God help that WOZ.

Anyone know why there is a pro on location when LE's at the 6500 pricepoint have not all been made yet?????

Guessing LE owners get to startup the company with capitol. Then the pro owner gets to come in later and have one to play while LE owners still wait for theirs. I am really hating the way this JJP rollout is going down.

Glad you got to play one though

Thank you for sharing

Every single one of those problems you listed is due to non configuration of the game.

Vuk needs the coil power increased a few points - configuration
Clear ball locks at game end - configuration

Ball not entering right playfield is because you didn't spell rainbow. You can hit the ramp 100 times, rainbow starts twister and the subsequent munchkin modes. Have to spell rainbow to start it.

Seems like no problem other than no configuration.

Looks like I'm calling the arcade tomorrow.

preemptive crickets

Then get your refund.

At some point, Keith needs to add an "auto" setting for non-flipper coils with an accompanying learning table so the game can configure itself. I know he's done it before on his old Stern pins (like the Otto kickout on TSPP, which is notoriously picky).

I love how when a frustrated future woz owner posts how they are not happy about how things are going and the response is always well just get a refund. That's just great I put up $6500 or even $7500 two years ago dealt with all the delays and bullshit lies just to ask for a refund and get nothing for you putting up the money and waiting two years. I think it is bullshit they are building regulars while the ones who put up the money are getting bypassed.

Regulars were purchased along with LE's. distribs/ops bought LE's and regulars in parallel.

They are being built in the order purchased.

Murfe88 If that is truley what is going on here I am right there with you.

Get a refund has to be the most Ahole answer I have ever heard.

nepasth you do understand what I am saying right? Certain people are being catered too that is obvious now. It was stated that they are made and shipped in the order they were bought.

That is just not possible unless this is a prototype machine for pros.

I am just trying to figure out if they are in fact pumping out pros while first time buyers of LE (aka company startup money) are still waiting around with no word on order date.

That 7K is about all I could save to spend on a pin and would take a solid year without selling a machine. Are you telling me nepasth you bought one early 2011 and are happy to not have your machine and someone is playing a pro?

I can agree to disagree but in the future try something called tact.

Pinchroma I heard nothing of Pro machines being sold until the price ticked up to 7500

At least that what the emails were leading us to believe at the time.

If it is in fact first come first serve still I have no issues. Zero. Anxcious as ever but A Ok.

Jack needs standards out there on location and in distributor showrooms to help keep JJP alive. It makes sense to me. Yes, I have a WOZ ECLE on order and I am way back in the line. Let's just say there are 50 or 100 standards being scattered out in the world in advance of most of the ECLEs. I might get my ECLE 3 or 4 weeks later because of this. If that means JJP is a healthy going concern, so much the better. I want them around to build the Hobbit LE that I have on order too. It is just good business.

The standards were always available. They were on the pinball sales website as well.

You will notice the standards aren't in customer homes. HU games were 99% LE's. there was a thread here on pinside a long time ago where people stated their game numbers and there were over 100 pinsiders with LE's and a I think 1 or 2 standards.

They are all being built in order with very few exceptions like the game for the Seattle pinball museum or papa.

The other thing I notice is not many (any) people complaining about the Metallica order of events? I bought mine a week ago (pro) and it came already. Way ahead of the people who purchased 4 months ago. LE's were announced first but all the distribs got pro's.

Getting distribs and ops games has always been an industry standard. No one bats an eye at that normally.

When I ordered my ECLE in March of 2012, I had the option of standard or ECLE. I chose the ECLE.

That's really not a fair comparison though is it? WOZ owners put their money down years ago. Not months. Not saying there's anything wrong with how JJP's doing things, but you can't empathize with their frustration?

Because distributors sell more games when they have a sample on the floor.

All standards are numbered at this point. Haven't hit 1000 standards yet. People can pick their standard number as well though so the actual number doesn't mean anything with regards to order.

As I posted earlier, a few days of production to put some standards out there doesn't make me feel like I'm being screwed.

I absolutely empathize because I know I'm working my fingers to the bone on development and packaging and infrastructure and Keith/Ted are working ungodly hours to make sure everyone is happy. Production is ramping up quickly.

It is very difficult to train people properly especially without a pre-established precedent. I run call centers as part of my day job.. It takes weeks of training just to get someone to read a screen and answer a call properly when everything is handed to them. A skilled position assembling parts/playfields is a big feat. Quality is everything. Do something right the first time so you don't have to fix it later.

The principle is exactly the same.

Now that's a quality response. Thanks, Alex.

I thought the play fields were seconds.

Don't know if it matters, but at least some distributors bought translites and backglasses, etc. We've seen them here on Pinside in pictures as some of the first WOZ's hit their showroom. And some distributors had them for sale.

LTG : )

Alex, you ordered your pro 3 weeks ago and Metallica was announced 2 months ago .

So right from the off when ECLE were available for $6500, standards were available and being sold? How much were they listed for on the Pinball Sales website? $5500? I think a few more would have been bought by home users if that was the price. If the standards were listed at $6500 then why would an op choose a standard over the ECLE?

I don't think so ? I don't remember anyone other that TaylorVA getting a standard when LEs were still available . Who knows a lot of things have happened in 2.5 years .

Actually Pros are usually last...LEs were first for a while there including xmen and I think avengers.

And this whole Standards going to ops and distributors alongside LEs was stated all along by JJP. I'm sure Joe Blow home user isn't getting a standard now first for home use. They probably have to provide proof of distributorship or location. It's not a big deal...it gets more people playing it.

Well I don't know but I strongly suspect that standard WOZs were being sold from Day 1 or maybe even before then to 'certain parties' for 'an undisclosed price' good enough to tempt them over the ECLE for $6500.

A mixed bag ,acdc pro first

I can't say Fact and should not have said anything .

Um... I'm not too certain of this one. I didn't really want to get into this... but this very thing has been bugging me a bit.

First, here's a direct quote from the October 16, 2011 newsletter:

"We are now taking Pre-Orders for the Wizard of Oz Pinball, (Non- ECLE) that has a link below. The Pre-Order Price is $6500.00 with just a $250.00 deposit. The first 1,000 games will be numbered. If you would like a specific number, when ordering please provide number(s) requests in the comments section."

This would imply that this was the first announcement of a Standard version. There are NO links in all prior newsletters to order the Standard version, but they appear in every newsletter past this.

But we don't even have to assume, we can go and confirm it via the Way Back Machine. First, see this snapshot from August 20, 2011 showing only the ECLE available for sale on PinballSales.com, and then this snapshot from November 5, 2011 showing both ECLE and Standard machines for sale.

Hundreds and hundreds of LEs were sold before October 2011. Now, were Standards available earlier than this in secret? Who knows, besides someone who bought one. But I certainly can't see a huge percentage of Day 1 orders being Standards, and in a video posted a few weeks ago, 10 out of 12 machines in final testing where the trim color was visible... were Standards.

I can certainly see building some "out of sequence" Standards simply to get machines out there in the public eye. But while production is so slow and while you have so many customers waiting 29-30 months for their games, I would keep that to a maximum of 10-20% of production.

I found out about Woz in January release and ordered in early March.....

I don't recall have the option to buy a regular at that time but it may have been that there was talk about the LE discount price expiring soon and the price going up and when that happened you'd be able to get a regular at 6500.....

If you could order a regular from day one, what did it cost? $6500? Why would you order a Regular when you could have had an LE for the same price if that was the case?.....

That said, who cares, its only pinball...not some IRS conspiracy....hmmm, maybe it is