I’ve had a Williams Penny Pitch (Ringer) for a couple years now. It wasn’t working when I got it, and had never worked.

I’ve cleaned the score reels, and adjusted the switches properly. The manual is incorrect I believe, as it says all switches should be open at 0 position. But I’ve tried both ways and it had no impact.

I’ve cleaned and checked the two stepper units, and they operate freely and reset properly.

The game will add credits properly. When the start is pushed it will remove a credit and reset the score reels to 0, but then keeps cycling.

I’ve visually checked the switches on the relays and score motor against the schematic.

I have schematics and the manual. But haven’t been able to get anywhere.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks for the tip.

I have confirmed that the horseshoe stepper is in the zero position. From the manual it states "Engage relay is energized when wiper on horseshoe unit disc is at zero position" I used my DMM to check continuity between the wiper arm and engage relay.

So upon pushing the start button, the score reels reset properly and the control motor starts.

The start relay engages and holds. The lock relay pulses with the score motor switch 1c properly, but does not hold.

THe score reset relay pulses with score motor impulse cam switch B.

The one behavior that doesn’t look right is that the brake solenoid engage and holds. It is pulses by score motor switch, but it seems to be releasing it momentarily.

Thoughts?

Here’s the manual:

FDC4BB5B-EA2F-4BEB-A640-2D9310E4FE57 (resized).jpeg

And here’s the reels in the 0 position:

06797C7A-D6F5-49D8-A9B9-A91EEB038FB8 (resized).jpeg

That was my original thought, but both sides look the same. And when I adjusted the switch to be open, there was no change in the operation.

To clarify: If I leave the score reels in the 0 position, and open up the top switch (or put an insulator between the contacts), there is no impact on the start up sequence. (I did this to all 4 reels at the same time).

Yes. The horseshoe stepper and the shot count stepper both reset properly. That is: when I advance them manually, and then start a game, they reset to the correct position.

Schematics can be reviewed here, for anyone that wants to help get this thing working:

http://www.pinrepair.com/arcade/wms_ringer_sch.pdf

And for reference, here's the 10-90 score reel switches. Again, both sides are like this.

Score switches (resized).jpg

It looks like the schematic is requiring the 0 switch to be closed:

33B30E49-3B3E-4AE4-8299-544480549A5A (resized).jpeg

So this means the instruction manual is incorrect.

Also, the brake solenoid should be engaged, when the motor cycles, per the schematic (just above my red circle in the picture). So that behavior is correct.

So far, it looks like it should work. But it doesn't.

What should be my next step to look at?

It's got the goody bag still stapled on the inside.

I'm pretty sure that this means the game is HUO right?

Goodie bag (resized).jpg

I'm just going to bump this up, to see if anyone else can help.

Any help before it’s turned into firewood??

I have put red boxes around the switches that keep the score motor from turning off.

If these are all open, the motor should not run after game start, is that correct?

Ringer Control Motor (resized).JPG

EDIT: Nevermind on this one. Lots of other stuff happening. See my posts below

Here's the full schematics:

wms_ringer_sch.pdf

And here's the manual:

wms_ringer_man.pdf

Relays are located starting on pg 15

Yeah, I know this may not be the right crowd for getting tech EM help. But hopefully someone has some tips.

Looking at my previous posts: "The start relay engages and holds. The lock relay pulses with the score motor switch 1c properly, but does not hold." I believe this may be part of the problem.

The schematic for the lock relay looks like this:

Lock Relay (resized).JPG

The manual has this description:

Lock Relay info (resized).JPG

So if I'm interpreting the schematic properly:
Once the start relay engages, and the control motor rotates (closing the switch on CM1), the lock relay should engage. When this happens, the lock relay should then stay engaged through the cabinet slam switch, and it's own switch (A in this case).

Can someone please run a sanity check on this for me?

Thank you for confirming the score reel switches!

I'll start jumpering and see if there is any improvement.

The lock relay is odd, because if I hold it closed with my fingers, and then release it will stay closed. Sometimes it will stay closed even when the game over relay is tripped (and everything else de-energizes). But the lock relay sometimes also opens back up when I let go, or shortly thereafter and pulses with the control motor.

Ah ha! Progress! Jumpered the lock relay to the tilt switch, started a game, and the lock relay engaged and held. Issue was in the Jones plug (even though I had cleaned them it still want making contact). Got that issue fixed.

Next issue was the spin switch wasn’t pulsing the horseshoe relay. Found a switch on the control motor needed adjusting.

Current issue is the spin switch will activate the horseshoe relay, and it stays locked on.

I’ll take any tips anyone has to fix the next issue, but am going to need a break from it tonight.

Thanks for the help so far!

I need some help interpreting schematics/function to figure out the issue with the horseshoe relay (HS RE) staying locked on.

From the manual, the HS RE is pulsed by the spin switch. I have confirmed that the spin switch does engage the HS RE. The manual also states that switch bank A is "In hold circuit to this relay" and switch bank B "Energizes horseshoe unit S.U. coil"
HS RE man (resized).JPG

How can the HS RE be pulsed, if it has it's own hold circuit? Once the HS RE is energized, doesn't it lock itself on through switch bank A, and therefore also lock on switch bank B (horseshoe S.U. coil)?

Here's some more pictures from the schematic, with my interpretations:

Spin wheel switch is closed (green line), providing a path to the HS RE (red line):
HS RE schem sw (resized).JPG

HS RE is energized, closing it's normally open switch (green line), providing a locked on path to the HS RE (red line):
HS RE schem re (resized).JPG

HS RE being energized, closes it's normally open switch (green line), locking on the horseshoe s.u. coil?? How does this work?
HS RE schem2 (resized).JPG

Great tips! Thank you.

I was actuating the horseshoe relay by hand (with a game stated) to see if everything was working. A couple times doing this, then I reset the game. Now the HS RE works properly, by pulsing the s.u. coil!

I'm not sure what the actual fix was, so I'll keep looking over stuff.