(Topic ID: 249691)

Wonka LE Sling Post Chipping in one month!!

By rs812

57 days ago

Topic Stats

  • 2,155 posts
  • 264 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 14 days ago by Adipocere
  • Topic is favorited by 48 Pinsiders


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Topic index (key posts)

2 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #1403 Response from JJP from the Pinball Magazine podcast Posted by RobertWinter (45 days ago)

Post #1407 Transcribed response from JJP from the Pinball Magazine podcast Posted by RobertWinter (45 days ago)

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#402 54 days ago

glad i canceled my CE would of felt like crap seeing that on a $12,000 machine

I feel like this issue has been going on for a while.
Should not be difficult to figure it out and rectify it.

#538 53 days ago

I'm going to check my maiden when I get home
I cancelled my wonka ce and may cancel JP

Feeling really uneasy now

#578 53 days ago

Notice there are no graphics under the sling, just white wood

Quoted from JodyG:

My Guardians of the Galaxy has no pooling or chipping. 13,625 plays, Born November 21, 2017.[quoted image][quoted image]

#878 49 days ago
Quoted from zaphX:

The thing is, the current games are too compelling to ignore (at least for me!)[quoted image]

I guess that's what manufacturers are hoping ...

#1021 47 days ago
Quoted from Ballypinball:

Ok so Stern made 10,000 games last year and how may have chipping?
What % exactly

If you got one with issues, you don't care about the %
Washers are just covering up the issues and won't prevent problems in other areas down the line

I fucking love pinball and just want this issue fixed.
Strong ball resistant clear is very possible - the technology exists in other applications
A PF without dimples, blisters, cracking etc ... is doable with the correct products and applications

I personally don't want to pay 7 grand and have to cover imperfections with washers
I don't expect a 100% perfect machine, but I would like a nice PF that holds up for years to come

#1073 47 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Wrong again
The $550 offer is the offer at the moment for all customers, several have bought already.
They sent me the same offer which I haven’t accepted yet and won’t until there is some sort of statement from them.

Can't understand why anyone would buy a replacement PF
A) To fix a manufacturing defect that should be the responsibility of the manufacturer
B) For an issue they have yet to publicly acknowledge and say it's fixed 100%

And when they actually do fix this for good (which at this point I still have confidence they will) then you still need the skill and hours required to do a PF swap
Can you imagine if Ford had a recall and not only made you buy the new part, but shipped it to your home for you to install.

#1212 46 days ago

The arguing in this thread is ridiculous. There are obviously some people that are not concerned about the issues. That's awesome, continue to enjoy your games and play or route them as desired. It's just absurd trying to convince others that they should do the same. For me, PF issues are a non starter. I can't swap or easily repair a PF like I can plastics and other parts. I am not buying NIB until I am confident issues are fixed. If you could 100% tell me the pooling around the posts will not turn into chips or spread, then yes, I would be able to accept it as a small defect. But, we have already seen it turn into chipping on some pins. Will this ruin pinball for me? No, of course not. I will continue to enjoy the machines I have in my house and those on location.

#1303 45 days ago
Quoted from N80G80:

Don’t worry fellas every Wonka LE comes with this piece of paper in the top now![quoted image]

That's awesome - basically saying we can't build a defect free game so deal with it
From the experts I have heard on clear coating, you can build a smooth, dimple free, puddle free, chip free PF if you use the correct products and you use them correctly
Even with a pinball rolling around the PF - it's possible but may be cost prohibitive

#1307 45 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

This is legal-ease trying to exempt the company of poor workmanship at the factory and sub-quality playfields. Don’t think this is good for the industry, no matter the company putting in this type of letter of excuses at these high prices. If an automobile came with this disclaimer at $12,500.00 how many people would be fine with it and purchase the car or high end appliance? This is not good for the industry, because everything and anything is passable with this letter of excuses for poor quality. The investors are trying to exempt themselves from liability. I for one will not purchase any high priced toy with this kind of warranty exemption. The 2nd hand market will not be kind to those that buy NIB and try to sell later, a high priced toy that looks like trash.

