It is your claim Jack is actively looking for investors? Just trying to sure I understand exactly what you are saying here.

Just going by post titles, I stopped after 5 WOZ threads and 2 JJP threads. Now, I admit I didn't go and click on every thread for content, but why would you even claim something so obviously provable?

WOZ @ PPE - First Video [attachments]
User last replied: 1 hour ago. Most recent reply: 19 minutes ago

Was starting JJP a good idea? [attachments]
User last replied: 1 week ago. Most recent reply: 6 days ago

WOZ confirmed shipping date [attachments]
User last replied: 1 week ago. Most recent reply: 1 week ago

Any Linux Users/Developers Curious About JJP's System? [attachments]
User last replied: 1 week ago. Most recent reply: 1 week ago

Confirmed WOZ is Headed to P.P.E. & HD Video Today [attachments]
User last replied: 2 weeks ago. Most recent reply: 1 week ago

excited...new woz le owner [attachments]
User last replied: 2 weeks ago. Most recent reply: 2 weeks ago

Latest update from Jack on WOZ........ [attachments]
User last replied: 3 weeks ago. Most recent reply: 2 weeks ago

If the game needed stronger flipper coils why hasn't JJP installed them already? That's a 10-20 min job max.

Owned

If the game needed stronger flipper coils why hasn't JJP installed them already? That's a 10-20 min job max.

*facepalm*

They are adjustable! Ad-just-a-ble!!!
(starts pulling out hair.)

Oh don't be so dramatic! The gist of his post still stands because if that was my showstopper pinball game I would adjust the flipper coils to play their best NOW rather than letting it play badly and telling people they're Ad-just-a-ble!

Adjustable in strength??? How so???

And I agree with you Chocky- I don't know why the game was setup to play that way either. (Possibly for the dozens of kids attending PPE perhaps?) At least we know that it's not going to be an issue when the game ships.

How so???

I'm guessing a more sophisticated/broader take on the Stern "Coil Pulse Power" setting? Maybe even giving the menu option to tune each coil under the PF independently?

Keith?

surely. Capcom even had such a system in their pins I believe. not exactly rocket science amirite>?

Thats one pretty looking machine, a work of art. Looking forward to heading down the yellow brick road.

Ahhhhh RGR RGR RGR RGR ..... lol

Read your post again .... The first sentence contradicts the remaining statements.

How can it be "quality" if the flippers are no good and we don't know how long it will last?

I need to get you back to Auckland and get you on the kiwi beer and teach you the RD way .....

Dave.

lol Dave, yeah well the quality is things like the LEDS, playfield design, cabinet artwork but the flipper coils...... aint a matter of quality as such just a issue of putting in the right part. The coils are not performing badly due to them being shitty but it appears to be the wrong one.

Hmm as for the game lasting, there is no reason to suggest it wont, but from what homepin says abou the LCD... It is alittle concerning but then that is a product that was not made by JJP.

I am sure you have seen that I have said if this game is shit then I am giving up playing... again...

If WOZ is good then l'll be back for the regular meet in March??? Will you have a WOZ by then??

<quote>All it takes is one or two actors to do the pinball specific call outs but they seem to have everything triggering clips of bad actors badly re-enacting phrases from the film.</quote>

You do realize they are dead?

Still, if you can use the real actor's in movie clips, you should be able to lift some dialogue that fits the action.

I think most of the voice actor's are fine, except the witch. She's too Brooklyn and not enough Mid-west.

Yep ... these are sound clips, and you can't hire back dead actors to create new, high-quality ones that match the modes. Definitely room for improvement ... but it's software, that can be upgraded easily once the clips are refined.

The quality in the game is in the fit, finish, design, technology, etc... All else seems to have great potential with software.

"It's OK Wallet, don't listen to the bad men."

JJP thread program

10 Start JJP about something new
20 everyone starts going crazy about new whatever
30 instigators around page 2-3 start some type of typical argument
40 others start losing interest
50 someone starts a new JJP thread
60 instigators realise no one is listening in previous thread
70 GOTO 20

Infinite regress I know, but as is life here apparently.

Can you post this in the form of a flow chart?

Lol! Wiping coffee of the laptop. Thanks dude.

Sometimes pinside in the morning is a TRIP! There has to be a silent group out there who just likes to play pinball. All pinball. And the more pinball, the better. Church of Pinball - it's Sunday, get out of bed and go to Church

Akuma, seriously, just stand mute on things you know utterly and absolutely nothing about.

As for the weak flippers, the left flipper definitely looked a little sluggish. I have no doubt they'll rectify this problem. The game hasn't even gone out on proper test yet.

