(Topic ID: 68603)

WTB: Cactus Canyon for up to $7,500


By kmoore88

5 years ago



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#1 5 years ago

Ideally I'm looking for a beater in the $5k range for a winter restoration project. Will pay up to $7,500 but the PF has to be pristine <edited: as in the PF not requiring significant restoration> for that price. It's a new world with the potential of remakes!

#2 5 years ago

Not to rain on your parade, but while the MM remake is a factor, I think a $5k beater CC is really really wishful...

#3 5 years ago

These WTB A-lister for pennies ads are so cool and funny! I don't think this joke will ever get old at all...

#4 5 years ago

Find the guy who paid $2000 for a CC a few months ago

#5 5 years ago
Quoted from NJGecko:

Not to rain on your parade, but while the MM remake is a factor, I think a $5k beater CC is really really wishful...

I represent the CC Demand side of the market. I would have snapped up a $10-12k CC a couple of months ago; just like I did a MM beater two years ago for $7,500. But I agree, it may take the Supply side awhile to come to the new reality. But here i am, waiting.

#6 5 years ago

<baby crying gif>

#7 5 years ago

Hmmm, who's whining?

#8 5 years ago
Quoted from kmoore88:

I represent the Demand side of the market. I

me too. 7501. Just kidding.

#9 5 years ago
Quoted from kmoore88:

It's a new world with the potential of remakes!

I doubt there is demand to remake this title. The cost of this game is solely due to there being so few of them made and it being the last B/W traditional game. It is a true collectible value only in my view.

The other collectible high cost games (MB, MM, BBB) are vastly superior playing games and better looking than CC in the view of many people.

I guess my point is don't expect this game to be remade and if it is remade you will not even sniff the same level of demand we saw for MMR.

#10 5 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

I doubt there is demand to remake this title. The cost of this game is solely due to there being so few of them made and it being the last B/W traditional game. It is a true collectible value only in my view.
The other collectible high cost games (MB, MM, BBB) are vastly superior playing games and better looking than CC in the view of many people.
I guess my point is don't expect this game to be remade and if it is remade you will not even sniff the same level of demand we saw for MMR.

Few folks have had a chance to play it. CCC is literally a game changer, in a very good way for CC. I believe the demand will be there for this.

#11 5 years ago

These kind of threads are very refreshing, in my humble opinion. The guy's got cash, and maybe somebody needs some.

#12 5 years ago

Yah, but CCC won't work with a remake. CC is expensive because there are SO few out there. It's not like MM & AFM where there are so few out there and they are great games.

Quoted from kmoore88:

CCC is literally a game changer

#13 5 years ago
Quoted from jalpert:

Yah, but CCC won't work with a remake. CC is expensive because there are SO few out there. It's not like MM & AFM where there are so few out there and they are great games.

They wont be rare nor "expensive" when a remake is done.

As far as CCC, not yet, but when they are re-made some one will port it because the demand will be there to do so. Remember when all the pinball market experts were saying a MM remake would NEVER happen?

#14 5 years ago
Quoted from kmoore88:

They wont be rare nor "expensive" when a remake is done.
As far as CCC, not yet, but when they are re-made some one will port it because the demand will be there to do so. Remember when all the pinball market experts were saying a MM remake would NEVER happen?

I agree with you I was about to buy a mm for 12k but people starting to talk about a remake and most laugh about it , but now who's laughing now ? And I think cc will be the second in remake ....there was a very low production bbb remake, so if they made that expensive remake what makes people think they will never make a cc remake ? Like kmoore88 said its a new world with the potential of remakes

#15 5 years ago
Quoted from Monarca1091:

And I think cc will be the second in remake ....there was a very low production bbb remake, so if they made that expensive remake what makes people think they will never make a cc remake ?

In my opinion, the only games that will economically justify a remake in Rick's eyes will be: MB and BBB if he can get the rights to it. I don't see AFM getting a remake, too similar to MM and many of those who ran up with cash for MMR will not want an AFM in their collection as well.

