MD_Pinball_Dude,
I'm using Fast Pinball so 12v for switches.
I tested functionality with a fluke voltmeter set to continuity.
I put my leads from on the lower ring and the bottom of the "piston"
there was beep the instant the ball made contact with the rings.
The Fluke uses a 9v battery so 12v should work even better.
Quoted from SickNate:Got the ramps back from welding awhile ago. I went with 20 gauge and if I could do it over would do 18 or 16.
I’ll just consider these R&D and if the geometry is good , redo them then.
Everything is a lot bigger IRL than what I think it will be drawn up in CAD.
I’m kinda on the fence if I should polish all the metal parts shiny and chrome , or leave them more rugged and apocalypse[quoted image]
"we will ride shiny and CHROME all the way to the gates of Valhalla!" Was a great line in the movie when they used silver spray paint to paint their mouths. So, a silver powder coat on the ramps might tie into that nicely. Another idea might be to get a printer to print wraps for the ramps simulating the reddish dirt roads in the wasteland maybe even with some of the vehicles printed on them. If the ramps tie into a chase mode in any way that might work. I'm a sucker for chrome but this is such a great theme the options are endless.
Quoted from Pinballmike217:but this is such a great theme the options are endless.
Exactly this. I don't think you could go wrong with your choice.
For the right ramp exit, you could lose the ring end of the wire form to aim the ball down the right orbit. This will limit bouncing around and should result in a clean delivery. Look at the left and right exits for high speed, or bk2k upper to lower wire form.
Dig reading the progress and all the ideas!
CraigC,
yes I want to do a better job directing the right ramp exit at the upper flipper
I don't have a lot of height to play with because I'm going under the right ramp.
I'm afraid if I go too close balls will hit the ramp coming out of the plunger lane.
Perhaps I should re route it like in this pic
RightReturnb (resized).pngSlowly making progress.
Made the backwood and some lane guides today.
Feels good to see stuff designed in solid works IRL.
If I could do this over I’d use all off the shelf parts since it’s my first pin.
But all the custom stuff is done (Other than playfield) so I’m excited . Gonna try to CNC the playfield next weekend.
I’m sure a lot of people were rolling their eyes when I said 9 months to complete this.... And I’m right there with them now.
A custom pin is no joke. Totally worth it though..... I hope
9B104F28-6E3B-4D32-8E05-FABA3BC27571 (resized).jpegBA0D1361-73F6-4EDA-9533-5AAB824E027F (resized).jpegEBC1F57F-7FC2-4546-987B-C6E010B6FBDC (resized).jpegQuoted from SickNate:CraigC,
yes I want to do a better job directing the right ramp exit at the upper flipper
I don't have a lot of height to play with because I'm going under the right ramp.
I'm afraid if I go too close balls will hit the ramp coming out of the plunger lane.
Perhaps I should re route it like in this pic[quoted image]
Why not try a flanged 4 way intersection? Never been done that I know of. If you put a hump on the ramp section going across and made the intersection big enough, the ball could "jump" the gap, then the right ramp exit could drop straight through with gravity (no jump for that direction and drop right in front of the upper right flipper.
The only unknown is what percentage of balls would be going fast enough to make the jump successfully, but that could likely be tweaked by ramp angle. And in multiball where it gets busy at the intersection, you could have pinballs colliding on the ramp action-style in a perfectly theme appropriate way.
Vireland,
I actually love this idea. If I can’t make the geometry work and have to redo the ramp (as you can see it’s already made) I will do it this way.
With the ramp jumping the return wire it’ll go to the upper flipper regardless. And you’ll only get credit for the shot if you make the jump. I wish you said this a month ago before I made the ramp.
Quoted from SickNate:Vireland,
I actually love this idea. If I can’t make the geometry work and have to redo the ramp (as you can see it’s already made) I will do it this way.
With the ramp jumping the return wire it’ll go to the upper flipper regardless. And you’ll only get credit for the shot if you make the jump. I wish you said this a month ago before I made the ramp.
Well, I didn't know you were extending that sub return in the redesign! 
