and have things dialed in quite nicely.

Few questions / observations if you have a moment:

1 - Opinions on BB infinity lighting? I tried different LED solutions, including some nice ones with built in caps hoping to mimic the pulse, but nothing is remotely close to running incandescents. Regardless, I was curious about any lighting ideas that people have used here? Again, I really like the fade effect that the incandescents give (and I'm normally a LED all the way person, but I just couldn't do it here.)

2 - Inserts and controlled lighting. WOW- My machine came with an Altek lamp driver, so I figured I was set. Unfortunately, all BUT my more premium LEDs show some ghosting (even though they are all anti-ghosting), and don't show anything noticeable on my other machines. Perhaps this era is quite picky?

3 - On top of the tube, it seems like most pictures I see have a steel cover over the switch base for the tube etc. Attaching a pic here. Does anyone have a part number on this? or is this a mod somewhere? Mine seems to be missing, but this would be a nice cosmetic addition.

Thanks again. Really liking the game, and quickly made it to the top 3 of our collection

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#475 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

New to Xenon and sure loving her.
Thanks to the tips here, and on jeff-z's page, I was able to resolve all of the stucky ball issues, and have things dialed in quite nicely.
Few questions / observations if you have a moment:
1 - Opinions on BB infinity lighting? I tried different LED solutions, including some nice ones with built in caps hoping to mimic the pulse, but nothing is remotely close to running incandescents. Regardless, I was curious about any lighting ideas that people have used here? Again, I really like the fade effect that the incandescents give (and I'm normally a LED all the way person, but I just couldn't do it here.)
2 - Inserts and controlled lighting. WOW- My machine came with an Altek lamp driver, so I figured I was set. Unfortunately, all BUT my more premium LEDs show some ghosting (even though they are all anti-ghosting), and don't show anything noticeable on my other machines. Perhaps this era is quite picky?
3 - On top of the tube, it seems like most pictures I see have a steel cover over the switch base for the tube etc. Attaching a pic here. Does anyone have a part number on this? or is this a mod somewhere? Mine seems to be missing, but this would be a nice cosmetic addition.
Thanks again. Really liking the game, and quickly made it to the top 3 of our collection [quoted image]

Is the jumper wire for running LEDs from the Alltek board connected?

Yes there should be a 2 piece cover for the tube shot micro. You will probably find pics on IPDB.com. Unfortunately they are hard to find if they are missing.

#476 72 days ago

Also I think the infinity lighting in the head are controlled buy the aux lamp driver so you should upgrade that to Alltek as well..

#477 72 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

Is the jumper wire for running LEDs from the Alltek board connected?
Yes there should be a 2 piece cover for the tube shot micro. You will probably find pics on IPDB.com. Unfortunately they are hard to find if they are missing.

Gah, that was it. Thank you very much. Since it was ledded with the altek installed in the project when I picked it up, I just had no idea the lamp driver was supposed to come with a jumper. Anyway, tested that and it looks GREAT now thank you.

re: 2piece cover, if anyone who has some time, or whenever would not mind taking some detailed photos of their unit from all sides along with some dimensions (or a scan), I'd love to try to piece it together from some scrap metal. As it is, I only see a top view, which seems fairly straight forward.

Again thanks, I didn't even know altek sold an aux. lamp board. I didn't actually detect any ghosting when I was testing LEDs in the front of the head. I did however not like the way the bulbs go on/off so quickly, as opposed to the incandescents which kind of have more of a pulse effect as they go around. Curious what people think about that.

On reading the manual looking for the part number, I see the mota kicker is supposed to kick to the right sling.. apparently I have been cheating all this time as mine was kicking to the right flipper . Not sure if it's my angle, but I suppose i'll try to adjust that kick-out too. Makes that a more scary shot for sure.

#478 72 days ago

Not a problem koji. I have done 2 xenon of swaps so far and now will be doing a third soon. So I know a little about it. I was also lucky to speak with the designer of xenon, Greg Kmiec via email about 12 years ago when first entering the hobby.
So you know how to hook up the jumper from the Alltek to the switched lamp bus line? Be sure not to tap into the gi circuit. You want the trace wire inside the lamp board insert that has a heavy bluish green wire soldered to it that feeds the lamps for tilt, game over, shoot again etc. There's also switched lamps that go around the xenon face on the back glass.

The cover will be very difficult to fabricate because it is very small and has 90 degree bends on all 4 sides. I may be a good idea to put a want ad out on the group and on the pinball classifieds site. Orrrr maybe a 3d printer can make them?

