Joined the club!

Just picked up a lightly routed standards. Needs a thorough cleaning and some flipper rebuilding but it's a nice game. Bummer about the scrapes on the right side of the backbox though.

Looks like it is an earlier example with screened cab. "born on" date of 07/25/13.

It also looks like the game is running pretty old software. The lower right corner in the menu system says "Wizard of Oz Version 1.25" I assume this means the game is running 1.25 of the code. I see it's up to 6.06. Any issues with upgrading that far? Or just follow the JJP instructions and go to town?

Another thing I noticed is the fans in the machine are pretty loud. I'll have to check into that.

I look forward to discovering more about this game.

I already have Cliffys on order and will be ordering pinbits plastic protector set. It also looks like using a pinball life stern shaker motor is reasonably straightforward. Looks like I just need to cut off the wiring kit connectors, shorten the wire and crimp on a different molex plug and it's plug and play.

Anything else I should consider? I see there are some lighting kits available, and the game could certainly use some GI lighting, but it looks like it should be pretty easy to add some light strips since the game should have 12v easily available. That being said though, is there a preferred spot to access power?

Thanks!

Software upgraded.. Very painless process. One of these days my old PB10 ROM burner is going to be useless.. But not yet!

Pic of my munchkin mini-pf attached.. Definitely needs some work but not the end of the world.. Anyone know how much a new unpopulated munchkin mini-pf is? What about a full unpopulated pf set?

It also needs a new plastic over the drop target. Available piece by piece or do you have to buy a complete set like Stern?

Considering what I have heard about playfield problems with this game, I am pretty impressed with the lack of wear. Before I upgraded the software the audits showed a little over 7000 games with no protection at all other than a small piece of mylar at the wizard (?) saucer kick out.

I am thinking that if I decide to keep this game then I'm going to strip it and clear it. The factory clear is *so* thin...

I haven't looked, but is a "kit" necessary for state fair balloon lighting? Seems like it's a standard pop bumper body, so the holes should be there to put a wedge socket in it. Then just wire up to 12v. I have already found a few 12v sources under the playfield.

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That looks like it will be very cool..

I haven't looked at it yet, but I was thinking it would be really cool to change the stock topper illumination from green to color changing. Would definitely match the effects on the playfield. Has anyone tried it?

Something else I noticed today while poking around this game.

It seems the little mini-monitor behind the crystal ball has a 2gb microSD card in it. Has anyone stuck that thing in their computer to see what's on it? I'd be curious to know if the images could be changed.

Question..

Does anyone know the width of the WoZ lockdown bar? Mine is all bent up and I'd like to replace it. I was wondering if the Williams/Bally widebody lockdown bar would fit.

Anyone know?

I'm pretty sure it's Williams-style - just don't know about the width. The lockdown bar receiver looks a whole lot like a Williams unit.

WoZ *seems* narrower than TZ, STTNG, etc, but hard to tell for sure. I could measure but not sure where to measure from to get the correct "spec" width.

Perfect.. That's what I needed to know. Yes, PBL is where I was planning on buying a replacement for my standard.

Thank you!

Yes please! Just like TZ home... Had a *great* game going Saturday... Had to let my multi-ball drain cause the post-lady was at my door ringing the bell.

Very nice!

I think I am the last guy on the last list.. So it'll be a while before I see mine. :/

I know.. It's a very nice mod.

It's ok.. It will be at least 7-8 months before I am ready to install it. I have ordered replacement playfields for my game. Going to clear them and they have to wait 6 months for the clear to cure before I do the swap. I did it that way so I can keep playing my game until I am ready to rebuild it.

Oh.. and I was wondering something. My game is a standard. I was under the impression the production run on standards was unlimited. If that is indeed the case, how come my game has this sticker on the apron? There is nothing fancy about the apron. Just a standard green metal apron. It doesn't have the wood top like the EC games, etc. So what's the deal?

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Ok.. Now I understand.. Yes I do have the screen printed and cleared cabinet. I have to admit it's quite pretty.

Thanks for the info on the production sticker.