But yeah, an action-intersection with a jump one of the directions could be rad if the physics work out, and the ball collisions in multiball would be on-point for the theme. You could detect balls that were knocked off (enter switch, no exit switch) and give points for it so players could be trying to make collisions happen.
Quoted from PinMonk:Well, I didn't know you were extending that sub return in the redesign!
But yeah, an action-intersection with a jump one of the directions could be rad if the physics work out, and the ball collisions in multiball would be on-point for the theme. You could detect balls that were knocked off (enter switch, no exit switch) and give points for it so players could be trying to make collisions happen.
This is an awesome idea. Timing shots from both flippers so that they collide in a designated spot is next level. I’m sure it’d be tough, but what a rad goal for a super jackpot in multiball.
Got the lids done on 2 of the diverters.
Been trying to plan a way for a switch before the diverter for ramp confirm in my head for a little bit . Worked out nicely.
Got frustrated trying to draw stuff up in cad ... so just started bending wires around . For some stuff that is definitely the way to go.
Added some inserts on the back wood above the citadel pipes.
Just 1 diverter And playfield away from being done with the machining.
....then the real work starts
2F3C9809-F6C0-40F9-BBDC-14A6AE8B8C00 (resized).jpeg914312D5-5B41-4CDC-87BB-1E4D07BBF735 (resized).jpeg1494F4BF-DA00-4A16-B745-3E8415E01B58 (resized).jpegQuoted from SickNate:Got the lids done on 2 of the diverters.
Been trying to plan a way for a switch before the diverter for ramp confirm in my head for a little bit . Worked out nicely.
Got frustrated trying to draw stuff up in cad ... so just started bending wires around . For some stuff that is definitely the way to go.
Added some inserts on the back wood above the citadel pipes.
Just 1 diverter And playfield away from being done with the machining.
....then the real work starts[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
For that kind of a tight switch spot, why not just use an opto pair?
Quoted from PinMonk:For that kind of a tight switch spot, why not just use an opto pair?
+1 Optos are sure nice in places you don’t want hang ups or adjustment issues
Can’t wait to see this on a Playfield!
Vireland,
A bit of thought went into this. I do use an opto pair on the diverter mech to confirm a ball lock at the citadel pipes.
I changed the scoop to have a ball in the bank to send while waiting for a ball to come in the subway
(less idle time waiting for a ball you can't see moving)
I needed to add a switch before the diverter and after a point of no return.
See attached pic
I can't have an opto pair above and below in this area because directly below is a subway.
Also it's wider in this area so the ball won't get stuck.
The GT 45 degree wall makes it so the ball will roll down toward the citadel pipe even if stopped
If this wall were straight a ball that just makes the ramp would get stuck.
Side to side there ain't much room.
I realize this thing is WAY over engineered ... but I had a vision for Citadel multi ball and I stuck with it.
diverter (resized).png
Quoted from SickNate:Vireland,
A bit of thought went into this. I do use an opto pair on the diverter mech to confirm a ball lock at the citadel pipes.
I changed the scoop to have a ball in the bank to send while waiting for a ball to come in the subway
(less idle time waiting for a ball you can't see moving)
I needed to add a switch before the diverter and after a point of no return.
See attached pic
I can't have an opto pair above and below in this area because directly below is a subway.
Also it's wider in this area so the ball won't get stuck.
The GT 45 degree wall makes it so the ball will roll down toward the citadel pipe even if stopped
If this wall were straight a ball that just makes the ramp would get stuck.
Side to side there ain't much room.
I realize this thing is WAY over engineered ... but I had a vision for Citadel multi ball and I stuck with it.
[quoted image]
Your drawing made me realize that an opto spinner you can't see in one of the turnarounds would be rad to pour on the guzzoline and supercharge your car(s).
Vireland,
Let me get this right....
I post a mech I designed and made from scratch that does the following :
Directs ball from ramp to pipe behind back wood
Diverts ball to subway
Holds ball for ball lock
Confirms hold with opto pair
Confirms ramp with switch.
You reply that I should have used Optos for ramp confirm
I reply with a detailed post on why I didn’t use optos.
You reply I should use a spinner opto.
Quoted from SickNate:Vireland,
Let me get this right....