Also, the price on AFM is still a bit sketchy in my view on the used market. The nicest one I have ever seen, the HEP restore of the prototype, didn't even fetch 12k on EBay. I don't think any of the ones listed here for 10k and over actually sell for that, if so certainly not many. I think Rick knows the market is softer on AFM than the perception. Just my opinion of course.

#16 5 years ago

AFM should be less money than MM and I DO think it will be next.

#17 5 years ago

I agree and I agree. Though, I'm in for MMLE, but out for AFM at $6.5K or $7K. I'd rather buy a players game for $3,500 - $4,000.

Quoted from spfxted:

AFM should be less money than MM and I DO think it will be next.

#18 5 years ago
Quoted from jalpert:

I agree and I agree. Though, I'm in for MMLE, but out for AFM at $6.5K or $7K. I'd rather buy a players game for $3,500 - $4,000.

Where are you seeing player's AFMs for that kind of money? The ones I see are always at least a couple grand more than that, and rough at that price.

#19 5 years ago

OP, if you were so secure in the fact that CC will be remade, why would you want to buy a used one instead of waiting for the remake? I don't think CC owners are shaking in their boots just yet.

#20 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Where are you seeing player's AFMs for that kind of money? The ones I see are always at least a couple grand more than that, and rough at that price.

That's where they'll be priced if new ones come out.

#21 5 years ago
Quoted from davewtf:

That's where they'll be priced if new ones come out.

Oh sure, that I could see. But until an announcement they're not gonna soften that much.

#22 5 years ago
Quoted from jalpert:

Yah, but CCC won't work with a remake. CC is expensive because there are SO few out there. It's not like MM & AFM where there are so few out there and they are great games.

No way. Rick said during his speech that they can change the code or improve it on some games. Namely CC

Remake wise MB cannot be remade, but CC with new code may certainly be coming soon

#23 5 years ago

Do you think it would be possible for these remakes or new titles for that matter to include different sets of code? Basically create one table but then have various rules which can be selected, thus providing a different experience for the player. Given the shift to home markets that seems like an interested idea.

#24 5 years ago
Quoted from Betelgeuse:

OP, if you were so secure in the fact that CC will be remade, why would you want to buy a used one instead of waiting for the remake? I don't think CC owners are shaking in their boots just yet.</

CC is the only WMS/Bally title I am interested in adding to my collection given I have the other three I have always wanted. I want a restoration and modding project and I'm not willing to pay what they have been going for given the possibility of a re-make. I'm content to wait as long as it takes and if the remakes never happens to drive the price down so be it. But given MMr I will never buy a used CC for more than I posted. Perhaps there are enough buyers out there that will keep buying CC at pre-MMr prices....but I don't think so.

#25 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

These kind of threads are very refreshing, in my humble opinion. The guy's got cash, and maybe somebody needs some.

lol

I bet there are a shit ton of us who have $5-7.5k cash for a really nice CC.

#26 5 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

I bet there are a shit ton of us who have $5-7.5k cash for a really nice CC.

I could use some cash, but no, I don't have a CC.

#27 5 years ago

I'd pay $6.5K-$7K for AFM, any more than that would be out.

#28 5 years ago

So a MM remake was announced. That doesn't mean people are rushing to sell their CC. This game is likely not to be remade or if it is, it won't lower the value of the original for the following reasons:

1) CC doesn't have the appeal of MM. So it won't be as easy of a sell

2) Williams abhors software modifications such as CCC. Rick has stated that something like CCC cannot be allowed by Williams. So a remake won't ship with this.

3) CCC requires P-Roc. It seems unlikely the this will support the new chipset - ever. It sounds like the old style driver board and CPU board are going to be unified. A P-Roc would be impossible since it only supports the CPU board side. There are more differences that are problematic such as no lamp matrix so wiring on the CPU side will be drastically different. These changes further make a standard wpc95 driver board unlikely to work. Someone could replace all the boards with old style, but he would also need to get ahold of an old wiring harness. And then he would need to mount lamp sockets and wire them all. Then who knows if the input transformer even is set up correctly. I really think P-Roc is out here.