Starting to check out some mods for my game..

I noticed there are 2 different makers of castle wall mods that I have found so far. Modfather and back alley.

The modfather walls are $120 versus the back alley at $225. Big difference..

And... with the red smoke witch mod the modfather's witch's well shouldn't be needed, correct?

Any opinions on one versus the other?

I agree... But... Do they look $100 better? Hard to say..

I ordered indypinhead's lighted winkie guard mod.. But haven't seen pics of the throne room sleeve. Any links?

Thanks for the pics..

Dang it! I wish I had known he made that when I ordered the illuminated winkie yesterday!

Yes, that's why I ordered one of Indypinheads drop targets...

War of the Winkies!!!

I am way past the point of getting into Winkie contests...

Which is why I don't drive a Corvette or some jacked up 4x4.

Thank you.. I figured that was the case..

I ordered one from pinball life..

Then I found out they are *$40* cheaper direct from JJP.. So I am ordering one of those and probably sending the PBL lockdown bar back.

Which also means that if anyone needs a lockdown bar for a TZ - and also probably any of the williams WPC widebody games it's cheaper to buy one from JJP!

It is all assumption at this point. Until JJP actually announces or makes available some type of retrofit kit for the earlier games then it doesn't exist.

One can only hope that it happens.. and then really hope it's reasonably priced. :/

I seem to remember someone saying that JJP was backordered on munchkin mini playfields.

I called JJP to order some parts and it turns out they have all 3 of the playfields in stock. The mini's are $150 each and the main is $700.

That being said, I also found a source for NOS playfields for $300 each. The playfields were purchased directly from Jack at a show back in March of 2013.

So from what I have learned so far about WoZ playfields, they are almost certainly Bader playfields. I personally don't think this is a bad thing, but I suspect some people may be scared of a Bader playfield even though the failure rate is actually pretty low. Not a big deal to me as I am going to clear it anyways.

The person that has these is a well known pinsider but I don't want to publicly publish his name in this post. If anyone is interested in obtaining one of these $300 playfields PM me and I will let you know who to contact.

We shall see.. I took a chance on one since I plan to clear it anyways.. I will report how it turns out.

I would of course recommend a quality clear on playfield like this anyways.

No, he just has the main..

Yeah.. and IMHO they don't work for beans...

That light pipe thing loses a LOT of light from the LEDs. I wish they had done it a different way.

Do you mind taking a pic of this software revision as shown in the menu screen on your game and posting? I am wanting to follow up on this to see if I can find out what the deal is with this version.

Can you share which JJP dealer told you this? I'd like to find out if this is indeed the case before I start on my routed WoZ restore.

EDIT: Maybe this is old news, but the proof is in the documentation. Guess what? All WoZ games produced after 12/15/2016 have the WoZ 2.0 lighting system. It is very very similar to the system used in Hobbit - it has a BAG board like Hobbit and a Comms Hub board.

Attached is a screenshot of the opening paragraph in the latest manual that specifically lays out how the new 2.0 light system works.

So it's true. WoZ 2.0 lighting system is a complete re-do of the light board system similar to how Hobbit is done.

Hopefully JJP will come up with some type of kit to replace the old serial system with the new parallel system. Here's hoping they do it AND make it affordable.

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Plastic set available direct from JJP for the reasonable price of $150. Includes all plastics - including clears - except the rainbow plastic.

Pinbits sells nice protectors. Indypin500 (?) Also sells a nice protector set.

Something else I was just thinking about....

Does anyone have a list of compatible PC motherboards for WoZ? I was thinking that since PC technology moves so fast, it won't take long before those boards are long gone and not made anymore.

Kinda like what happened to P2K back in the day.. Remember that?

It would be nice to know which boards will work so shopping for the future can happen now while they are still possibly plentiful and cheap.

Anyone know?

No, I understand that. But it could definitely happen. WoZ runs on Ubuntu Linux but I doubt that when JJP releases code updates that they use a newer kernel that supports newer onboard peripherals on newer motherboards. So it seems that eventually you'd run into a board with a USB interface chip or *something* that the WoZ Ubuntu kernel doesn't have drivers for. Then something wouldn't work or heaven forbid you got a kernel panic...

