Agree with using the 47s and that's what I put in this machine. finding 2 - 455s threw me off. Thanks for the post!

Now anyone with 4 of the pf screws or know where you can purchase them? Would prefer the original to the newer Phillips ones.

From what I recall those are #7 nickel plated oval head sloted wood screws. Steve Young got hold of a few not long ago but I don't see them on his website any more. I think I've found shorter versions of the right size (#7) before but that's as close as I've found. They would probably look ok but they wouldn't hold the playfield in place. #6 and #8 are more common and might be close enough.

I always use #51 bulbs for the Pop Bumpers. A little dimmer, but shorter and no heat.
The Cowpoke I went through earlier this month had those flat push in bulbs (forgot the name)
under the caps. When rebuilding the bumpers, I changed them to the regular thumper sockets.
Must be Gottlieb used those other sockets from time to time. I think I remember the Melody also
having them..

Yeah, I was thinking of #51 bulbs, not #55 bulbs. It looks like #55s would work, but #51s are what I've seen and used.

Does anyone actually screw down their playfields? Last thing I want to do every time I work on a machine is to undo all those screws.

Someone posted that they fill the holes with shorter screws held in place with a tiny dab of silicone (which are easy to find) for the appearance, and that seems to me to be the way to go.

55 bulbs would be a problem too,although shorter They,run even hotter. The shorter, cooler, bulbs were 51 bulbs...

Was it a unnecessary precaution to screw down playfields
when the MFRs transitioned from woodrail to wedgeheads/metalrails and different lockdown bar mechs?
I know though that Williams still used those twist clamps for several years before eliminating them all together
and GTB had those spring loaded levers underneath to lock the Playfield in place.
Were all those screws and lock mechanisms really required in first place.
Maybe only when transporting a game from location to location.

My problem is I can never get all four of them lined up. Three of them will screw in and the last one just drops down.

I think they were there to deter the playfields from warping.

Even as late as 1959 Williams was still using them, as my Pinch Hitter uses screws.

This, and to prevent warped playfields from affecting ball travel. I always screw them down and replace missing screws.

Here's a friendly reminder for those new to woodrails: Pinball Magazine No. 5 contains a huge interview with former Gottlieb designer Wayne Neyens, who designed the majority of Gottlieb's woodrails from 1947 onwards. He designed over 180 games that went into production, all of them are featured in the magazine and Wayne discusses many of them. www.pinball-magazine.com/shop/

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I’m looking for the shuffle spring (the one attached to the shuffle and playfield that helps the shuffle close after it is opened during start up) for a 1952 Gottlieb Quartette and so need the specs to be able to order or make one.

Does anyone have a Quartette or a Four Stars (I assume that Four Stars has the same shuffle spring set-up as Quartette) and some calipers who can get some measurements of this spring? In particular, if someone can send measures of the following, that’d be great!

1. Diameter of the spring wire
2. Diameter of the spring coil
3. Length of spring (not counting hooks) in relaxed state (that is, when not installed)

The photo below is just of a random spring to show the requested measurements.

Thanks!

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95% of the issues worked out. Now time to start playing and find the remaining 5% that are hiding waiting to be found.

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Wow that's in nice shape.mine is a little rough but plays great.

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Most of my games are far from beauty queens. Playability outweighs looks every time for me. What kind of shape is the Goldstar in? I've been looking for one for awhile now.

The gs playfield is in really nice shape but the bg is pretty rough.cool game to play though.

I've done two retrofits, one on a United game, and one I just completed for a Keeney Poker Face pin... both of those had impulse setups. If you do decide to retrofit, it's important to get a dual wound coil that's just the right power.. Steve Young is a good resource to help pare down which dual wound coil is best for your woodrail... there are also a few good sites that have power ratings in OHMS for coils of different manufacturers... this was very helpful in my determination of which coil to use for the Poker Face.

https://www.pinballmedic.net/coilchart.html

https://www.flippers.com/coil-resistance.html

I have a question for all you woodrail aficionados.

Im working on a fairly nice, all original, Gottlieb Criss Cross with sunken inserts.

The inserts are not loose at all, and their artwork is pretty detailed and not easily replaceable if they were to break during removal. I’m trying to decide between removing them + re-gluing them, or filling/ leveling them with a clear.

If I had a full proof method to get them out without breaking them, I’d go that route without hesitation. But the alternative, while potentially easier and less risky, is also an irreversible modification to an otherwise all original game.

What says you? Should I fire up the hair drier or dust off the pipettes?

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Here’s a vote for the hair dryer!

I’ve only got experience with a few machines that had sunken inserts that weren’t coming out easily, but the hair dryer method usually does the trick of loosening them up. Also, using something with a flat round surface (like a socket from a socket wrench set) can work well to spread out the force when you’re trying to push them out from under the playfield. I too considered the clear method, but ultimately decided to go with removing and releveling while risking breaking nice inserts with artwork (and so far have been lucky!).

Good luck!

