(Topic ID: 249691)

Wonka LE Sling Post Chipping in one month!!


By rs812

3 months ago



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#1451 83 days ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Not surprised at all they’re not going to do anything unless there’s chipping/paint loss. Interesting they’ve told you not to remove the posts. Obviously that’s going to cause the clear to chip.
Does that mean if the clear chips when you remove posts that it’s not covered? Then you have to contact tech support before removing. How is tech support to do it without chipping? What about in 2 years when you want to strip and clean the Playfield?

I was wondering the exact same thing.

#1452 83 days ago

Never bought a Jersey jack.
After reading this thread im out..

#1453 83 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

I'm in the same camp....I would add CGC to the list...they make a quality product

My AFMR LE #21 is awesome. Rock solid. Had some issues first few weeks but distributor and CGC support was responsive and on point. I had a blemish on the main saucer I didn’t like. A new one was on my doorstep a week later. I had ramps and stuff not behaving as expected. They did FaceTime chats, recorded videos, and printed instructions on how to do what needed to be done.

The product was not perfect out of box but the support got me 100% to where I wanted and expected the product to be.

#1454 83 days ago
Quoted from Dr-pin:

Rofl thoose two mumbleing drones.
Ah, um, ah.
Is this some kind of odd version of a commercial?
Honestly, it's one of the strangest things i ever heard.

It really was so silly and still it somewhat reminded me of an old interview....

What Do you pinsiders say?
Same guys?

#1455 83 days ago

Man, sure am enjoying buying B/W class of 92 to 98 games. When I return from my current assignment, I am taking possession of a beautiful Shadow with a freshly touched up PF with zero Sanctum wear on it. Game that is 25 years old looking better than a NIB that is 25 DAYS old.

JJP and Stern, you better wake up before the rest of the community starts doing what I'm doing, or....someone like Spooky gets Jaws or BTTF. Right now, Spooky would pulverize with one of those dream themes.

#1456 83 days ago
Quoted from dashv:

Just listened to it.
Honestly, he just confirmed that a Wonka is not for me. I keep turning this into a huge post justifying why and then deleting all of it.
Darn it, here I go...
I’m not a JJP hater. I just can’t buy a product that they don’t know what the problem is. Can’t say when or if it will be fixed. Do say they will stand by it “like they always do.” While at least a dozen on this thread have said JJP left them out to dry on this or other tables.
Once my Munsters Premium arrives (which I am terrified will have pooling) I am done with NiB until I read this stuff is sorted.
I keep following hoping for a resolution.
Glad I read about the person who installed a new post on their months old table and got new pooling. That sucks.
Until reading that was thinking about buying those soft washers to handle any pooling I encountered.
Seems like let it be and pray for good support if it chips. Or be ready to patch it up with superglue. Anyone got a good tutorial (video?).

JJP/Jack’s canned response is suppose to address all of the concern expressed here??? Very poor and typical JJP response: “we really don’t care; read between the lines”; “if you think (unbelievable) you have a problem, call me so I can tell you that you really don’t and that pooling/chipping all over your PF is a unique characteristic of JJP one of a kind art”. We work hard to make it look that way.

In-other-words, JJP has no plan or real remedy and will not take care of buyers, because they are loading each box with the exemption of liability letter. The letter that really says, “Caveat Emptor” or “Buyer Beware”!!! You’ve just purchased a predetermined faulty product, which is one of a kind. We have no solution and your now stuck!!! But hey, just enjoy your unique one of a kind $12,500.00 pile of soon to be junk that no one on the secondary market will ever want!

11
#1457 83 days ago

I talked to Jack on the phone. It was splended. He fixed all my playfield issues.

He fed me BS and lied about his statements later in email.

#1458 83 days ago

I’m with you npo And all this does is increase the value of the classics.

#1459 83 days ago
Quoted from dashv:

patch it up with superglue

Well why didn't he just come out and say it then?

