(Topic ID: 237377)

WPC transformer wiring anomaly

By Durzel

5 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 7 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by arakissun
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

6E4FA3DF-F6C2-4719-9BEA-9EE31B4E18F0 (resized).jpeg
Screenshot 2019-03-01 16.12.00 (resized).png
888E7D36-60E0-4150-B734-6B35460CF65E (resized).jpeg
CECB3ABB-563E-4F77-BE3A-07FC5B519C2B (resized).jpeg
CDE67FBD-1714-4578-A7A0-488DAAE49D53 (resized).jpeg
B3A3C2E4-7D31-41FB-89BB-ED6785FF464C (resized).jpeg
F77EFA15-7439-4AB3-9CED-5F56F67D3B37 (resized).jpeg
8FDC19CE-1ED3-4AA2-B221-C3DDBAE3035E (resized).jpeg
19AC3E62-1D9E-4092-9362-70EBA40FC486 (resized).jpeg
81740104-8C0B-41B7-800C-268524BF17CD (resized).jpeg
215991F6-4708-4CFF-85E1-C45F20C9904F (resized).jpeg
B87919EE-260F-4CF1-96C9-91F2085F6201 (resized).jpeg

#1 5 years ago

Hi

I've got a TAF that I'm trying to wire up a secondary power adapter to, by using unused pins on the female 9 pin connector (per instructions for the unit)

I have discovered when attempting to install this that the female 9 pin plug is wired incorrectly, at least according to the schematics (WPC schematic available here: http://arcarc.xmission.com/Pinball/PDF%20Pinball%20Misc/Williams%20WPC%20Schematic%20manual.pdf)...

CDE67FBD-1714-4578-A7A0-488DAAE49D53 (resized).jpegCDE67FBD-1714-4578-A7A0-488DAAE49D53 (resized).jpeg

(I'm in the UK and the pin was sourced from Europe, so 230 VAC is the correct configuration)

I have established that the male end of the cable, the one connected to the transformer, is wired correctly according to the above schematic.

The female end - connected to the line filter box, however, looks like this:

81740104-8C0B-41B7-800C-268524BF17CD (resized).jpeg81740104-8C0B-41B7-800C-268524BF17CD (resized).jpeg

215991F6-4708-4CFF-85E1-C45F20C9904F (resized).jpeg215991F6-4708-4CFF-85E1-C45F20C9904F (resized).jpeg

The two wrong wires I can see are:
- white (plugged into 4 - white/brown on male, should be in 7 - white/orange)
- one end of orange loop (plugged into 6 - brown, should be in 9 - orange)

Now, I know the following:

1. The game works 100% with no issues I can see
2. I have the correct transformer - 5610-12835-00
3. The male plug is wired correctly per the schematic
4. The female plug is wired incorrectly, the white and one of the orange loop wires are in the wrong places)

Does anyone know the voltage configuration of the wires that come off the transformer and can explain why it would work despite being wrong?

Is it safe for me to repin the white and one orange pins to their correct position? (one to the left in both cases) ?

Does my line filter box look right?

888E7D36-60E0-4150-B734-6B35460CF65E (resized).jpeg888E7D36-60E0-4150-B734-6B35460CF65E (resized).jpeg

Thanks in advance for any help.

19AC3E62-1D9E-4092-9362-70EBA40FC486 (resized).jpeg19AC3E62-1D9E-4092-9362-70EBA40FC486 (resized).jpegB3A3C2E4-7D31-41FB-89BB-ED6785FF464C (resized).jpegB3A3C2E4-7D31-41FB-89BB-ED6785FF464C (resized).jpeg8FDC19CE-1ED3-4AA2-B221-C3DDBAE3035E (resized).jpeg8FDC19CE-1ED3-4AA2-B221-C3DDBAE3035E (resized).jpegCECB3ABB-563E-4F77-BE3A-07FC5B519C2B (resized).jpegCECB3ABB-563E-4F77-BE3A-07FC5B519C2B (resized).jpegF77EFA15-7439-4AB3-9CED-5F56F67D3B37 (resized).jpegF77EFA15-7439-4AB3-9CED-5F56F67D3B37 (resized).jpegB87919EE-260F-4CF1-96C9-91F2085F6201 (resized).jpegB87919EE-260F-4CF1-96C9-91F2085F6201 (resized).jpeg

#2 5 years ago

Did more digging in the schematic and noticed this under "Optional Power Connections"...

Screenshot 2019-03-01 16.12.00 (resized).pngScreenshot 2019-03-01 16.12.00 (resized).png

This looks to be how mine is wired. This would mean, presumably, that my machine is jumpered for 206 VAC instead of 230 VAC? In the UK we have 230 VAC so I don't entirely know why this is working....

#3 5 years ago

It works because it is close enough to the correct voltage you're getting to work. 206 is a little less than 230.

It is putting stress on your power supply components in the machine if you are really getting 230 and it is wired for 206 though. The regulators are having to disapate more heat (more power) to reduce the incoming voltage they are getting down to 12V and 5V.

The WMS transformer is a multi wound coil. Each output coil is a ratio from an input coil

When you use the 230V incoming tap, the ratio is 18 on the incoming side, and the outgoing side 12 volt wires are 1, meaning there are 18 turns on the left for every 1 turn on the right.

