I AM CALM!!!!!! (lol)

I do support JJP, But this I do not support this serious issue and taking a stand. This is not like JJP has been upfront on this and like Hey were sorry but here is a populated playfield to make up for this - I did my homework and TRUST ME - It was not easy for me to email JOE and tell him that I am out on my #12. I read alot of posts (ALOT) and have talked to those close to this and looked at the time frames and what was being done.

JJP is wrong as a company and they need to do the right thing - They should have done it from the start. But lets hope they will learn from this and fix the problem and move on to other games - Because if not, They are losing customers. I am just one and I am sure I will not break them on my sales - but as a whole they are hurting themselves.

They handled it w washers on POTC, and have had more than enough time to do the right thing.

I also cancelled my POTC CE, as well as Wonka CE when it was obvious there was no intent of addressing the issue.

Commending RichieWrench for taking a stand...speaks volumes....

Something wrong in JJP land, is what it is

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The problem actually is not being handled because there are lots of people who have already been told that they aren’t getting a new playfield. I know that you are a JJP fan because 90% of your posts are about JJP, which thats great and i get it but please don’t take up for them when they aren’t standing behind their products. There are lots of POTC owners right now that are fit to be tied with JJP and rightfully so.

I love my Sterns too but if they don’t stand behind their games i will publicly blast them to no end. Theres nothing worse than a company selling someone a 5-13K game that is defective and then telling them that they wont replace the defective playfield that they sold them that was of very poor quality.

They've made a statement. Been making one for quite some time. Have a feeling this latest is going to hit pretty hard.

You sir are an outstanding individual and I applaud and stand beside you. At one time I was going to collect every JJP game like yourself, but now just sticking with Stern, as they back up any and every thing I’ve ever asked of them. I really wanted WW and Toy Story CE, but will be out on it, if this does not get handled. I’m not sure it is going to be handled in the correct manner. The new owners are not demonstrating that they run that kind of business.

If I was in your part of the country, you’d get all my plumbing business! I agree, when Richie is out on getting a number 12, this is serious. I agree, with MK, JJP has been making a statement on the serious PF issues for quite sometime. Nothing has been resolved, with all the issues from POTC and now WW. They’ve made a statement. Pay $550.00 for an unpopulated play field and do the major mechanical change over that almost no one is qualified to do or live with it or get out. Pretty clear statement already made.

Said the captain of the Titanic...

My RR Woz has no ink/art under the sling post, no problem on my end. I am starting to think maybe it is the ink not letting the clear coat cure right

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My potc was damaged in shipping and returned to JJP to be fixed. Jack and his son personally repaired my game and even signed it. I provide that background so that everyone will realize what JJP is doing as of last week for this issue. I was told by my distro that they would be applying all the factory fixes that they've identified.

For the clear pooling issue, they not only acknowledged there is an issue, but they also realized the washers they are providing aren't adequate. I say that because they supplied my game with very thick rubber under star posts for the slings. Some (all?) of the other posts had no fix applied and show pooling of the clear. This is a game born in January with no play on it other than their testing.

The clear is so soft that just the clamping force of these posts is enough to squeeze out the clear. Until or if the clear hardens, these posts can't be installed or this will happen again. No game sitting unplayed with those posts still installed is safe from this it would appear. I'm going to be monitoring to see if people's replacement potc playfields ever harden. If they do and JJP won't stand behind their product, I guess I'll buy a $550 playfield and sit on it

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Do you really think he would tell you hay buddy I mark up my games by $1500 per unit

JJP response has been “buy another bad playfield unpopulated for $550”

Stern response is https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jurassic-park-stern-2019-owners-club-welcome-to-jurassic-park/page/10#post-5165129

I’m loving JJP less these days :/

The prices are pretty set for JJPs from what I see. And again, I was just passing on what he said, not vouching for its accuracy.

Actions speak louder than words.

It’s a little late for a statement for us POtC owners who have been dealing with this shit since winter and wasted countless amounts of time emailing and talking on the phone with JJP.

Yet no acceptable resolution to date.

So now because wonka is all jacked up they are going to do something?

Hopefully they take care of the POTC folks too.

Now that is a funny pic...lmao.

Since you have some inside info from JJP, can you tell us if they will ever address the Dialed In patch issues on the early machines and why they decided to upgrade the processor and increase the memory mid production, effectively screwing all the early buyers of Dialed In? It's awesome that a good number of Dialed In owners are stuck on 1.57 and haven't been able to apply patches 1.60, 1.61 and 1.71 because our hardware cannot support it. Anyone buying a NIB JJP machine should be aware that they have done this and could do it again in the future. Terrible business practice if you ask me.