#1460 83 days ago

Pretty piss poor but not unexpected response. Look at the pirates thread - three months ago atleast JJP knew they had a problem but didn’t think solving it for wonka was important.

#1461 82 days ago

I have been trying to think of a band aid fix to avoid an increase in pooling by using a larger rubber washer or wider washer under the post.

I wonder how a wider 3d printed washer that tapers to the diameter to match a smaller slim post (9.5mm dia) but goes wider but tapers away from the playfield to still supports a star post but not touch the playfield. A steel washer could do the same but the star post may fracture if not supported.

In having a taper it could possibly hide the pooling and scarring on the playfield for the moment.

I know JJP does not want anyone to play with their playfields even though no solution is in sight, and really the clear on the playfield is crap all over if you are getting pooling around posts.

I put the file up on Shapeways and once you are a Shapeways member you should be able to download the STL and print yourself (let me know if not visible), or send me a pm with your email address and I will send it to you and you can then on share it, print and test. I don't want to earn any money out of this but it could be an idea to help people out for the interim. I stress I do not want to earn a single cent from this but Shapeways has their price on the part to manufacture and cover labourt but I have zero commission on this design but please download or get the file off me if you want to test this concept.

Added Note: at it's thickest it is 1mm thick, if people feel the special base needs to be thicker to clear the pooling just let me know and can do a 1.5mm and 2mm thick which will increase the taper angle and give greater clearance over the pooling.

pooling post base (resized).pngpooling post close up (resized).png

#1462 82 days ago
Quoted from swinks:

I have been trying to think of a band aid fix to avoid an increase in pooling by using a larger rubber washer or wider washer under the post.
I wonder how a wider 3d printed washer that tapers to the diameter to match a smaller slim post (9.5mm dia) but goes wider but tapers away from the playfield to still supports a star post but not touch the playfield. A steel washer could do the same but the star post may fracture if not supported.
In having a taper it could possibly hide the pooling and scarring on the playfield for the moment.
I know JJP does not want anyone to play with their playfields even though no solution is in sight, and really the clear on the playfield is crap all over if you are getting pooling around posts.
I put the file up on Shapeways and once you are a Shapeways member you should be able to download the STL and print yourself (let me know if not visible), or send me a pm with your email address and I will send it to you and you can then on share it, print and test. I don't want to earn any money out of this but it could be an idea to help people out for the interim. I stress I do not want to earn a single cent from this but Shapeways has their price on the part to manufacture and cover labourt but I have zero commission on this design but please download or get the file off me if you want to test this concept.
[quoted image][quoted image]

So nice of you to share and come up with something. No one else has a solution, not even JJP. Have you tried it on any table? What are the results?

#1463 82 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

So nice of you to share and come up with something. No one else has a solution, not even JJP. Have you tried it on any table? What are the results?

no I only just designed it and uploaded for people to try. I am a mech engineer so I can't help looking at a problem and coming up with a possible short term solution. I don't have a recent game with any pooling issues so basing it on a theory and gut thoughts.

13
#1464 82 days ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

I talked to Jack on the phone. It was splended. He fixed all my playfield issues.

He fed me BS and lied about his statements later in email.

The COmpaNy Lawyer wrote the script Jack read and sent to the two monotone drones.

#1465 82 days ago
Quoted from swinks:

no I only just designed it and uploaded for people to try. I am a mech engineer so I can't help looking at a problem and coming up with a possible short term solution. I don't have a recent game with any pooling issues so basing it on a theory and gut thoughts.

Looks quite good and the only thing positive I’ve seen in this is whole thread or anywhere on a possible help. So we go to Shapeways? Do you have a link where we can obtain the file or order the part?