I vote for leveling with clearcoat. I just used the brush-on version of Minwax Polycrylic to clearcoat an entire Snow Derby playfield (I know, not a woodrail) to level, among other things, sunken numbered inserts for which I could not find replacements. Right now I’m working on a Jig Saw (which is a woodrail), and the artwork inserts on the playfield puzzle picture are sunken. I’m too concerned about damaging those inserts to try to raise them, even using the blowdryer-and-socket method. After touch-up, I’m planning to level the playfield by clearcoating.

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I’m digging the varied input! Solid votes for both so far.

Jigsaw is actually next up in the queue for me after criss cross. It’ll be getting a full clear job to try and fix some misguided restoration work from a previous owner. Thick brown globs of oil based poly to remove from sunken inserts. Bumpy and uneven clear... I’ll be sure to post here when that adventure begins.

But first, the age-old sunken insert dilemma..

#55s are HOT! Use #51s, the smaller globe round lamps. I always use them for the pop bumpers.

What says you? Should I fire up the hair drier or dust off the pipettes?

I have had alot of success over the years with the hair dryer method.

I've done both. In your case if you do try the hair dry method, if those inserts with graphics aren't coming out easily (and definitely use a round socket just small enough to fit the hole) I'd use the FILL method. No reason taking chances. I've done a lot of insert removal, and have broken a few in my haste to remove them. Take your time, and be sure to heat from both sides. I've also used a heat gun, but not recommending that for first time use.

Funny, I just did my Jigsaw last month! Here is a before and after.

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Nice job on that PF!

Question for the group, has anyone discussed trying to get the PF for Jigsaw reproduced? The made a ton of these, I would think there are lots of owners out there that would like a nicer one.

I'd be in for one. I'd love to see Gottlieb "Ace High" repro'd as well.
Every one I've come across has considerable wear.

If Wade were to do a repro of a woodrail it would be more lucrative for him to do a 1952 Queen of Hearts.

I’d definitely buy one. I wonder how many people we’d need in order to get Wade or someone else interested? Seems unlikely, but that would be amazing.

Waking up a Williams 1954 Skyway. It was very rough when I bought it. A week ago I finished the cabinet graphics. Tiny red dots included (if anyone has coin door parts, pls hit me up)

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That's looking really good. Well done on the repaint.

Thanks a lot! The orange was difficult to mix but got it right after 3 layers

I sent an e-mail to Wade to see what the process was to find out, but I haven't heard anything back. I don't know if there are licensing issues or other potential roadblocks. I don't want to get a list of hopeful people just to find out it can't be reasonably done.

Hey Gang,

Still hunting the upper molding for a single player Gottlieb back box or an early 50's back box with the slide up door. Paint not important, it's getting a complete repaint anyway.
Also needs to ship to Michigan.

Thanks in advance,
Walt

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Having trouble getting my Skill Pool up and running, hoping somebody more experienced can point me in the right direction. The game get's stuck in the startup sequence when the coil on the 10,000 stepper locks on. If I advance the 100,000 stepper once, the game completes the sequence and plays. During gameplay as the 100,000 stepper advances it caused the 10,000 coil to lock on every other step. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

Try gapping the contacts on the back of the 10,000 stepper unit a little more. When you drop down the stepper unit it should be the single set of contacts on the left. I don't have that particular game but have had similar issue on others and that seems to solve the problem.

With the help of another colllector I was able to solve this issue. The pins on the 100,000 point stepper were wired wrong. Not sure how somebody managed that one and who knows how long ago they did it. lol Machine is back in working operation. Now just need to finish shopping it out.

The current woodrail collection. I sold off some last Fall, so I have a couple of open spots.
One space will be for the Genco Trade Winds that's now in the shop, but it has been badly hacked and it'll be a while before it can join the herd.

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A Fun Fair to go with your Screamo? Now I'm doubly jealous.

Those backlit backglasses look great!

Wow, that's an excellent collection of woodrails Tom. 2 thumbs up

Fun-Fair looks nice, but it's a totally rusted out wreck inside. Hoping to find another one sometime that I can use to put together a working one.

I have a nice Dancing Dolls looks to sell. Any advice on what it's worth? Thanks.

I hope to find a Rocket some day.

Wow. That's a fabulous lineup, Tom. Is your Williams "Trade Winds" a repaint? I've never seen the non-wedgehead version with original paint, but I've always suspected that the cabinet base color is light blue, not white. Does it also have a deep blue playfield, unlike the lighter blue one normally seen?

It is a repaint, but to the original cabinet color scheme. I bought it so long ago that it was a long time before I discovered that there was a rare version and this was it. I believe the white cabinet is original for the greater majority of the ones produced, the reverse wedgeheads. Yes, the playfield is a a deeper shade of blue. Playfield has been touched up, was very planked.

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I could use a Detroit Locker and some solid one piece axles for my Jeep.

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I am looking for a Genco Trade Winds if anyone has one. The one I have is badly hacked.

Very nice lighted backglass collection! How did you light them? Any pics of "behind the scenes?"