You know Chessiv's project already. It's called NUcore.

Both meaning Playboy too? Honestly not a whole lot to video on that one.

No I think that was another project.

Yes from Playboy also and with sound. Thank you very much!

Not sure what you are on about

All the latest and current were on the wms pc's that we received all the code which we loaned a copy to the nucore guys under a NDA to see if it was cost affective at that time.

The software in not complete never was, it is on a 32meg eproms/proms, complete code would have been on 64meg which are no longer made in proms or roms that big.

sure roms can be burnt and put on prism cards as it stands but it would need to be redone and all new code added and a system like pinbox or nucore used.

All this software is now in the hands of PPS.

I am sure if someone wants to do it, should call rick directly

As the only person who had written any code at all for Playboy, I can guarantee you this is accurate. Also, pretty sure everything was checked in and there's no extra surprise crap sitting on a hard drive somewhere. I also SERIOUSLY doubt there is a cache of un-checked-in code on any of the other programmers' computers.

Ok now I see how those rotating flashers must work. the motor and light are connected to the same thing. I could not tell in the videos of the rotating and light were controlled separately or together.

Do Wizard Blocks and Playboy have also a system-menu for settings etc.? Is there also the option for tournament play / network gaming? Do both games have music and soundeffects?

Mmr is happening cause sterns factory is building the game. Not saying Chicago gaming couldn't pull it off, but having not done anything for build set up on mmr it would have been costly and a long wait for mmr to get completed. Rick has had all the chips fall correctly with a little luck involved. Glad it's getting done, but don't think it wouldn't take another mirracle to pull off wb cause it would. Redoing a completed game and redoing a incomplete game are night n day.

I really don't understand why you think this.

How much of a new game project (especially one with an existing cabinet spec) do you think working on the cabinet is?

Bottom line is the cost am I correct?

If so, have all the parties that are capable of actually producing WB in any form( Full machine, Playfield, Kit Playfield) have actually sat down together to determine the completed cost to build it and then come up with what they consider would be the appropriate sales price to reap a profit?

This is a serious question without such a complete hash it out meeting with all parties involved, Animators,Software Programmers ,Lawyers, Builders etc..) together coming up with a real cost to build number how can the project be discarded as just a dream?

What would that price be?

Toss it out to the masses and see what feedback you would get. That would determine once and for all if it would be a worthwhile project to undertake.

Maybe just maybe some of the talent that would create the machine would not charge so much as it could be part labor of love and being part of such a great project and just wanting to see it get done. (Highly Unlikely but you never know)

I would love to see WB made. Impossible of course not. Bottom line is money.

The people who can do all the things it takes for this to happen don't want to do it... On top of everything that's a unknown like finding someone to finish programming it, finding someone to finish designing it, finding someone to build the parts, getting all the ducks in a row that u don't know the cost... It's taking a year to rebuild a mmr.. They can build three more repo games before they finish wb to build it... I want it as much as the next guy, never going to happen. Move along!

And so I will.

According to some that can pull off this project who by the way have posted on this thread, would like to do it, the issue is money.

Its not lack of programing, builders, parts sourcing ( would be hard but not impossible) etc Its the lack of MONEY.

Wizard Blocks is not made because it needs Wizard Bucks.

If I'm mistaken please anyone that can do the project PPS ,Chuck etc tell me Im wrong or is there something so incredibly spectacularly technologically sophisticated about Wizard blocks that it can never be created even with modern technology which almost says that the Pin2k Platform should never have existed.

If the powers that be agreed on a satisfactory figure for both profit and consumers I believe WB would get made.

Probably because the playfield in question is already designed. From a design aspect, it's already there. Artwork, already done. Just have to be pieced together and the software finished. Many months of development are already done.

This kind of thing seems like a perfect fit for a Kickstarter or other crowdfunding. Want WB finished? Raise 6 figures. Want Lyman Sheets to do the programming on your new project? Launch a Kickstarter and when you reach 6 figures, give him a call. People sometimes do unexpected things when offered $100,000. Obviously not needed for WB but it seems like the crowdfunding thing is working. Might work for pinball.

more like 7 figures ...

I doubt Lyman is going to give up his job for a six figure payday and my guess is Stern might have a problem with him taking a leave of absence to work on a competing product.

I don't know Lyman, but one would presume it would need to be in "F. U. number" territory.

I'm not sure why you guys are so fixated on this pin. How many pins that come out look great when you see photos or short video clips but SUCK when you sit down and really play them?

You always desire most what you can not have.

So forget Lyman, and see what it would cost with hobbyists doing the programming. Someone is making a whole new Pin2K game (Haunted Cruise) for fun. Seems to me that if someone can do that, one could just as easily release WB. But for the intellectual property hurdles, it would be a simpler project, as the playfield layout and artwork are already designed.

I'd make a new 3D model for the wizard in the game.

The one in there now looks like a pedo.