#1466 82 days ago
Quoted from swinks:

I have been trying to think of a band aid fix to avoid an increase in pooling by using a larger rubber washer or wider washer under the post.
I wonder how a wider 3d printed washer that tapers to the diameter to match a smaller slim post (9.5mm dia) but goes wider but tapers away from the playfield to still supports a star post but not touch the playfield. A steel washer could do the same but the star post may fracture if not supported.
In having a taper it could possibly hide the pooling and scarring on the playfield for the moment.
I know JJP does not want anyone to play with their playfields even though no solution is in sight, and really the clear on the playfield is crap all over if you are getting pooling around posts.
I put the file up on Shapeways and once you are a Shapeways member you should be able to download the STL and print yourself (let me know if not visible), or send me a pm with your email address and I will send it to you and you can then on share it, print and test. I don't want to earn any money out of this but it could be an idea to help people out for the interim. I stress I do not want to earn a single cent from this but Shapeways has their price on the part to manufacture and cover labourt but I have zero commission on this design but please download or get the file off me if you want to test this concept.
Added Note: at it's thickest it is 1mm thick, if people feel the special base needs to be thicker to clear the pooling just let me know and can do a 1.5mm and 2mm thick which will increase the taper angle and give greater clearance over the pooling.
[quoted image][quoted image]

In theory it's a great idea but the problem is that a star post is mostly hollow. You are reducing support on the outside edge where it is most important. This would only work well if the star post was solid. It would be far simpler to use two steel washers. One upper one that is the same diameter as the star post and will support the outside edges and a second lower washer, probably a #10 size, to space up the assembly but keep the lower washer well within the diameter of the upper washer so the outside edge of the upper washer does not touch the playfield. Or, someone could make solid star posts and then only one slightly undersized washer underneath it would be needed to keep the outside edges of the star post from touching the playfield.

-1
#1467 82 days ago

Star post with rubber underneath is all that’s needed.

#1468 82 days ago

On my Pirates, I installed good old fashioned star posts from Marco and used rubber washers from Home Depot on the slings, set all slings to 16 strength. Did this about 100 games in, after blistering (donuts) on the skinny posts began to appear. I haven't looked under the posts in the meantime, but 4 months later there was no spreading of the blistering beyond the washers.

Of course, as others have said this doesn't remove the overall problem that the clearcoat is shite to begin with - it obviously is, if blistering appeared after 100 games. I assume the entire PF will go to hell at some point but I hope not. To pay $9500 and not have my ass covered by the manufacturer angers me greatly and is completely unacceptable and bizarre to me. What a fucking hobby. These companies should be taken to the cleaners IMO. Any lawyers out there? Class action suit, anyone?

I've stopped playing it in the hope that the clearcoat hardens, I don't know if that makes any difference. Sadly, I'm going to wait until March 2020 to play again. That would be one year after manufacture to harden fully. I have over 20 other pins to play, so I'm ok to wait.

I'm 600 games on my Pirates with some very minor blistering elsewhere but overall things look ok. Personally, I don't mind blistering and even minor chips eventually, but when it comes time to SELL or TRADE this machine I will have to deal with the high standards of potential buyers and this will cost me money for something that was not of my doing.

Another huge problem was the t-nut protruding in the map hole that was gouging balls, resulting in potential ripping up of the PF. If you haven't done so already, cut that protruding bit off and change your balls, they will be cut to shit.

#1469 82 days ago

I have star posts (hand tightened) with neoprene washers on my potc since March and on my wonka and neither game shows any sign of trouble.

19
#1470 82 days ago

Listening to that one JJP apologist for those few minutes before Jack came on was one of the worst things I’ve ever forced myself to listen to. The other guy seemed a bit more sensible at least. What was the name of that podcast just so I know never to accidentally click on it again? Was that the JJP Insider Podcast?

#1471 82 days ago

Agreed. It was tortuous.

12
#1472 82 days ago

No mention of POTC owners at all, what BS.

Let me guess, this so called developing program for wonka owners with issues will be a post kit and a $550 PF for those with chipping, how awesome is that?

Jack is nothing more than a puppet who I lost all respect for, what a shit show JJP has become.