We now have math we can use. (yes I'm leaving out RMS/p-p,ripple, we're in theory here)

If it were tapped for 230, and your mains were 230V; take 230 divide by 18 and multiply by 1 and you get 12.7V

But yours is tapped for 203V which is a 16 to 1 ratio. So 230V (if that is actually what you're getting on the mains), divided by 16 times 1 is 14.375.

So you're still feeding 12-14 volts into the 12 volt regulator to have it make 12VDC from AC.

Low tapping the transformer is used in weak power areas to ensure there is enough voltage outputting the transformer to meet the requirements of the regulators. It is also sometimes used when a regulator goes weak, and the machine starts resetting when the 5 volts goes low; because as you see it increases the voltage going to the boards in the machine by just a little.

The problem is if you were to put it on 115 instead, then you would have a 9 to 1 ratio, and when you fed in 230v you would end up with 25.4V going to the 12V regulator, which would burn it out. It can handle a little over voltage, but NOT twice it's over voltage.

The correct procedure is to measure you're lowest incoming voltage, and set the tap to the closest lower voltage tap it has on the incoming, without breaking the 200/100 barrier. Fewer resets, snappier game, and best protection.

Quoted from Durzel:

Did more digging in the schematic and noticed this under "Optional Power Connections"...
[quoted image]
This looks to be how mine is wired. This would mean, presumably, that my machine is jumpered for 206 VAC instead of 230 VAC? In the UK we have 230 VAC so I don't entirely know why this is working....

#4 5 years ago

Thanks, that's very comprehensive and quite brilliant . A lot of it went over my head, I'll be honest.

In the UK officially it is 230 VAC - 6% + 10% which translates to 216.2 V – 253.0 V, at 50hz. In my experience it would be more common to see it over 230 than under, indeed looking at the logs for my UPS at work it is pretty consistent at ~245V. My pins at home aren't plugged into a UPS though so the power input is not smoothed (that could be a prudent next step).

Seems I would benefit from repinning the female plug to 230 VAC then... ?

#5 5 years ago

Repinned the female plug to 230 VAC, and she still lives!...

6E4FA3DF-F6C2-4719-9BEA-9EE31B4E18F0 (resized).jpeg6E4FA3DF-F6C2-4719-9BEA-9EE31B4E18F0 (resized).jpeg

Some interesting observations..

- The transformer hum I had (wasn't loud, but you could hear it in attract mode) before is gone. It's dead silent now.
- Thing hand and bookcase move slower now, the hand in particular feels about 20% slower than it was before. No effect on gameplay really, it all works the same
- The Thing eject coil used to kick the ball slightly airborne which meant it wouldn't smoothly transition to the UR flipper. Now it's perfect.
- Chair and swamp eject are softer, doesn't affect gameplay too much although it's a touch too soft for my liking
- Flippers feel mostly the same, if there's a difference I can't feel it. Hasn't changed shot making.

Feels like a different game to be honest, not in a bad way. That transformer hum was on my To Do list so happy that's resolved itself.

#6 5 years ago

Everything you listed can be explained by the change you made to the power tap. Enjoy the game.

Chris Hibler - CARGPB #31
Http://chrishiblerpinball.com/contact
http://www.PinWiki.com/ - The new place for pinball repair info

1 week later
#7 5 years ago

I remember when I did this to my Demolition Man.
When I config with the right pins to right voltage combination form my country now the flippers are stronger like they must be.Before this they were little weak even rebulded with new parts.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
From: $ 159.95
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
PinSound
Sound/Speakers
26,000 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Auckland, NZ
$ 180.00
Cabinet Parts
Starcade Amusement
Cabinet parts
$ 299.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
Led
$ 159.00
Cabinet Parts
Pinball Haus
Cabinet parts
From: $ 1.00
Boards
Slap Save Creations
Boards
From: $ 8.99
Cabinet - Other
NO GOUGE PINBALL™
Other
10,500 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Roselle, IL
From: $ 11.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Twisted Tokens
Toys/Add-ons
$ 109.95
Electronics
PinSound
Electronics
From: $ 209.00
11,695
Machine - For Sale
Livermore, CA
$ 219.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Lit Frames
Decorations
$ 1,059.00
Flipper Parts
Mircoplayfields
Flipper parts
$ 24.25
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
The MOD Couple
Toys/Add-ons
$ 30.00
Playfield - Other
Avid Creations Wireforms
Other
$ 30.00
Playfield - Other
YouBentMyWookie
Other
$ 199.95
Electronics
PinSound
Electronics
$ 159.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Sparky Pinball
Toys/Add-ons
16,500 (OBO)
From: $ 11.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
Toys/Add-ons
$ 29.99
Electronics
NO GOUGE PINBALL™
Electronics
$ 53.99
Eproms
Matt's Basement Arcade
Eproms
$ 84.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
GMods
Toys/Add-ons
$ 62.00
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lermods
Toys/Add-ons
$ 49.99
From: $ 27.00
Boards
KAHR.US Circuits
Boards
$ 27.99
Rubber/Silicone
Comet Pinball
Rubber/Silicone
$ 41.99
Lighting - Interactive
Lee's Parts
Interactive
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/wpc-transformer-wiring-anomaly and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.