Just seems wise to pick up one or 2 "compatible" motherboards now while they can still be had cheap. I mean after all, I'm sure WoZ is using some cheap board that can be had for like $39 or something from Newegg...

Sweet! Thanks for the link..

I wonder why that thread didn't pop up on my search??

Let's see a pic of the bottom of the playfield.. Several pics actually..

Since your production date is right on the line between WoZ 1.0 and 2.0 I'd be curious to know which system you ended up with.

I have to say the cynic in me thinks they probably did not publicize anything about the upgraded light system on WoZ 2.0 so they wouldn't sabotage sales of 1.0 games still left in inventory or on the line.

Darn it Lloyd.. Beat me to it..

Lucky you.. Yes, you have version 2.0 of the lamp board system. Thank you for taking those pics.

Suggestion....

www.passionforpinball.com

Cliffy has something like 15 protector pieces available for this game. Do yourself a favor and buy them all. It will help protect your investment.

Nice... Have fun installing.. There is a lot of stuff to disassemble to get the full set installed.

Uh oh... That's not good..

Not to go too far off the topic, but what's the workaround for that?

Plain old carbon steel balls that I run in a rotary polisher. Your special shiny balls are most likely chromium and therefore not suitable in games that have magnets, as you have discovered.

I think you are imaging the dust aspect. The majority of "dust" in a game comes from the rubbers as they slowly disintegrate. Also coil dust from wear and tear.

Great idea.. Too bad it probably wouldn't work because of the huge variation on hardware that it can be installed on.

There is always a way.. Off the top of my head the following would be needed at a minimum:

All new light boards
The BAG board and a Comms Hub board
Wiring for the above
Driver board? Unknown
Software update to support the new boards? Version 6.10 that has been reported to be installed on the newest games?

That's all I can think of at the moment. The way to find out would be to have a new WoZ 2.0 sitting next to an older WoZ and perform a side by side comparison - along with some probably wire tracing and detective work.

It can *definitely* be done, the question is at what cost?

I feel that JJP should come up with some type of affordable kit to updated these games based on:

1: The plethora of light board issues that some machines have had
2: The fact that JJP will be dealing with light board issues on these machines for years to come
3: As a goodwill gesture towards WoZ purchasers

It would go very far in the community to help cement JJP's reputation for taking care of their customers to make this kit subsidized. AKA, not FREE, but not full pop retail either for those who are out of warranty.

Edit: I should mention that I love my game and I have been very happy with the people at JJP I have dealt with so far. But on the other hand this is an issue that really needs a final solution. There is precedent for something like this in the automotive world. Car companies do this all the time when endemic problems are found and resolved via owner notification programs.

The code update is already in the wild. All WoZ games made after 12/15/16 already have the 2.0 lamp board system in them. Which means the code on these machines supports it. So that's a non-issue. It's the hardware and wiring changes that are the issue.

If JJP introduced an update kit for $500 I would be all over it. Or maybe even $750 if I knew that it would reduce the likelihood of lamp board issues on my game by 95%. Granted I am a second owner of a very early game. But I have *already* had to replace one lamp board in the first 2 weeks of owning the game. Fortunately the prior owner included some spares with the game.

I can't see JJP investing the resources in developing a derivative of the Hobbit system for WoZ unless there was a very large improvement to be had. Yet another reason to push for JJP making a kit.

I think the real money maker - at least for the long term - is the goodwill and positive impression it would make in the community for JJP. Not to say they don't already have a positive impression, but this would certainly add to it.

I mean let's face it. If you are thinking about buying title X from a company who has had issues with taking care of their customers lately versus title Z from JJP who has a great reputation of taking care of their customers - even out of warranty - I know which game I would buy, right?

Woohoo!

Thanks for chiming in Keith! Updates always appreciated!