Agree, there is already a Wonka for sale in a regional thread and the seller had to advise that there is pooling around the posts

#1332 45 days ago
Quoted from pinghetto:

I had funds ready and waiting for Wonka and GNR. But, I'm also someone who would obsess over the pooling issue with a game in my home. My pinball funds are officially on hold for JJP and Stern. Here's hoping they figure this out. And JJP needs to really work on their customer service. IT SUCKS. 3 unanswered voice mails and 1 unanswered online ticket for me (not playfield related). Never was like that in the past.
I have to give it to Chas at Stern. He always answers or gets back to you. That's how it should be done. And Spooky Pinball too! Their customer service has always been top notch!!

Yup.... Zero harm on consumer's end to wait this out and hold off on NIB purchases.
All this pinball is a want, nothing is a need.

#1410 45 days ago

His statement does not make me feel any better at all.

#1493 44 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

These play field issues are a big deal, and JJP needs to be proactive in figuring out the problem.

Sorry, they missed the boat on being proactive
Proactive would have been taking care of the issue before Wonka shipped, now they're being reactive to all the noise being made on pinside.

#1505 44 days ago

The more I read Jack's statement and listen to the recording, the more I get annoyed
Here's my reading between the lines

Jack's statement transcribed from the podcast -
"Alright, well first off I just want to apologize for the delay in speaking about this matter publicly as we sorted through things internally and we understand that some of our customers are concerned to see and hear of clear coat chipping around posts on our Willy Wonka game.

This has been going on for a long time and were hoping it would not be a big deal to customers but now that it is and we never addressed it in the past were were not sure what to say.

The number of actual cases we have seen with true playfield chipping is extremely low and we're in the process of developing a program for anyone with documented damage and will work with those customers on a case-by-case basis and, you know, feel free to call Tech Support or call me directly if you feel your machine has true chipping or damage. And we want you to feel confident and comfortable with your purchase, always.

You complaints are in the minority, you are making issues out of something that should not be. We are trying to figure out how to respond to people in the correct way and tell them what they have is normal and we can sell them a PF if they really think it's an issue

We want to notify customers NOT to take apart their machine, remove posts, etc, for the sole purpose of looking for chipping or problems under the posts. If you truly need to remove any part of the machine, we recommend contacting JJP Tech Support for instructions on how to do this properly. And for those customers who see rippling or pooling around any post, we want to urge you, this does not mean your game will chip.

Please don't look for issues in your games. We are shipping games with washers to hide the issues and we don't need you pesky owners discovering things our engineers have worked hard to cover up. If you happen to see issues, don't worry, all is good in the world and the pooling will never end in chipping. If it does end in chipping, we hope it's after you sold the game so we are not accountable to the second owner

We're diligently working with our vendor and engineers day and night on correcting any pooling moving forward. We have no reason to believe any games out there in the field are inadequate in any way, shape, or form. You should continue to enjoy and play your amazing game.

Please keep buying our machines and paying us ridiculous amounts of money despite our quality issues. If you got a game with "issues" it's fine, don't complain because it doesn't interfere with your enjoyment. Please just ignore the issue like we have.

Our company's put countless hours and efforts into making Willy Wonka a fun experience for you and your loved ones to appreciate for years to come. I mean really, our people work hard every day with passion to design and create amazing games for you to play. As we always have, we will stand by our product and support our loyal customers and I can tell you that'll never change.
Thank you"

Every since pinside made a stink about this, we have been figuring out what to say. Our games are the best and you can still play the game with a chipped PF. If you are not happy with our defective PF's we will stand behind them and sell you a new one for $500

I'm sorry, but at this point you have to be insane to give JJP $12,500 for a CE. My props to RichieWrench for being vocal and leading the charge of not buying another JJP game until current owners with defective PF's are taken care of. I feel bad for Jack, it's a difficult situation for a company to be in and can cost them a lot of money. But, if they spent some money after the POC issue to find and fix it then, it would of saved them even more money now. I love this hobby, but it's only a want for me, not a need & I definitely don't need to deal with bad PF's.

This is a huge opportunity for someone to come in and steal JJP's thunder ...... DeepRoot?

#1728 42 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

My personal buying preferences are immaterial to the subject... which was pinball machines are not hands off trophies without flaws. They wear, they have flaws, they break, we fix them, we keep on living. If you can’t accept that... you’re in the wrong hobby.