Take a look at this vid, pretty cool.

#479 72 days ago

I think the guy on the left with the mustache is Greg

#480 72 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

Not a problem koji. I have done 2 xenon of swaps so far and now will be doing a third soon. So I know a little about it. I was also lucky to speak with the designer of xenon, Greg Kmiec via email about 12 years ago when first entering the hobby.
So you know how to hook up the jumper from the Alltek to the switched lamp bus line? Be sure not to tap into the gi circuit. You want the trace wire inside the lamp board insert that has a heavy bluish green wire soldered to it that feeds the lamps for tilt, game over, shoot again etc. There's also switched lamps that go around the xenon face on the back glass.
The cover will be very difficult to fabricate because it is very small and has 90 degree bends on all 4 sides. I may be a good idea to put a want ad out on the group and on the pinball classifieds site. Orrrr maybe a 3d printer can make them?
Take a look at this vid, pretty cool.

Cool story. Yes, I've watched that video a few times. Love it. Was thinking just the other day how much people miss with this game in a public environment. Really need a dark room, with nothing else playing to appreciate the great sound and coordination with lighting in a dark room.. amazing.

Yes, the jumper made sense and I managed to get that in quickly on the controlled lamp circuit. huge improvement and it fixed all of the issues with the ghosting I was seeing. Always learning, now I know you need to jumper the altek ultimate lamp board

Hmm, sure, I'll ask around for the metal piece, but like you said, prob a long shot at this stage.. but who knows. Wish there was a part number somewhere. (couldn't find one in the manual).

Great you have come across a few of these projects. Definitely want to keep these machines alive. First one I've been able to play in my area, and I've had access to a lot of games. Funny how that works.

On that note, if you do happen to have a moment while you're swapping, I'd love to get detailed pics or scans so I can approx the dimensions of the piece I may need to try to make. I do have experience with modeling and 3D, so maybe something there.... or perhaps I might try to check out the Visual pinball table, it seems to have some more angles on the piece, not sure how accurately modeled it is, need to install my software again for that.

Thanks again for your help.

#481 72 days ago

Yup! I have a xenon pf that I haven't torn apart yet. I can get some pics together and post them.
Even if you had the part number I don't think it would help at this point.

#482 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

I'll ask around for the metal piece, but like you said, prob a long shot at this stage.. but who knows. Wish there was a part number somewhere. (couldn't find one in the manual).

See post #344 in this thread.

#484 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

re: 2piece cover, if anyone who has some time, or whenever would not mind taking some detailed photos of their unit from all sides along with some dimensions (or a scan), I'd love to try to piece it together from some scrap metal. As it is, I only see a top view, which seems fairly straight forward.

I have a spare set. They are lightly rusted but intact. Pm me your address and I'll send them to you.

#485 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

1 - Opinions on BB infinity lighting? I tried different LED solutions, including some nice ones with built in caps hoping to mimic the pulse, but nothing is remotely close to running incandescents. Regardless, I was curious about any lighting ideas that people have used here? Again, I really like the fade effect that the incandescents give (and I'm normally a LED all the way person, but I just couldn't do it here.)

I used Comet 10mm bullets for the infinity lights. That won’t help with the fade effect you want, but they are the closest to the “look” of incandescents I could find.

#486 72 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

I have a spare set. They are lightly rusted but intact. Pm me your address and I'll send them to you.

My lucky day, thank you so much. I will PM.

#487 72 days ago
Quoted from dothedoo:

I used Comet 10mm bullets for the infinity lights. That won’t help with the fade effect you want, but they are the closest to the “look” of incandescents I could find.

Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, these seem to be discontinued now. I'll probably just keep #44s and make sure they don't get burnt. Normally I get rid of them, but they do look pretty great in this instance . My son said it's getting too bright, but he's going to inspect again when he gets back from school. lol-

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#488 72 days ago

Thank you for this. I swear I looked, Guess I missed those pics in my searches.

I see now they are actually quite thick OE. Hopefully the spare set works out.

Curious why they didn't just cover it with a piece of plastic or if it was kind of an afterthought. I don't think it serves any functional use?

Thanks-

-Koji

#489 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, these seem to be discontinued now. I'll probably just keep #44s and make sure they don't get burnt. Normally I get rid of them, but they do look pretty great in this instance . My son said it's getting too bright, but he's going to inspect again when he gets back from school. lol-[quoted image]

https://www.cometpinball.com/products/retro-smd-bullet-bulbs

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#490 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

My lucky day, thank you so much. I will PM.

They are nothing fancy but they'll work ...