4) This makes CCC impossible. It's not a "they'll figure it out". It's a deal breaker. No CCC, the demand for a CC that can run CCC stays high.

Therefore, I think its likely a remake won't happen for CC. And if it does, its years away and it won't cause CC to be $5000.

Finally, the entire pinball market did not collapse due to one remake. MM will be out next year. If someone wants an AFM, there's no announced AFM and if one comes out (likely in my opinion) it'll probably be 2015. That's a hell of a long time to be waiting around. I don't see any of the remade games selling for under $7500, probably $8000 no matter the title. A fish tales cost as much as a MM to make.

I disagree that you represent the supply side of the CC market. I doubt anyone will sell you a $5k CC here. I'd take a $2500 BBB. That doesn't mean I represent the supply side.

Finally, if anyone has a beater CC, I'll pay $6k now and if the playfield is pristine, $8500. I doubt anyone will take me up on these offers but they're $1k more then you're offering which should definitely seal the deal.

#29 5 years ago

^^^
That's bad form offerng more in his wtb ad.

#30 5 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

A Fish Tales cost as much as a MM to make.

that may be true but likely it costs a whole lot less than $8K to make MMR. So, it does not preclude remake of FT or any title for less.

#31 5 years ago
Quoted from rai:

that may be true but likely it costs a whole lot less than $8K to make MMR. So, it does not preclude remake of FT or any title for less.

I disagree. I'm sure there's room for profit. But I doubt anything could be remade that could be sold for under $7k and still be a worthwhile venture.

Quoted from davewtf:

^^^
That's bad form offerng more in his wtb ad.

Not in this case. His wtb is not a serious wtb thread. Offering lowball prices and justifying your reason isn't a legit wtb thread.

#32 5 years ago

I think it's more than fair asking to pay up to $7500 for a well worn machine that cost around $4000 new.

#33 5 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

Not in this case. His wtb is not a serious wtb thread. Offering lowball prices and justifying your reason isn't a legit wtb thread.

He was joking.

#34 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I think it's more than fair asking to pay up to $7500 for a well worn machine that cost around $4000 new.

Then you might as well say it's fair to ask to pay $3000. After all, it's no longer new and it has some wear. Shouldn't cost as much as it was new, right?

#35 5 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Then you might as well say it's fair to ask to pay $3000. After all, it's no longer new and it has some wear. Shouldn't cost as much as it was new, right?

Not at all. Some things do appreciate in value depending on who is looking for one. But I do believe he used the term "beater" in his description.

#36 5 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

Not in this case. His wtb is not a serious wtb thread. Offering lowball prices and justifying your reason isn't a legit wtb thread.

Wow. Please post the rules for what constitutes a "legit" wtb thread. Or what address can i send my posts to for you to pre-approve. It certainly is a legit post, troll somewhere else.

#37 5 years ago
Quoted from hank527:

No way. Rick said during his speech that they can change the code or improve it on some games. Namely CC
Remake wise MB cannot be remade, but CC with new code may certainly be coming soon

Rick did mentioned that, BUT just for some degree and not CCC (Williams will not sign off for that). Hardware incompatible is another hurdle. P-Roc may look into that if the demand is there.

So basically you got two "IF"s: If PPS does remake without knowing when (mostly likely after AFM and possibily MB) or at what price (most likey >$8k). If PRoc determines there are enough demand for the new hardware, which by then God knows how much and when?

#38 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

Not at all. Some things do appreciate in value depending on who is looking for one. But I do believe he used the term "beater" in his description.

Not for $7500 he didn't.

Quoted from kmoore88:

Will pay up to $7,500 but the PF has to be pristine for that price

#39 5 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Not for $7500 he didn't.

The cabinet could have holes in it, the boards shot, etc, etc, etc..........

#40 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

The cabinet could have holes in it, the boards shot, etc, etc, etc..........