#1473 82 days ago
Quoted from zaphX:

I seriously need to get the hell off Pinside.

You certainly are not adding anything of value to the discussions with your one-note troll shtick.

#1474 82 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

No mention of POTC owners at all, what BS.

Once it’s off the line, it’s out of sight, out of mind.

#1475 82 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

No mention of POTC owners at all, what BS.
Let me guess, this so called developing program for wonka owners with issues will be a post kit and a $550 PF for those with chipping, how awesome is that?
Jack is nothing more than a puppet who I lost all respect for, what a shit show JJP has become.

Who is Jack a puppet for ?
That podcast was torturous!

#1476 82 days ago
Quoted from swinks:

no I only just designed it and uploaded for people to try. I am a mech engineer so I can't help looking at a problem and coming up with a possible short term solution. I don't have a recent game with any pooling issues so basing it on a theory and gut thoughts.

Cool idea Swinks but it's not very "3D printable" that bottom curve would barely resolve on a machine and also not a good flat printing base.

What if it were 2 pieces? The slightly wider star post but with the bottom 2mm or so removed to stay above the rippled clear, then a shaft and flange that fits inside that to provide the actual base and clearance?

You'd print 2 parts but they'd both have flat bottoms.

#1477 82 days ago
Quoted from harryhoudini:

I talked to Jack on the phone. It was splended. He fixed all my playfield issues.

He fed me BS and lied about his statements later in email.

Please share the emails

#1478 82 days ago
Quoted from tpir:

Please share the emails

What really sucks about this is a lot of people will disregard Wonka
Which by the way is the most fun the family has had with any pin I’ve owned

12
#1479 82 days ago

So......I guess I am still out.

My friends are not having their issues taken care of or maybe they will be?

I got mixed feelings from the response. I am staying true to my response.

1. FIND THE PROBLEM AND FIX IT...Okay seems like they might have narrow that down.

2. Take care of those that have been effected. Even if it is a minor as you say Jack and only effecting the few. THOSE FEW NEED TO BE TAKEN CARE OF AND AT NO COST....

till then I am out....

JJP IS LOSING MONEY...it was like this was a spark and they did not get out in front of this and now.....

ITS SERIOUS....I am not joking...I really do think that JJP has alot to worry about.

The world is watching JJP......Now watch your sales go down. This is going to be interesting as the weeks go by.

#1480 82 days ago

Page 30.....

I am still out...Wow JJP is this for real.

Inam already starting to look at other games..

34
#1481 82 days ago
Quoted from Pinballer67:

On my Pirates, I installed good old fashioned star posts from Marco and used rubber washers from Home Depot on the slings, set all slings to 16 strength. Did this about 100 games in, after blistering (donuts) on the skinny posts began to appear. I haven't looked under the posts in the meantime, but 4 months later there was no spreading of the blistering beyond the washers.
Of course, as others have said this doesn't remove the overall problem that the clearcoat is shite to begin with - it obviously is, if blistering appeared after 100 games. I assume the entire PF will go to hell at some point but I hope not. To pay $9500 and not have my ass covered by the manufacturer angers me greatly and is completely unacceptable and bizarre to me. What a fucking hobby. These companies should be taken to the cleaners IMO. Any lawyers out there? Class action suit, anyone?
I've stopped playing it in the hope that the clearcoat hardens, I don't know if that makes any difference. Sadly, I'm going to wait until March 2020 to play again. That would be one year after manufacture to harden fully. I have over 20 other pins to play, so I'm ok to wait.
I'm 600 games on my Pirates with some very minor blistering elsewhere but overall things look ok. Personally, I don't mind blistering and even minor chips eventually, but when it comes time to SELL or TRADE this machine I will have to deal with the high standards of potential buyers and this will cost me money for something that was not of my doing.
Another huge problem was the t-nut protruding in the map hole that was gouging balls, resulting in potential ripping up of the PF. If you haven't done so already, cut that protruding bit off and change your balls, they will be cut to shit.