Yes, I can tighten screws, replace plastics and will even try some light soldering if required, but I lack the skill and time for a PF swap.
Also I expect some wear on machine after several hundred plays, not new out of the box. I sort of expect most things to be working and in good condition when I take my $8,000 toy of of the box. I realize things work themselves loose during shipping, humans make mistakes during assembly, but I just can't accept a NIB PF that is not near perfect out of the box before a ball starts rolling around on it. I understand you are fine, but there is no way anybody in this forum will get me to accept a NIB that has chipping after a low number of plays. I'm just gonna go back to buying used, and if you are one of those that accepted a machine with a sub-standard PF, please don't offer to sell me yours at a discount.

I feel like we sort of get what we expect in this hobby. Consumers hold all the power. We are buying toys that are a want not a need. We could all stop buying NIB today and it really won't impact our lives. I didn't think I would be one to jump on the bandwagon, but I just don't need this kind of stress from a hobby. I want to come home and just play some pinball. I want to see a new title that excites me and call my distributor to order one. If I drop $8 grand on a new toy, I expect it to be defect free out of the box, if it's not I assume the manufacturer will make it right. In any business, customer service is %100.

#1917 38 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I’m still getting my Wonka CE ....
It’s no secret with JJP games that you roll the dice somewhat

$12,500 is a big crap shoot ... hope for a 7 or 11

#1933 38 days ago
Quoted from DerGoetz:

Its the other way around, he is in a horrible position. I feel bad for the man and the investors, it is not like they ordered a bad playfield from their vendor on purpose. But I sure enough did not order a bad POTC CE either.
Speaking of which, why is JJP not going after the playfield vendors? They are at fault to begin with.

No of course the did not.... but they did make a conscious decision to ship machines with bad playfields.

Bottom line: Kudos to Jack for making personal calls and offering replacement PF's (not good enough in my book) but JJP was well aware of this issue after POTC and Wonka PF's should of been 100%. In no way, should Wonka's shipped with PF issues after they were aware of issues POTC owners are having.

#2008 35 days ago
Quoted from wesman:

I'm going to post this comment in each thread I've posted about regarding POTC or JJP playfield issues. (Adding text to avoid double post error.)
I feel like anytime a company or individual is criticized for a lack of quality within their output, they should be equally commended when that output is adjusted.
I received an email from Jack before I headed out for work midday Thursday. I work second shift, and Friday had a voicemail left by him when I awoke, and called him back immediately.
Jack seemed earnest, gracious, and humbled in his offer of a new playfield to correct my issues with my POTC playfield tear and rippling. For me, this is the best I could hope for. I don't expect a fully populated playfield swap, or an outright machine exchange. What I am receiving is acknowledgment openly of the issues that have occured within this game, and done so by the company face of said product.
I respect this move. And it gives me greater confidence towards JJP then I had two months ago.
Jack as well, seemed confident these issues are being course corrected moving forward, and his overall tone was upbeat, wishing to make amends, and continue and improve customer relations. In my mind, for me and my situation, that has occurred.
That said, if it weren't for every single person being vocal on this issue, on this forum or via podcasts, whether supporting or accepting these issues, this outcome might not be happening. So I am thankful to all of you, as well as Jack and JJP, for helping make this lovely game "whole" again once more.
I also hope everyone affected by this issue is made whole again as well.

Great if a new PF makes you whole. Wouldn't do squat for me - it would just sit in my basement - I lack the time and skill to swap it and don't feel I should have to pay someone $1500 to do it for me. Now if JJP is offering the PF + covering the swap cost = all is good.
Anything less than that, are they are getting off the hook easy.

#2051 34 days ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Do you even own a Wonka?

I had a deposit in on a CE and canceled it - I would love to be back in on a future JJP title but that all depends on how they handle already affected customers - so I am watching this thread carefully.

Also have a deposit down on a JP2 Premium - waiting to see how Stern handles current customers and the quality of the LE PF's.

Anybody's interest in these issues doesn't depend on them owning a Wonka. How JJP treats current customers with these issues, could be predictive of how they treat future customers with similar issues. If they are going to just send out free PF's - I'm going to pass, that's not an acceptable solution to many. If it was me, I would really rather have a $500 refund (or whatever the full value of a pf is), then an extra PF sitting in my basement collecting dust.

I have always been an admirer of JJP games - I hope they do the right thing.

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