Now how do we go about updating older games with 2.0 lighting system since it's just a hardware and wiring issue. Heck, I can make my own CAT cables.. Just need the boards and information on how to wire the BAG board and Comms Hub board. And if there is some type of update required for the power driver board.

I love my game.. I just don't want to have to constantly worry if this is the day another lamp board fails. Hence my pining for an update kit.

All of my games keep me coming back for more - for the most part. But WoZ always keeps me coming back for "just one more" even when I know I don't have time....

I have another game that does that too.. LOTR... I can't remember who wrote the software for that one though..

Word so far is no update kit available..

As I posted earlier I am hoping that JJP makes a kit available for the older games, for a variety of reasons. I am also hoping they make it available at a subsidized cost to make it affordable in order to help all the owners of previous games who have gone down the lamp board issue road. I am not advocating free.. But $500 would be an ideal price point. I think even $750 would be worth it to a certain number of owners.

Granted, not everyone will have the technical ability to accomplish an upgrade like this, but for those of us who are well versed in restoring games, or are capable of installing a cleared playfield or replacement blank playfield, an upgrade like this is not that hard of a task.

All that being said I - and I hope quite few other people - are hoping a kit gets developed so we can breathe a sigh of relief regarding WoZ lamp board issues.. I love my game, but I would love to no longer have the worry that when I fire up my game to play it that I have yet another lamp board issue.

I think what we need to get a upgrade kit done is someone advocating from the inside. We can post on Pinside all we want, phone Frank and Victor in tech support over and over and bang on the castle gate, but nothing will happen until someone inside JJP says "Hey, maybe we should put together a kit for WoZ 1.0 owners and make it reasonably priced." Who that will be is anyone's guess but the seed needs to be planted somewhere.

Sweet looking game!

I would love to be able to take a look at one of the WoZ 2.0 games in person. It looks like the GIs with the new lamp board system are much improved.

Good idea Lloyd..

Hopefully he will make an appearance at the Northwest show this year.. Then I'll ask him about it.

Nice!

Will be cool to give Dialed In a whirl.

Go in to test mode and cycle through the colors in the test. If any of the LEDs on the lamp boards do not show the correct colors as shown on the LCD then that lamp board is bad.

If you are accomplished at soldering, you can check the board for cold solder joints. I have heard of a few boards fixed this way.

While I don't like to have a negative attitude about things, what you just said above is true. Which is why I have started politely banging the drum about an update kit. Even if it costs some money to do it will be worth it.

I agree that eventually first generation lamp boards will no longer be available. The supply of parts will dry up and it's highly unlikely JJP will run more of them to service what will be 10 year old machines at that point. Especially since that system has been deprecated.

The playfield pulls all the way out and then stands up leaning against the backbox.

The violet/black wire does not have a connector under the playfield. It disconnects from the lamp board under the rainbow plastic.

To make it easier just disconnect everything that goes up through that hole.

Check your coil stop. The screws fell out of mine. If the same happened to you then you'll have to pull the castle mini to get at it.

If you do have to pull the castle mini, take the opportunity to clean and wax back there.

Wanna sell the bare backbox?

I am thinking of getting on of the green city mods for my WoZ.

Problem is I can't decide between the Mezelmods one or the Back Alley Creations one.

Any thoughts/advice on this? Anyone seen them both in person? Is the BAC one worth the extra dough?

I was also thinking of back lighting it somehow and getting rid of the GI spot that goes in that back corner. Haven't really put much thought into how I would do it yet, but I'm sure I can come up with a way.

Thanks,
Michael

Is there enough clearance to lift the playfield or does the light strip have to be removed first?

How are they attached? I read something about magnets but how does this work? It can't be using the cabinet trim as that is stainless and in theory shouldn't be magnetic. Even if it is there is the wood between the light strip and the side trim.

Exactly...

I was vocal in advocating for a conversion kit several months ago. I am swapping my chipped playfield for a new one and I would love to upgrade if the cost was reasonable. My only beef was that JJP should provide such a kit at a discount to take care of the design flaw with the original system. Require trade-in of your old system lamp boards so they can be repaired for games that people opt not to upgrade.