Not playing your games to keep the resale value high is like not sleeping with your girl to keep her tight for the next guy.

#1482 82 days ago
Quoted from Adipocere:

Not playing your games to keep the resale value high is like not sleeping with your girl to keep her tight for the next guy.

Oh man that was great!

#1483 82 days ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Who is Jack a puppet for ?
That podcast was torturous!

The investors, you could tell he was likely reading a prepared statement from the investors and legal team.

There once was a time when Jack cared and would go above and beyond. I think it’s pretty evident he doesn’t make many big decisions for them anymore.

Can it be Jersey Jack if Jack wasn’t there?

10
#1484 82 days ago

It seems that as quality control continues to slide and more issues continue to arise year after year, the disclaimer page that is now included with these games will continue to get longer and longer. Pretty soon the disclaimer will be nicely bound and sold separately for $100 on their website.

#1485 82 days ago
Quoted from Adipocere:

Not playing your games to keep the resale value high is like not sleeping with your girl to keep her tight for the next guy.

This is gold, lol.

#1486 82 days ago
Quoted from pipes:

It seems that as quality control continues to slide and more issues continue to arise year after year, the disclaimer page that is now included with these games will continue to get longer and longer. Pretty soon the disclaimer will be nicely bound and sold separately for $100 on their website.

Lol

#1487 82 days ago
Quoted from RichieWrench:

Page 30.....
I am still out...Wow JJP is this for real.
Inam already starting to look at other games..

Pick up a ACNC. That's what i did I stead of wonka. Great game and great customer service.

#1488 82 days ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Let me guess what he said.....[quoted image]

Hmm, so the dimple issue has now matured into something we can all agree on......this letter by no means exonerates JJP or Stern for that matter. The pf issues are real, and we are not crazy or noobs, and we won't accept the steel vs wood bullshit.

#1489 82 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

Worst part is, resale value will be toast as the word gets out on JJP pinball machines.

And every Stern with these problems too.

Stern makes far more machines than JJP. We don’t know the % of their machines that have the clear coat problems, but odds on it’ll be more than JJP, simply because they manufacture 5X games a year than JJP.

And odds on that more people experienced ghosting inserts, chipping playfields/shooter lanes, wrinkling decals (that also came off), separated cabinets and busted mechs on Stern games as well. Not too mention node board failures. Stern ain’t no saint when it comes to QC.

So buyer beware, regardless of the manufacturer.

#1490 82 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

The investors, you could tell he was likely reading a prepared statement from the investors and legal team.
There once was a time when Jack cared and would go above and beyond. I think it’s pretty evident he doesn’t make many big decisions for them anymore.
Can it be Jersey Jack if Jack wasn’t there?</blockquot
I’m not trying to take up for him,like he’s my little brother or something, but hell he would be out of business if they had done WOZ every time.The SE was a smart move unfortunately Kaneda’s insanity and the playfield issues have tainted this effort

#1491 82 days ago
Quoted from pipes:

It seems that as quality control continues to slide and more issues continue to arise year after year, the disclaimer page that is now included with these games will continue to get longer and longer. Pretty soon the disclaimer will be nicely bound and sold separately for $100 on their website.

Thats funny....unfortunately it could be true I don't know Jack, but always had a lot of respect for his entrepreneurial spirit. JJP makes really great games that the entire family enjoys. I think many of us are fine with paying top dollar for the games, but that comes with expectations that they will stand behind their product. Collectors not only want a really fun game, but they want that game to look great. These play field issues are a big deal, and JJP needs to be proactive in figuring out the problem. I suspect many people will continue to buy their games if they solve these play field problems. Unfortunately I don't think JJP will ever replace play fields on POTC or Wonka (let alone a populated play field) or even provide that buyer with a new play field....they simply can't afford the financial hit. When we as consumers buy their product we're really rolling the dice.