Yup, exactly...but unlikely to RobT's point. I wasn't implying an overall CQ quality pin for 7500. I just don't want to drop $1500 in a PF restore for a trashed PF at that price.

#41 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

The cabinet could have holes in it, the boards shot, etc, etc, etc..........

That is something that can happen, but is pretty rare. Chances are if the PF is pristine, the cab isn't going to have holes in it or shots boards, etc, etc, etc....

Quoted from kmoore88:

Yup, exactly...but unlikely to RobT's point. I wasn't implying an overall CQ quality pin for 7500. I just don't want to drop $1500 in a PF restore for a trashed PF at that price.

I hear ya.

I think what Odin said was fair. I.e., if you were looking for a "beater" CC, offering $7500.00 is not unreasonable at all.

#42 5 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Chances are if the PF is pristine, the cab isn't going to have holes in it

Sometimes they even separate where the legs attach, and that can mean major work. I know a lot of people are up in arms over people now wanting a deal on some of these yet to be remade titles. But all I read into it was a guy looking for a beater as a restoration project.

#43 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

all I read into it was a guy looking for a beater as a restoration project.

The original post is clearly more about the butthurt over MMr than it is a serious request for a CC project.

#44 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

all I read into it was a guy looking for a beater as a restoration project.

And like I said in the post above yours, I don't think offering $7500.00 for a "beater" CC is unreasonable either.

#45 5 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

In my opinion, the only games that will economically justify a remake in Rick's eyes will be: MB and BBB if he can get the rights to it. I don't see AFM getting a remake, too similar to MM and many of those who ran up with cash for MMR will not want an AFM in their collection as well.
Also, the price on AFM is still a bit sketchy in my view on the used market. The nicest one I have ever seen, the HEP restore of the prototype, didn't even fetch 12k on EBay. I don't think any of the ones listed here for 10k and over actually sell for that, if so certainly not many. I think Rick knows the market is softer on AFM than the perception. Just my opinion of course.

Why border get the right from capcom when you have the bally/Williams and there's a lot of people wanting a cc? Plus to do a mb you will need to get the rights from universal , and I think it will be hard for them to get , but if they do I definitely in for one .

#46 5 years ago

Maybe some one has one that is worn out, and doesn't have the money to restore it or knowledge to restore it themselves. In that case they could sell it and use that money to buy a NIB MMr. I'm done here now.

#47 5 years ago

It seems to me remaking CC is a chicken or egg situation. I don't think Rick will remake CC unless he is certain there is enough demand, and it's unlikely there will be enough demand unless people are certain they can get CCC to work on it.

Once MMr is out, the new system will be available to play with, but who is willing to devote all the time it might take to make P-ROC compatible with the new system (if it's even possible) without knowing if CC will be remade?

#48 5 years ago
Quoted from o-din:

I think it's more than fair asking to pay up to $7500 for a well worn machine that cost around $4000 new.

$4000 ????

My distributor had them NIB for $1500 and could not get rid of them.

#49 5 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

It seems to me remaking CC is a chicken or egg situation. I don't think Rick will remake CC unless he is certain there is enough demand, and it's unlikely there will be enough demand unless people are certain they can get CCC to work on it.
Once MMr is out, the new system will be available to play with, but who is willing to devote all the time it might take to make P-ROC compatible with the new system (if it's even possible) without knowing if CC will be remade?

Yep, it is a funny situation.

But, if there is money to be made, somebody will make a adapter harness from the Proc to the driver board, or if necessary, from the Proc to the Proc's own driver boards.

#50 5 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

It seems to me remaking CC is a chicken or egg situation. I don't think Rick will remake CC unless he is certain there is enough demand, and it's unlikely there will be enough demand unless people are certain they can get CCC to work on it.

IF these got remade (which is still a fully up the air IF): If the playfield was wired like the original, you could theoretically hook it up to a Rottendog driver board and a P-ROC, instead of ... whatever. But that's a really minor possibility, given how they're making the MM PF with the driver boards underneath and whatnot.

/just sayin

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