Woah I had no idea that was a thing. That's absurd. You'd think they'd send out some sort of upgraded boards to the early adopters...

Is the JJP Open House this weekend?

Not it there is a waiting list of people who would buy it in an instant if Richie passes

Wait.......what!?!

Exactly.....Stern does stand behind it's product, and though a pita, will send populated pf's, cabs, whatever, if you bitch enough (sometimes you don't even have to).

Paranoia over spike board availability? imagine what a Cl**ster F**K it would be if you couldn't get proprietary JJP boards!!! Does anyone even sell these outside of direct from factory?

I'm still amazed that people are thrilled to pay for the 2.0 board upgrade....think about it...making people pay for replacement boardsets that were crap when they bought the machine. I'm not thinking about it anymore...this is completely out of control, and been going on since inception. Eyes super wide open now....

If I hear one more time "most innovative, best built machines"......sick of this shit....really am

Whoa.

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"Jeff....May not like that"

U really got 10K cash in your pocket?

Who needs cash anyway?

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Glad to see ya'll starting to really bind together and stop buying this product. If I bought a game NIB for like $3K and this shit was happening, I'd lose it. I can't imagine 4X that amount.

FWIW, even from down here in the Florida Panhandle, your efforts within the national community are known, and I respect your commitment and devotion to it. Thank you, and here's to hoping JJP really gets their fucking shit together, or does the majority of the community a favor and simply bows out.

Quite frankly, between having a PF that is falling apart in chunks or no game at all, I'd choose no game. Less stress and more $$ in my account.

There’s not a waiting list.

Seriously? There’s a waiting list for Wonka CE’s? No one even knows what the CE is yet. Hard to believe, but then again nothing surprises me in this hobby.

I told JJP the same thing a few weeks ago.
I will not buy Wonka or anything else until they fix their playfield issues.

They have known about my chipping from the beginning.
Of course I was offered the post fix, which doesn't cover the damage on my POTC LE.
I wasn't even offered the playfield until I asked about it.
Then offered the same deal of 550.00 plus international shipping charges.
Horse shit I think, these games cost close to 14,000.00 CAD. here.
I really don't think the customer should have to pony up for the playfield either.

Still waiting on my reply to the last email, my reply is going up the ladder supposedly.
It has been a long time on this one issue already.

Step up JJP

Pretty sure he’s joking. Over 500 waiting list on a $12,500.00 unseen machine. Don’t think so. Even seen they’d never sell 500 or so called laugh a minute LE number of 5000. Unreal.

What’s so funny is we don’t have to make up this stuff, JJP supplies us with it!

I didnt mean to indicate that there was a waiting list...I dont think there is, but there are a lot of wealthy people in this hobby, so who knows...

Isn't it just a <$100 new motherboard/CPU combo?

Their ladder is short, with not many working there to escalate toward, so think you’ve got an answer already, which is so sad what they’re doing to you.

JJP back room “coming up with a fix” conversation: “Really hoping there are enough suckers out there that don’t read pinside or don’t realize the pooling and chipping all over their PF is not normal.” Lol

They have huge balls to offer buyers with issues replacement play fields at $500.
Did you ask if the playfield offered was from a different production run than what’s already in your machine?
I can only imagine what would happen(stroke /mental breakdown) if someone took them up on their lame replacement offer and actually undertook or payed someone to do the swap only to have the same exact problems/issues occur that they already had to begin with!!!

I don't know your background or how long you've been in pinball - maybe since you joined Pinside or for 40 years.

That being said, when GBs was leaked, the LEs sold out (bought from distributors) overnight - all of them - gone. There was a near "mass hysteria" from the community (read: home owners - NOT distributors) to get their hands on one. Shiniest turd I've ever seen.

Bottom line: it is absolutely not unprecedented. GBLE was also $4500 less expensive. Let that sink in for a moment - the difference of the value of a NIB Stern Pro at 2014 pricing - is the difference between GBLE and WonkaCE.

I can't believe they just send out a new pf who is gonna be able to fit that? a pf swap is an insane amount of work. Plus You need all the tools and spare time to do it. Are these pf partly populated? ie have all the t-nuts installed etc...

I can't see many people taking that offer up unless they have previous experience.

I didn't ask them, But we all know Mirco is doing them all.
Probably have the same issues if used right away.
I would hope some cure time would help it though.