#1492 82 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

Is name calling really necessary? It puts you in such a low category in poor human behavior.
Lol, I shouldn’t give this the dignity of a reply, but you’re the Stern hater on a mission and are the one to be ignored. You hate the fact that I’m calling it like it is. Noticed you don’t have much to say in your normal defense of JJP and all these clear coat issues?
I don’t hate JJP and have purchased their machines. How does that make me a hater?
Yes, I’m concerned at the customer service and machine issues I’ve had like anyone would be. Again, how does that make me a hater?
True, my experience with Stern has been stellar. Any issue although very few, has been handled in a “pronto” fashion and without hesitation. They value me as a customer and I value them as a manufacture by giving them my hard earned money. Why is this hard for you to understand??? Stern stands behind their product and it just keeps getting better. Have you taken a good look at how well their machine cabinets have been made since the beginning of this year? Every bit as good as JJPs cabinets.
(All you JJP apologists, go ahead and put your heads in the sand about the playfield chipping issues and downvote my comments)

Downvote.

#1493 82 days ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

These play field issues are a big deal, and JJP needs to be proactive in figuring out the problem.

Sorry, they missed the boat on being proactive
Proactive would have been taking care of the issue before Wonka shipped, now they're being reactive to all the noise being made on pinside.

#1494 82 days ago
Quoted from benheck:

Cool idea Swinks but it's not very "3D printable" that bottom curve would barely resolve on a machine and also not a good flat printing base.
What if it were 2 pieces? The slightly wider star post but with the bottom 2mm or so removed to stay above the rippled clear, then a shaft and flange that fits inside that to provide the actual base and clearance?
You'd print 2 parts but they'd both have flat bottoms.

I made a similar comment a few pages back in the thread. I was thinking along the lines of a metal standoff inside the post.
pasted_image (resized).png

#1495 82 days ago
Quoted from mbwalker:

I made a similar comment a few pages back in the thread. I was thinking along the lines of a metal standoff inside the post.
[quoted image]

Yeah so the wider star post would kind of "hover" over the ripple. And then the washer or shaft + flange inside would be a smaller diameter than the original star post so it wouldn't apply additional pressure to the clear.

#1496 82 days ago
Quoted from benheck:

Yeah so the wider star post would kind of "hover" over the ripple. And then the washer or shaft + flange inside would be a smaller diameter than the original star post so it wouldn't apply additional pressure to the clear.

Given JJP's experience on POTC, I'm surprised WW didn't have some clear coat relief around the holes, then redesign the post to rest on the wood, not the clear coat as it is now. Seems like a simple 'no brainer'. Still might have PF issues (ink adhesion), but at least this issue would be put to rest.

#1497 82 days ago
Quoted from mbwalker:

Given JJP's experience on POTC, I'm surprised WW didn't have some clear coat relief around the holes, then redesign the post to rest on the wood, not the clear coat as it is now. Seems like a simple 'no brainer'. Still might have PF issues (ink adhesion), but at least this issue would be put to rest.

This 100%

#1498 82 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Can it be Jersey Jack if Jack wasn’t there?

perhaps its time for one of the investors to step in as the new pitchman. or how about michael strahan? he used to play for the NJ giants.
jerseymikespins02 (resized).jpg

#1499 82 days ago

For a 3D print (on standard FDM machines) you want as much flat printing surface as possible.

So yeah a star post with a few mm removed at bottom to clear the ridge. Star post would have a hollow shaft inside.

Then another shaft with a bottom flange that fits inside the 3D printed star post. This gives you the clearance you need for pooling and flat bottomed parts that will print easily.

15672672969536996191124881522277 (resized).jpg15672674765582734222026270766352 (resized).jpg
#1500 82 days ago
Quoted from greenhornet:

perhaps its time for one of the investors to step in as the new pitchman. what about michael strahan? he used to play for the NJ giants.[quoted image]

Regular size Original Italian on wheat, Mike's Way please.....

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