I post a mech I designed and made from scratch that does the following :
Directs ball from ramp to pipe behind back wood
Diverts ball to subway
Holds ball for ball lock
Confirms hold with opto pair
Confirms ramp with switch.
You reply that I should have used Optos for ramp confirm
I reply with a detailed post on why I didn’t use optos.
You reply I should use a spinner opto.
Well, you advertised yourself as "Sick" Nate...sickness is unrelenting.
Quoted from SickNate:I post a mech I designed and made from scratch that does the following :
Directs ball from ramp to pipe behind back wood
Diverts ball to subway
Holds ball for ball lock
Confirms hold with opto pair
Confirms ramp with switch.
fantastic work! Luv it!
Quoted from SickNate:MD_Pinball_Dude,
I'm using Fast Pinball so 12v for switches.
I tested functionality with a fluke voltmeter set to continuity.
I put my leads from on the lower ring and the bottom of the "piston"
there was beep the instant the ball made contact with the rings.
The Fluke uses a 9v battery so 12v should work even better.
OK. I was just thinking way out into the future where you have had 1000s of plays on this machine and tens of thousands of pops. Where the ball touches the post and the base, there will be a very, very small voltage arc and over a very, very long time there might be a carbon (?) ring forming on these locations. You might want to add a diode across the two or a current limiting resistor if you find some weird things going on during testing.
Honestly, the pop setup looks damn near bullet-proof.
Def polish ramps and lane guides.
Chrome plating looks crap after a while with ball trails, doesn't happen when polished imo.
I've had both now only polish.
I’m used to inputs and outputs for PLCs.
In the pinball world it’s switches and coils.
Maybe this is too in the weeds to post
But I’ll do it anyways. Here is where we stand with I/O now, hopefully it doesn’t have to change much
MMFR I/O
Fast Pinball I/O Borads
board 0 32-08 (1st board in loop)
board 1 16-16 (2nd board in loop)
board 2 32-08 (3rd board in loop)
board 3 08-04 (4th board in loop)
Lower playfield
32-08 (1st I/O board after fast controller #0)
(32 inputs 8 outputs)
inputs/switches
0-0 Left flipper button
0-1 Right flipper button
0-2 upper flipper button
0-3 Nate Lower scoop opto1(eject position)
0-4 Nate Lower scoop opto2(stored position)
0-5 Target between Nux and lower Scoop "Mothers Milk"
0-6 Barry opto (top)
0-7 Larry opto (bottom)
0-8 Nux target top
0-9 Nux target middle
0-10 Nux target bottom
0-11 NUX motor up switch
0-12 NUX motor down switch
0-13 Left outlane rollover "R"
0-14 Left inlane rollover "O"
0-15 small target between mid ramp and LL pop "Guzzoline"
0-16 opto trough jam
0-17 opto trough 1
0-18 trough 2 rollover
0-19 trough 3 rollover
0-20 trough 4 rollover
0-21 trough 5 rollover
0-22 trough 6 rollover
0-23 trough 7 rollover
0-24 trough 8 rollover
0-25 plunger lane rollover
0-26 Right inlane rollover "A"
0-27 Right outlane rollover "D"
0-27 Hidden rollover behind upper flipper
0-28 small target L of right ramp "Bullets"
0-29 small target R of right ramp "Aqua Cola"
0-30
0-31
Outputs/Coils
0-0 Left flipper coil
0-1 Right flipper coil
0-2 Upper flipper coil
0-3 trough eject coil
0-4 auto plunger coil
0-5 lower scoop eject coil
0-6 Lower scoop hold ball coil
0-7 Nux target motor
Mid to upper playfield
16-16 (2nd I/O board after fast controller #1)
(16 inputs 16 outputs)
inputs/switches
1-0 UR pop bumper switch
1-1 UL pop bumper switch
1-2 Mid pop bumper switch
1-3 LL pop bumper switch
1-4 LR pop bumper switch