Just noticed it's the "birthday" of the main Pinball 2000 patent - 1 more year until you can make that Sorcerer's Cubes™... https://www.google.com/patents/US6036188#legal-events

It is much more than that. To many of us, P2000 is a fantastic platform that died before it could reach its full potential. WB holds the promise of approaching that potential. After all, it is a Lawlor design. Also, another option for a drop-in game for us P2000 owners is virtually a no-brainer, particularly those of us with more of a space problem than a cash problem.

the software is tied to that old platform that is tied to old PC hardware.

So it may need new OS + game software.

I'd leave my job for a one time payoff of 6 figures.

Exactly, every newer game would utilize the structure better. What we saw in EP1 and RFM was just the tip of the iceberg. the potential for what p2k could have been, is mindblowing. Hence why those of us that acknowledge p2k as the new AGE in pinball, want to see more things created for it. We can vision what could be done, and never got to see.

Yeah, for $100,000 I'll do the code AND get somebody awesome for the graphics on any P-ROC or WPC2 title you want.

I would say building the cabinet is the easiest part.

No offense but the fact the you say all of this is easy shows you really have no idea what goes into making a pinball machine. It's anything but easy.

This I agree with. Although again, you are really underestimating the scope of everything else.

Good pinball programmers should easily make six figures. On the low side but six figures.

As for luring talent with a six figure payday, I suspect the first digit has got to be a lot closer to 9 than 1.

If WMS had stayed in pinball, I have no doubt that WB would have turned the tide and it certainly is the ultimate "what if" title. As much as I would *love* to see a WB game or kit, I just don't see it ever happening, even in the $8k price range (which I would probably pay for a completed WB, but I suspect I'm in a very small minority).

If PPS makes/markets one (seemingly the only snowball that may stand a chance), I'll buy one. But I just don't see how it will ever become anything more than a footnote in pinball history.

maybe so, but it's all I would need to not have to work again.

Heh, no kidding, that's what it would take for me to up and quit my job. In fact, just forget any other numbers exist, and just use 9s.

you could live off of 100k for the rest of your life?

This was a prototype machine(s), would the tooling for the ramps and custom elements still exist? In fact, would there even be real tooling to begin with? Maybe it was just a couple quick molds to make a few casts for prototyping? Making proper tooling could be a big cost. Yes yes others have and still do it, but that doesn't change the fact that it ain't cheap to make.
Same with the playfield drawings... those may still need to tweaked/updated a bit before they're finalized for mass cutting. Those playfields could have been hand made as well (unlikely but possible). As long as you have all the inserts and parts it really takes only about 4 days for a knowledgeable worker to cut and prepare a whitewood. 2 or 3 could be done at once (Others worked on while previous one's glue and clear dry), so 3 whitewoods ready for population in ~4 days. Doesn't sound unreasonable a task for a full time worker to do.
There's a lot of stuff still hand made for prototyping even in this day in age. Again I'm not saying this is what happened 'cause I don't know, I'm just giving some possibilities as to what playfield work may be left to do and why.

image-992.jpgimage-237.jpgimage-710.jpgimage-677.jpgimage-710.jpg

I was lucky to play wizard blocks last year ...
With a great Friend (Wotto) that asked me to come to the USA to meet up with him.

I was also privileged to play a playboy proto type.

Hmmmm, not sure what you're saying here......

Chris

It would be great to go back in the future ..
back to the future.jpg

instead of this pinball being reproduced ????.. / or should i say completed

It should be left as a iconic pinball ......

it would be better if Bally / Williams would start up again and that would be great for pinball

I only beat a dead horse with another dead horse. A bat won't get the job done.

That's true of just about anyone but I doubt it's true for Lyman. He's a brand in his own right at this point and the fact he worked on a game drives sales. If Stern doesn't have him in a set of golden handcuffs at this point, they're idiots.

LOL - Stern does not own Lyman. I am sure he could do whatever he wants in his free time. If $100,000 for 3 nights a week and one day a weekend sounded good to him, he might do it. Anyone might. And what if he could do the whole thing on weekends alone? Or in 5 minutes because he is the master ?

Y'all are too easy!

The real point though is one could hire "someone" to complete code with Kickstarter money. There could be a crowd funding project for WB. Once a certain amount is pledged, THEN we decide what to do with the money. Reverse engineer, start fresh, etc. If $10,000,000 showed up would it get done? Yes. $1,000,000 ? Might not get it done. So somewhere in between. And if you don't reach your goals...what do you lose?

Ok , no, the real question is if you make a game did you make it or did someone else? I am used to the factory being the maker. Or is the Worm the maker? I can never remember. Shai-Hulud!

Like I said no Wizard Bucks no Wizard Blocks!!!!!!!

Pingeorge will make you one! He's talented

If Lyman isn't under some type of non-disclosure and non-competition agreement, that would be funny. If that were true after they took on venture capital, I'd be stunned. Then again, I'm sure in your model him uploading the code for MET to github would be cool with them as well, no? I mean, we're all friends here right?

I think if you kept reading you might get it. The point is someone could get paid to do coding for WB , Lyman , someone else, anyone. I am sure Stern could be talked into letting one of their guys moonlight on an old game like WB in their spare time. Are you not? It's not like it's a threat to them.