At only $550, you can be sure that is only the wood PF, nothing else. Had a friend that received one and it is only the wood printed clear coated PF. $550 for the main part of the machine. $12,500.00 for a CE. There’s a little markup in there. I realize, some $5 to $50 mechs as well as few hundred dollars worth of screen, computer, cabinet and license. Always thought the large markup was to be able to take care of issues like this? Amazing Stern can make a pro for basically $7k less.

New owners? Did I miss something?

Well this was the SPOT for the WWCF CE #12 -- It was all nice and ready for it to be inserted in and hopefully before my Annual Pinball Party that I have before the Chicago Expo.

I wonder If I could just put in a palm tree here.

I told my wife what I did - SHE WAS SHOCKED -- You guys and gals have to understand this - I wanted to take my time and do my own homework and not just jump on a bandwagon and I wanted to make sure that what I did was something that I felt strong about and might be able to help and lets see if we get somewhere with this issue.

My biggest concern to me was to make sure that I did not hurt Joe's feelings. Because I know Joe is my friend and all, BUT -- If I got a playfield that was chipping - I would be PIST and it would go back to Joe and I would not settle for washers of some kind of cheap fix. I get there is an issue with the playfields and not Just Willy Wonka - POTC and I hear some others. The part that got me was JJP's fix or trying to help those that scream loud enough and even they had to pay for playfield for $550.00 at their own expense.

I am lucky that If I had to populate a playfield, I have someone that can do that for me - But even that would cost me about 1200.00 to have that done. So, if you add the cost of the new playfield and labor - You are in for about $2,000.00 - When it should be ZERO.

I am not looking to hurt JJP - But I really do want them to know that they are hurting me and those around me - Some here are my friends and I take what they say serious and for me it was like hurting a part of my Pinball family.

SO HERE IS WHAT I HAVE TO SAY TO JJP and Jack (if he has any say in this matter) - I hope they see this and takes this to heart for what it is worth:

I remember the day that when Jack came to alot of us and had this crazy idea of starting a Pinball Company and introduce a game called WOZ Emerald City - It was for most of us, It was a LEAP OF FAITH. All of us that was in this pool paid up front to help fund this and it took as much as 2 years for this game to come along and for me the game was great. I mean what an idea, A company that made high end quality pinball machines and then there was Hobbit, It took the company up to the next level and for me - They listen about this game and made changes - AGAIN - They listened and made changes from the feedback that they were getting from the pinball community. Did it delay that game - Yes it Did, but I think the end result was much better and they did not just push it out there and just say " HERE IT IS". There are alot of us out there that were with you from the start and you are starting to lose that base that helped to get JJP where it is today - So Please, Listen to what is going on and offer a good solution that will make those affected happy.

But what I am concern with is the chipping of the playfields. Just does not seem like JJP to offer the best solution, which is a populated playfield - But the sad truth is - It is up to JJP to make this right. And as of this posting - They have not made it right and till they do, I am out on any game and those that know me -- THAT IS ALOT FOR ME TO SAY -- I LOVE PINBALL and this really does hurt my feelings that there are those around us that are getting hurt and being forced to settle.

If they (JJP Management / Owners ) care about my future investment and others as well, Then listen to what is going on - Contact your distributors - This is NO JOKE - Your are loosing sales - This not only affects JJP but it also affects the distributors and others - Think about those that make the Mods.

Are you kidding me - I spend a ton of money on Powder Coating and Mods - I can can tell you that there was well over $1,000.00 in Willy Wonka Mods / Mirror Blades / Powder Coating and YES....Matt with BackAlley does my powder coating and he will not get my business because I am out on a CE Model. There is an ripple effect here that I hope that JJP will see and will make things right.

DO I SOUND CALM -- Because I am so calm on this subject and feel that it is the right thing to do.

WE NEED TO ALL STAND TOGETHER AND VOICE OUR CONCERNS.

JJP are you Listening?

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Was my last post calm??

Can anyone tell me that??

Did I seem Calm?

I read the first and last sentence of your post. It sums up your point really well.

"Well this was the SPOT for the WWCF CE #12...

JJP are you listening?"

SHIT -- ALL THAT TYPING -- For what you put down in two sentences.

Okay - But did I sound Calm?

You sounded calm to me. You are just passionate about pinball and you wish all of this wasnt happening. Nothing wrong with that at all, we all feel the same way.

I'm right behind you, Richie. I'm officially out on my CE pre-order as well. My dream theme, no less. We're now 19 weeks, 1 day without even seeing the thing anyway. See you later, Jack.