1-5 Left slingshot
1-6 right slingshot
1-7 upper r slingshot
1-8 Target behind Magnet
1-9 Opto for magnet ball present
1-10 opto1 eject position upper scoop
1-11 Opto2 hold position upper scoop
1-12 Spinner Left
1-13 Spinner Right
1-14 Left upper scoop target (LOCK)
1-15 right upper scoop target (LOAD)
Outputs/Coils
1-0 UR pop bumper coil
1-1 UL pop bumper coil
1-2 Mid pop bumper coil
1-3 LL pop bumper coil
1-4 LR pop bumper coil
1-5 Left Slingshot
1-6 Right Slingshot
1-7 Upper R Slingshot
1-8 Magnet
1-9 Dissapearing plunger for NUX multi
1-10 Justin upper scoop eject ball
1-11 Justin upper scoop hold ball
1-12 Flasher 12v LEDs (pops and citadel pipes)
1-13 Flasher 12v LEDs (Squares under spinners)
1-14 Left Orbit ball gate
1-15 Right Orbit Ball gate
Upper playfield/backboard
32-08 (3rd I/O board after fast controller #2)
(32 inputs 8 outputs)
inputs/switches
2-0 opto Left citadel pipe ball lock(mid ramp)
2-1 switch mid ramp made
2-2 opto mid citadel pipe ball lock(Left/UF)
2-3 switch left ramp made (UF/mid citadel pipe)
2-4 opto right citadel pipe ball lock(right ramp)
2-5 switch right ramp made (r citadel pipe)
2-6 (reserved citadel ramp spinner)
2-7
2-8 Left orbit rollover
2-9 Newton ball rollover
2-10 Blood Bag trapped opto
2-11 upper lane "F"
2-12 upper lane "U"
2-13 upper lane "R"
2-14 upper lane "Y"
2-15 Right orbit rollover
2-16 Start key
2-17 co op/vs
2-18 orbit / ramp
2-19 pop /slingshot
2-20 spinners / targets
2-21 coin door open
2-22 (reserved)
2-23 (reserved)
2-24 (reserved)
2-25 (reserved)
2-26 (reserved)
2-27 (reserved)
2-28 (reserved)
2-29 (reserved)
2-30 (reserved)
2-31 (reserved)
Outputs/coils
2-0 left citadel pipe/mid ramp appearing plunger coil
2-1 Mid ramp diverter coil
2-2 mid citadel pipe/L ramp appearing plunger coil
2-3 L ramp diverter
2-4 right citadel pipe/right ramp appearing plunger coil
2-5 R ramp diverter coil
2-6 appearing plunger to block orbit for fuel pod lock
2-7 Black light 12v LEDs
Cabinet
08-04 (4th I/O board after fast controller #3)
(8 inputs 4 outputs)
inputs/switches
3-0 coin 1 mech
3-1 coin 2 mech
3-2 add credit button
3-3 service mode button
3-4 volume up button
3-5 volume down
3-7 tilt
3-7 slam tilt
outputs/coils
3-0 shaker motor
3-1 (reserved)
3-2 air horn 12v
3-3 BackGlass LEDs 12v
Looking good! Are you planning on using single wound flipper coils though and pwm them to keep them from overheating when holding? I’d advise using dual wound wms style coils.. two drivers per flipper coil. No buzzing, more reliable imo
Mbecker,
Yes single Wound coils and pwm for hold.
I’m playing around with the idea of turning hold off for multiball or
Limiting it to 2 or 3 seconds. We’ll see if that is a fun kill or not
If we need to go to dual and use eos we’ll have to add another board as there aren’t many spare coils/outputs
You can tell by the list there are three
Flipper buttons. Not having 2 flippers tied to one switch may help.
Quoted from SickNate:Mbecker,
Yes single Wound coils and pwm for hold.
I’m playing around with the idea of turning hold off for multiball or
Limiting it to 2 or 3 seconds. We’ll see if that is a fun kill or not
If we need to go to dual and use eos we’ll have to add another board as there aren’t many spare coils/outputs
You can tell by the list there are three
Flipper buttons. Not having 2 flippers tied to one switch may help.
Could be fun on a mode or multiball. Lexy lightspeed does it on a mode and it’s pretty fun for a quick 30+ seconds. Hopefully no problems with pwming them but if you have to add 3 coil outputs an 0804 is pretty cheap anyway.