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#491 72 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

They are nothing fancy but they'll work ...[quoted image][quoted image]

They look 100% better than what I have now, thanks Zebulon
I sent you a PM, pls let me know if you didn't get it.

-Koji

#492 72 days ago
Quoted from koji:

Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, these seem to be discontinued now. I'll probably just keep #44s and make sure they don't get burnt. Normally I get rid of them, but they do look pretty great in this instance . My son said it's getting too bright, but he's going to inspect again when he gets back from school. lol-[quoted image]

I would change all of the 44's for 47's though. Less heat. Unless you are leaving the games on 24/7 incandescent aren't going to burn. I've had the same bulbs in my games for over 15 years without issue. If you aren't sure what you have, I believe the 44's usually have the gold colors bases and the 47's have silver.

#493 72 days ago
Quoted from zebulon:

They are nothing fancy but they'll work ...[quoted image][quoted image]

Some evapor rust will help and them chrome polish.

#494 72 days ago
Quoted from Zablon:

I would change all of the 44's for 47's though. Less heat. Unless you are leaving the games on 24/7 incandescent aren't going to burn. I've had the same bulbs in my games for over 15 years without issue. If you aren't sure what you have, I believe the 44's usually have the gold colors bases and the 47's have silver.

That's not always the case. Older 47s will have brass/gold base. the number is stamped on the base.

#495 71 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

That's not always the case. Older 47s will have brass/gold base. the number is stamped on the base.

Yeah, I've pulled all sorts over my pinball adventures. The biggest thing I have found, that will affect #44 and #47 equally is the death star, which is when they start to get burnt and reflective at the top, but are still lit. This gets them substantially more heated, and I believe this is when most of the damage occurs.

Great time for pinball though, where we have such great lighting options to either add more light, or more closely begin to resemble the original look if that is what you want. I have often wondered if they will ever be able to produce the newer lower power edison type bulbs in the 44/47 format.. would be crazy, but that would settle most of the old timers too

#496 71 days ago

Thanks Quench (as usual) It was early in the AM with that post and I must not had enough caffeine.

#497 71 days ago

Hi all Xenon owners! I wanted to make sure that you all know that we have launched the Xenon Hardtop for sale on our website. We have already started shipping also. Our site is www.outsideedgeproducts.com email us, or PM with any questions!

Thank you!

IMG_0213 (resized).jpgIMG_0217 (resized).jpg
#498 71 days ago
Quoted from Outsidedge:

Hi all Xenon owners! I wanted to make sure that you all know that we have launched the Xenon Hardtop for sale on our website. We have already started shipping also. Our site is www.outsideedgeproducts.com email us, or PM with any questions!
Thank you![quoted image][quoted image]

I want to see one of these installed in person. Most of my pf is pretty nice because it was factory (or operator early on) mylared but the standard wear is there between the flippers and most of the inserts look like they are as old as they are. Seems like unless I also replaced all the inserts I'd still have that problem even with the hardtop so I don't think it would be worth the effort as opposed to buying a NOS or repro PF and doing a full swap.

#499 71 days ago
Quoted from bobukcat:

I want to see one of these installed in person. Most of my pf is pretty nice because it was factory (or operator early on) mylared but the standard wear is there between the flippers and most of the inserts look like they are as old as they are. Seems like unless I also replaced all the inserts I'd still have that problem even with the hardtop so I don't think it would be worth the effort as opposed to buying a NOS or repro PF and doing a full swap.

It was nice of zebulon offer the covers. They are better than mine as I just noticed mine has a dent on one. Anyway if you need the 2 screws they are #6 panhead screws 2 and 3/4 inch long. They are the only 2 on the pf that are that long so you can't rob them from somewhere else.

Did you look into the bulb condoms to change the colors. You can also buy colored number 47 and 44 for the infinity lamps if no LED.

#500 71 days ago
Quoted from Lovef2k:

It was nice of zebulon offer the covers. They are better than mine as I just noticed mine has a dent on one. Anyway if you need the 2 screws they are #6 panhead screws 2 and 3/4 inch long. They are the only 2 on the pf that are that long so you can't rob them from somewhere else.
Did you look into the bulb condoms to change the colors. You can also buy colored number 47 and 44 for the infinity lamps if no LED.

Def. Yes, they are on the way . Very grateful to @zebulon, nothing beats OE.

Thanks for the screw info.

Hmm, didn't think about colored #47 bulbs but that's interesting. In that question, I was mostly interested about other people's set ups and what they preferred... just curiousity, as there are so many things one could try these days.

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