(Topic ID: 249691)

Wonka LE Sling Post Chipping in one month!!


By rs812

9 months ago



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Post #1403 Response from JJP from the Pinball Magazine podcast Posted by RobertWinter (9 months ago)

Post #1407 Transcribed response from JJP from the Pinball Magazine podcast Posted by RobertWinter (9 months ago)


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#58 9 months ago

Well, of course it matters as when you come to sell it and buyer sees this, they will knock $500 plus off the asking price.

Don't know what is going on but man, the clear seems so brittle.

#122 9 months ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

I would advise them not too touchy it too much.

Or it will breaky?

#210 9 months ago

Incredible after all these years, we have problems that just didn't exist before.

Thought I better check my 1954 Gottlieb Dragonette

On a serious note the playfield is 65 years old and looks better than most of my modern games!

Not sure how long these current playfields are going to last for....

IMG_5793 (resized).jpg
#254 9 months ago
Quoted from mnpinball:

Probably the most important quote in this thread on why clears are now water based and the issues that go hand in hand with it. Stern playfields are pretty decent up until about 2015, after that you started seeing clearcoat issues and quality control issues etc.
“Laquers went away due to the high VOC content and rather dangerous chemicals involved. Laquers cure by evaporation of the solvent carriers, which releases dangerous toxins like toluene into the air. Non catalyzed enamels also dry by solvent evaporation, though the toxins are less. But the trend went to catalyzed urethanes which cure by crosslinking the polymers in the paint, giving a much more durable finish as well as NOT releasing solvents into the atmosphere. Modern automotive paints, at least in factories, are also primarily waterborne, rather than solvent-borne, with even lower VOC content when sprayed. Unfortunately, waterborne paints suffer from adhesion problems as there are no solvents to bind them properly to the substrates (generally electrostatically applied epoxy primer) this causes most of the paint delmination problems you see on so many newer cars.”
Read more: http://www.city-data.com/forum/automotive/994486-when-why-did-automakers-quit-using.html#ixzz5x9ZsEpQC

It's a real shame but agree since 2015 quality has gone down and so now any informed buyer is going to have to ask for additional pictures of the playfield post areas when thinking of buying a HUO game.

22
#342 9 months ago
Quoted from RichieWrench:

hmmmmmmm.......
I think I will wait till I hear more responses on this one....Really?

Yes, really.

#364 9 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

"Oh mighty Stern you can do no wrong, take my money sight unseen for I know you can never disappoint me". The Stern fanboy pledge, you are quickly becoming #1 lol. Give it a rest.
Look at this, what's happening on a new Jurassic Park Pro?
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

Not good that JP now has same issue - even if it is isolated case.

We put up with a lot of QC issues over the years but soft clear is one of the worst.

#366 9 months ago

This is interesting. The best way is expensive and volatile.

http://www.pinrepair.com/clear/

Automotive Clear Coats.
The more I thought about clear coats, the more it seemed logical to try the automotive clear coats. These are far more complex clears than bought at any hardware store. They are also a lot more expensive, and were more complicated to apply. But the automotive clears were the same type of products today's pinball manufacturers were using on their new playfields. These products are far more durable than any other type of clear coating.

Automotive Clear Advantages and Disadvantages.

The advantages to automotive clear coats includes:

Dry time of 1 to 5 hours. Fully cured in 48 to 72 hours, after which the game can be immediately reassembled and played.
Incredible hardness and durability. After fully curing, can not be removed with any thinner.
High solids (fewer coats needed).
Low solvents. The two-part urethane system dries because of the chemical reaction of the two parts, and does not depend on the evaporation of solvents.

The disadvantages to automotive clear coats includes:

Extremely volatile when being applied. Can not be applied in-doors!!! Safety precautions MUST be taken!
Expensive. Really expensive compared to Varathane.
A two or three part system (a required activator/hardener is added to the clear, and sometimes a reducer too).
Can not be removed once applied (there's no going back).
Not available in spray cans. Must be brushed on, or applied with expensive spray and ventilation equipment.