It's also amusing how those who have gone on record as hating the WOZ theme have to continuously update us on how they hate the sound and music on every update or new video posted. It's redundant. Yes, we understand that if you hate the WOZ theme that you're probably not going to like the music and sound callouts.

The lights and look of the playfield are just phenomenal. I enjoy these update videos, but they're all sort of vanilla to me at this point. I don't think I'm going to get any MORE excited until I'm standing in front of a shipped finished product, ready to play.

re Keiths post: Thats attention to detail! Can you imagine the diabolical rules he is concoting for this game!
Now get over to my house and set a GC score on my lotr!

Many manufacturers have done this....Stern, Capcom, Alvin G, Inder, Spinball (and probably more). Most do it through software, but the latter two did it through movable jumpers on the PSB.

Where are the pictures NimblePin?

Indeed. What a good idea. Lucky for me, my church is attached to my house, so I don't even need to change and brush my teeth to play..er...pray.

WOZ threads: "Come for the updates, stay for the fighting and nipple pinching."

So true!

The voice acting does not bother me at all. I thought they were pretty spot on. Beast, however, does bother me on X-Men - a lot.

i don't know what your talking about.....any good playing demo man, that right ramp is an easy shot. maybe you played a poor machine with badflippers?

love the video, the colors, and finally some speedy gameplay. can't wait to play this baby in a month or 2.

Probably be very difficult with a post between the flippers.

holy... You are considering the flippers "small issues"? Dude, the flippers are your control to the game. There is nothing more important. You can't have a quality machine with crappy flippers. And you can't make a determination that "all that needs to be done is change the coils". Geez this had to be one of the dumbest things I've ever read on pinside.

DCFAN... Thanks for the kind words. I really appreciate it!

WOZLE is simply stunning. I saw things in this game that are under wrap & key. JJ asked us not to take pictures of certain things. All the WOZ lovers are going to LOVE this game, and the haters, well, you'll probably see most of them playing the game in the closet.

Kerry

Not going there, not going there....

It's official ! Woz owners are out of the closet !

Jim

For what it is worth, I do not hate the WOZ theme, JJP or any part of the venture, but the sound package right now is just bad. I am sure there are good parts, but the BAD just stands out so glaringly right now that how can you not comment on it?

I have not heard one person say they are thrilled with what they have HEARD so far...

Based on this video and only to add input that maybe JJP can use in a positive way .

Voice acting needs to be re worked ( Witch ect sound great , Dorothy is very average )

Flipper issue as many have already stated

Goals ( call outs and lighting lack in clarity ) During multi ball looked like the player was just knocking the balls around , could nt see a goal

Was nt impressed with the clunky gameplay at all

Ok tough guy, given that the issue is power and not the mechanism whats the solution... Dont hold back now...

Lol btw they are small issues... A bigger issue would be designing a piss poor cannon with parts made in China then having a thread on here asking wtf is going on.... Or having a perspex playfield cover that cant be changed over unless you get a new playfield, orrrrr shitty cab artwork that you cant do anything about....

So given that they have done an awesome job on the pf, cab (things that are beyond the point of no return) I am sure they will come up with an easy fix for the soft flippers. Am I not correct in saying that they are using Williams parts for this game??? Is there not a choice is different strength coils??? Oh btw this could not have been the stupidest thing said on PS.... Saying that you like IJ4, IM or are happy with ACDC.... LAWLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLlllllllllllerrrrrrssssssss

Did anyone try rubbing there belt buckle on the cabinet to make sure the cabinet could take it? lol

JJP sent out updates with more than a few music clips. There is "ball start shooter lane music" or something like that. There was some multiball music released. I think there was even a number put out by jack as to how many pieces of music Granner made for the game.

All you're getting in the vids so far is the main woz tune looped.

The flippers are not set to full strength for whatever reasons you wouldn't set the flippers on a demo game to full power. I can think of a few reasons. You really just have to think a little.

When the game is complete, people who are commenting on the attract mode looped music they hear now will say: oh.

When the game is complete, people commenting on the weak/sluggish flippers will say: oh.

This is what I get from reading all the updates and what jack says on the woz group.

If I'm wrong about any of this, I will say: oh

Nice post Pinstym! It gets old reading so many immature posts that fly in the face of what we have already learned about the game.

I will update with pics when I get back home. (Still here @ PPE)
Check back tonight, possibly tomorrow morning.

Was in on a preorder, played the game at PPE and I just canceled my deposit. I wish JJP all the best and I may be sending him my money again for game 2 or 3.

Pros
- Best light show I've ever seen.
- Build quality looks / feels great.
- LCD is promising.