There are issues with the 1.0 lamp board system and everyone knows it. JJP knows it and we know it. Just because someone hasn't had any issues at all doesn't mean they won't. It's a known issue and eventually you *will* have a failure. Some people have had tons of failures. Personally, I would rather be proactive and ditch the system with known issues and go with the improved version if I could get a kit.

I still feel that since the 1.0 system has been abandoned lamp boards will eventually dry up. JJP has publicly committed to supporting the system. But for how long? When does it become economically unfeasible to run new parts to support the old system? Only time will tell.

Good point and dovetails nicely into my point about how long 1.0 board will be available.

There is a term for that. It's called: masochism

So can anyone give me an idea of what kit is "best" for brightening up the game - especially in a dark room? The game is dark enough that I frequently lose track of the ball.

I know of the kit from pinballbulbs.com and the pin stadium kit, but the pin stadium stuff seems a little overkill for what I am trying to accomplish.

Does anyone else make a "plug and play" kit that works well?

I was thinking of simply making some molex "Y" connectors and adding some additional spotlights to the GI circuit on top of the slings, etc.

Opinions?

That looks nice. Did you do all the soldering and heat shrinking on the spots or did they come that way from JJP? If you did them then that's some nice work. Also, do you happen to know the length of the spacers you used for the spots? That would help me out a bunch if I decide to go that route and make them myself.

Thanks for the info on that. What I really like about the stadiums is they are interactive with the GI and flashers. But I certainly don't like the cost. I am thinking $280 for a set fully optioned is pretty damn expensive. My understanding is the latest kit from pinballbulbs.com has 2 fewer spots but brighter bulbs. There is also no longer a need for the power supply board - probably because they have switched to 12v bulbs. They also stay on at all times too. Not sure if that's a bad thing or not when playing some of the "dark" modes on the game.

Be careful with this.

The most recent JJP games are equipped with a MSI H81M-P33 motherboard which has VGA and DVI video outputs. There is a version of that board - the H81M-E33 - that is supposedly exactly the same except it has VGA and HDMI.

I can tell you from experience that the E33 board does NOT work in Woz. As stated, according to MSI the boards are identical except for DVI vs HDMI but I think that is incorrect. There must be some type of difference in the video section of the board that prevents the Woz software from booting.

Also, P33 boards are drying up in the retail channel, so you might want to consider picking one up as a spare while you can still get one.

You can run a P33 in an older Woz, but you will have to upgrade the processor at a minimum. I went with an i3-4170 and stuck an 8gb stick of ram in it. The game now boots up a full 10 seconds faster than before and the animation transitions are much smoother.

As for 720 vs 1080, the capability of the monitor determines that. The software will automatically figure out what your monitor supports and run the appropriate resolution. 1080p will run just fine on a VGA cable. DVI is better, but you don't have to.

Don't know about POTC, but I know all new build WOZ, Hobbit and DI games are using the H81M-P33

It exists and it's available. I installed a kit in my early production game.

Call JJP and ask about it. Last I heard they were offering the kit for $800 or so for a limited time, then it was going to go up to $1100 or something like that. I could be wrong about that though.

LMAO! I made the exact same mistake. I forgot to unplug the "800" USB connector from the I/O board.

And I did the same. Stripped out all of the old wiring, etc. Much cleaner that way.

It really isn't that bad. If you have enough mechanical ability to rebuild flippers and other mechs or do stuff like rebuild WMS GI connectors, etc, then you can pull this off.

I have to ask...

If you are going through this much effort why not consider upgrading to the 2.0 system? Then all of these problems with fragile cables, defective lamp boards, etc, all go away.

I don't know what it is right now, but my understanding is the price was going to be $800 for a while as a "promotion" and then go up to $1100.00

It certainly couldn't hurt to call JJP back and verify this information. If you do, please post back so everyone will know what it is.

Granted it's not cheap, but it's a good investment. The 2.0 system is far more robust with better engineering and design. This system was first introduced on Hobbit and from my understanding the incidence of lamp board failure with this system is far lower than the 1.0 system.