#375 9 months ago
Quoted from Lermods:

I thought I saw somewhere that Mirco wasn’t a supplier to stern. Can anyone confirm this?

Can someone solve Cleargate please?

Someone must know. The truth is out there.

#482 9 months ago

Since around 2009 I have seen all kinds of issues in NIB games, and can remember everyone complaining how thin the clear was on Tron and Iron Man. Maybe clear is too thick now?!

Anyway, the whole node board issue had me doubting whether to buy a NIB, but Stern step up and replace so thought what the heck, buy a Maiden.

Stern have been great sorting out defects on my Maiden.

This issue really is different to anything prior.

I won't be buying any NIB until playfield issues are rectified.

It's just not worth it, as for me it would ruin the enjoyment of getting a NIB.

Yes, it doesn't effect gameplay but it makes the game much more expensive due to the hit you will take on resale.

#489 9 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

Stern's been on balance very good for support on the machines we've bought (probably close to 2 dozen now). Just today I got warranty support for an Iron Maiden Prem where both newton balls had come loose off the post they're pressed to (the lower one came clean off). I was expecting to have to buy them since it was just a little over a year old, but they took care of it.
Playfield clear bunching on that same Maiden wasn't deemed bad enough for a replacement when I emailed about it last year, though.

I also don't like Stern's solution on JP2 of putting ugly metal washers underneath the posts. Band aid really.

It makes sense though, as guessing it will delay potential issues, possibly for years.

And let's face it, other than a few threads on pinside, most buyers of these NIB games will never spot these issues.

#492 9 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

Pretty sure ink adhesion failure is the core problem and all the rest of the problems are knock on effects from there.

Makes sense as it feels like these playfields would be like peeling dry bark from a tree.

#553 9 months ago

Sadly going forward, any recent game I think about purchasing, the first thing I will be looking for is pooling or hopefully be able to buy a non pooling game.

Crazy really.

10
#793 9 months ago

I had a space for a new game.

Instead of a JP, I am going to pick up an older Stern with a rock solid SAM board set, finished code and a decent playfield

#807 9 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Just saw this in a Stern JP thread...wow After just a few days of ownership.
[quoted image]

Real downer.

I was totally excited about JP. First pin that has had my attention since Maiden.

It's already a spectacular game!

But, no way can I buy one for the foreseeable future.

#864 9 months ago
Quoted from Who-Dey:

I have a feeling that the problem is far worse than that.

Yes, the majority of pin owners are blissfully unaware of this issue.

Every Stern title off the line in 2018/19 seems to have blistering issues - from reports and photos in these threads.

Who knows how many.

#899 9 months ago

As someone said earlier, post pics will be the new normal!

#1068 9 months ago
Quoted from steigerpijp:

12 days of play, luckilly its only 1% of the playfield..
Groovy stuff , but I prefer another kind[quoted image][quoted image]

Wow, looks like the clear is made from bubblegum

-2
#1719 9 months ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Exactly. flynnibus criticizes NIB buyers for being over critical of their games and worrying over Playfield damage, yet in the same breath admits he has only ever bought one NIB game, instead preferring to buy used whereby he can check the condition of the game and let the NIB buyer “take the NIB hit”.
flynnibus it begs the question.....what NIB hit would a used buyer deduct for a chipped Playfield with paint missing over a non chipped one with no paint missing?

Personally I would knock off the cost of a replacement playfield - Stern playfields are around $750?

11
#1756 9 months ago
Quoted from Nikonokin:

And the very 1st post of this thread...my buddy is going to report this Monday (later) but 1st let me cry and tell everyone already before they have a chance to make it right, before I report it, thus damaging 1 of the very few pinball manufacturers left before they can even explain or possibly fix with no issues. Cry me a river...

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#1800 9 months ago

I think I know what happened.

Too much chewing gum eaten and so we get the SE with very rare 'Bubble Gum' playfields.

Are they edible I wonder?

Mcgum (resized).png
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