And you are in oceanside! I want to play this. You're more than welcome to come to my house as well. I plan on hosting a tournament soon now that I finally clear coated all my playfields. It took me three months to strip all my games and shoot the clear and I'm neurotic about finishing games. I can't imagine the length of time for what you are doing. Nine months is pretty fast IMO.
Djshakes,
Yes I’m in Oceanside. Would love to come in last at your tourney. You’re definitely invited as soon as this sucker is flipping.
As far as 9 months goes... I thought it was a realistic goal when I set it. Still think it could’ve happened ... would do things differently for a first pin if I could do it over. Or maybe I wouldn’t .
So far this has been a blast and I would highly recommend doing a homebrew pin to anyone.
It is really looking great!
Have you thought about anodizing the aluminum to prevent it from breaking down and possibly getting everything dirty? You can get stuff anodized in some really cool colors. !
Alright, last diverter cover made
Optos and switches in.
I’m officially as far as I can get without cutting the damn playfield.
(Yeah yeah I know... I can do art and game code programming)
I have the playfield programmed too.
I might have to join a maker space for 1 day to get this done.
00D39CB0-21AB-45AF-A214-A7861E3B0501 (resized).jpeg228C105A-A213-4AB4-B94C-9D2BA791527C (resized).jpegMaker Spaces are awesome. I joined one here in the Atlanta area last year to get access to their CNC for a virtual pinball and MAME cabinet projects. It takes some practice to get used to using a CNC, but it sounds like with your metal cutting experience this should be a piece of cake.
A couple of pieces of CNC advice:
- Buy your own bits and don’t use the ones at the Maker Space. For 3/4” plywood I used a Whiteside 1/4” compression bit
- Measure the thickness of your ply carefully and use that in both your modeling and machining software.
- Simulate your cuts in your machining software and inspect the results very carefully for errors. I had to do multiple recuts due to skipping this step.
- Use manually placed tabs and make sure you put them on any larger pieces you are cutting out. Putting them on small round cutouts (under 2” diameter) is difficult to remove and doesn’t really buy you anything.
I used Fusion 360 for my modeling and tool path generation, which output to a format compatible with the CNC Mach3 software.
You will need at least a 24” x 48” CNC bed for a playfield.
My Maker Space is only $30 a month and gets me access to a full wood shop, 3D printers, glowforge, welding equipment, electronics lab and tons of other cool stuff. Unfortunately it is a 45 minute drive from my house, so I only use it for larger projects.
Please reach out if I can help answer any questions. Can’t wait to see your finished project!
Tiny black dog,
Thanks for the tips. I’m learning wood definitely cuts different than metal. I’ve done tons of plastic machining and was expecting wood to be similar. It’s not.
I’ve learned to open stuff up tolerance and size wise. The shit moves and then stuff doesn’t fit. Gotta make pockets and holes bigger than I’m used to.
Feeling bummed, machined the playfield on a neighbors cnc router. Not very accurate or consistent. Depths of insert pockets are all over the place. Sizes of pocket suck too. There’s a wood shop in town that has a nice rigid cnc router that’ll let me run my program. I knew I should’ve done it that way to begin with.
It looks rad though.... I’ll hang it up my garage.
1A1011F9-D12C-4FC9-B2D2-526C24415CAB (resized).jpegF21139BB-4041-4675-A2DF-255A32EA72D2 (resized).jpegMake sure your bit radius is smaller than the corner radius of the inserts. You may want to start with a small test piece of wood with one of each of your insert sizes on it, and cut that first for test fitment. I haven’t done a playfield before but I can imagine there is little room for error on those.
You should also be really careful about measurements for all those holes you are drilling. I have had situations where either my measurements were slightly off, or the part I was installing was out of tolerance, and I wished I had just manually drilled the holes when I had the parts aligned for fitment. This mainly applies to parts that have multiple mounting holes.
For the shooter lane are you just trying to get the larger pieces of wood out and then you will finish it by hand? I think you can make the transition smoother by using a smaller diameter bit with a smaller stepover and stepdown. It will take longer to cut but I think look much better and minimize the manual sanding.
Must be exciting finally seeing the results of all your hard work! Good luck with your next cut!
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Oceanside, CA
Melbourne