Cons
- I hated the layout of the two ramps, and no code can fix that.
- I felt that the ball was hidden for too long (up by the pops, underneath the mini playfields.) I tried to hit a light plunge to the right middle flipper and it was really hard to time when the ball would come back into view. That didn't matter too much because...
- ...the mid right flipper suffers from a lack of shots. There's a skill shot target, and you can hit the witch magnet (though you can also hit the witch from the right flipper at the bottom.)

The main reason I decided to pull out is because all 3 of my concerns are physical design layout problems, and not really things that will be tuned/tweaked/perfected with code.

Could go either way
- Pitch and flipper strength felt poorly tuned. I'm sure JJP doesn't want the ball flying around too fast, risking broken plastics/either parts while the machine is out on the road.
- I'm hoping that what you see on the LCD screen is 100% placeholder/WIP, but it's hard to say either way.
- Not sure how I felt about the concept of lower scoring.
- The hype on the crystal ball and whatever remains to be seen about how it will work. Jack said they were working on something and it would be ready to show soon (he mentioned a specific show that I forgot.)

Personally, I think that while the mechanics are close to being final, there is a ton of work to do on the programming side. More than it seems.

- We have yet to see any real modes, aside from locking 3 balls to start multiball. Even this felt mostly like a proof of concept since there didn't appear to be any real goals in MB.
- Lights aren't tied to gameplay events yet, beyond a bare bones proof on concept (rainbow letters lighting, etc.)
- Other 'basic' things like shaker motor support haven't been shown. I'm not saying that it's rocket science, or it's a deal breaker. I just think that there's a lot of little foundational stuff like this that still needs to be done/tightened up.
- Sounds are minimal and repetitive. Same with music.

I think all of this programming will get ironed out, but it's going to take time. If Jack holds true to his word about not shipping anything until it's 'ready', I worry that the game won't make this calendar year. That being said, TSPP is a testament to Keith's ability to deliver an amazingly deep ruleset. I just think it's going to take longer than we'd all like, especially if I heard Jack correctly and the code on hand was current as of last weekend.

Wow ,hope for the best for JJP !

Jim

You can always get a standard version later. You just made one person on the list happy.

I appreciate the honest comments zucot.

Rather than rant or degrade you stated your observations & articulated them without insults.

I'm certain WOZ will take longer than many will admit. For some reason I am also fairly certain it will be a great game. Of course this is just PW79 speculation

If its good I will buy one. If not then I will look forward to JJP2. I don't think sight unseen/unplayed preorders is a recipe for glowing reviews. How can a company please its customers if they buy what they hope it to be vs what it really is?

Man you guys are a tough crowd. Confusing also since its suggested across the board, "dont judge a game by watching a video, go and play it before you buy one dude."

There are some really funny posts in here that got me cracking up laughing. Some this thread reminds me of the Flatland scene, (for any riders that might be on here).

I think the game looks pretty cool so far. I guess the longer your in this hobby the more critical you become so the comments are understandable.

Again, let me preface that I have no skin in this game....

I think alot of you criticizing the code are just a bit naive on how code development works. I guarantee you that Keith has ALOT more of the modules programmed for the game and in test/QA mode than would be installed in a TEST game on location. Better to have a very limited subset of the code in an unmonitored test game on location, ensuring that the game is playable for the masses and not suffering from downtime from a more complex code set that's not been fully vetted. I would guess that the majority of the code is written, but in the testing phase, and Jack's not about to follow the stern model of releasing incomplete/buggy code.

All this is conjecture on my part, but knowing how I and most of my cohorts write code, that's the model I would/and do follow. Of course we're not writing code for pinball machines, but I'm guessing the life cycle of development is very similar.

The SDLC is no different in game / pinball development as any other development vertical. You don't put incomplete or untested code out for public consumption without a caveat. In this case the game is known to be a WIP.

No WOZ in my collection champ. Not a fan of the theme. Wife would probably like it. I think she has the Collectors Edition Dolls or something ....

I don't know of anyone in NZ who is getting one ....

Dave.

weak flippers,

i think adding the eye candy to the flippers could be contributing to the weak flipper effect. custom slippers bats/rubber color combo. It can't be helping.

the design of the rubby slippers could be adding extra weight and those long shot to the ramps are not good with black rubbers. I'm sure you'll get better rebound/throw from regular bally/williams bats and red rubbers.

just throwing it out there, it's just weird, never seen a game struggle like that.

I'm sure the fix is on the "to do" list. either jjp, or the owners will figure it out.
i-knew-could.jpg

Well done. This is how a dissenting opinion is stated. No gossip, no rumor, no innuendo, no imaginary friends with speculative comments. A first hand account honestly and objectively presented.

I have not played the game yet so I cannot agree or disagree but I respect your opinion. Best post in this thread.

Kim

Check the menu in LOTR....you can adjust the strength of the coil pulse.