I certainly overpaid for both my Elektra machines but one was in HUO condition. I'm not sure if I overpaid for my WPT, given the condition when I bought it. I'm probably not going to be able to sell it for what I have in the game but I don't care because it's a blast.

Read my post carefully....

I never said it should be the sum total. But if I have $500.00 of mods in a machine, and a buyer tells me he won't pay anything extra for the mods because he doesn't care or feels they aren't worth it, he can find another machine, or I will take the mods out and sell them on the marketplace. In no scenario am I going to just toss them in as a bonus.

Maybe not to you. The word "crazy" above indicates you don't think much of mods, so you don't want to pay for them. Fair enough. However, let's say someone else, who was planning to do all the mods anyway will see the value. Maybe they don't want to pay the full $600.00, but are willing to pay $400.00. For them, that is a relative bargain as they save $200.00 on purchasing the mods, plus the install time, shipping waits, etc. Its all relative.

Bottom line, a seller can try to sell for whatever they want to, for whatever reason they have. Its only crazy if it doesn't work.

It may not make sense to YOU, but there are a lot of people who would disagree with your thinking. It simply depends on what type of collector you are. There are tons of people in this hobby who are happy to pay a premium for a game with a bunch of cool mods. You may not be one of these people, but that doesn't change the fact that they are out there. Heck, I've seen plenty of games with $500 in mods sell for $1,000 over market price. This is not something that happens once in a blue moon. It's extremely common.

I significantly overpaid for my first pin. Where I've been caught out at least three times since is in buying pins at or just below market price but then finding within a few weeks or months that they needed replacement parts to function optimally (or, in the case of new plastics, to look their best). Those expenses add up fast, and before you know it, you have more in the machine than you could hope to get back out, at least in the short run. I haven't had to sell, so I can't say that it is has been a problem, but I am probably "under water" on about half of my pins right now. Of course, I am not in this to make money, but since the question was asked...

I might have overpaid for one or two games but not by much, maybe one or two hundred dollars. I justify it because they were local and I did not have to drive a long distance or pay for shipping. Works for me.

my reading comprehension is fine. you are the one weirdly making this a binary issue. you keep referencing buyers unwilling to pay anything at all extra for mods. you are the one proposing the straw man argument that mods add exactly zero to the price of a pin. i'm not sure who you're arguing against, since nobody made that assertion.

Yes it is at the discretion of each peoples to pay or not. I disagree that there is a tons of peoples willing to pay the markup though. Maybe it dépends of location and supply but I noticed it takes mutch more time to sell blinged out premium priced pins over the stock ones in my area. Sellers almost always drop the price or takes the mods off to move the pin.

I'm pretty happy for what I paid for my pins:

HUO TSPP : $3800
JP: $2100
Shadow : $2700

Wow kwik...from zero to hero in less than a year

Don't buy the "Hot" pins, so the Market is forced to cool off.It is the people who OVERPAY that are setting the New Higher price points and ruining it for everyone else.What pin prices are going down ?

Funny enough, it took me 13 months to get to where my current collection is now, from Dec. 2011 to Jan. 2013.

I paid $2300 for my Nascar. Probably about $300 more than I should have. Its in good shape and very fun to play and is probably saving me tons on playing pins in the wild

I consider the whole picture when buying....did the game I sold to get this overpaid machine cost me money or did I make money off of it? My goal is to at least break even when I sell, so anything over is a bonus. So buying something for a bit more than the average is no problem, especially if its a convenience thing (like being local, or fully working, etc)

Someone several posts up mentioned the higher availability in the upper midwest (US). Not the same here in the southeast. Things do come up, and I am relatively (extremely) new to this and while space is a concern, $$$ will be the biggest concern. Most ebay listings are plain ridiculous. Craigslist offerings on anything desirable don't seem to pop up around here much.

It really comes down partly to where you are. When you get that sweetheart deal, it's great. I overpaid on my first, largely because it was my first, I was frustrated over a PinBot sale falling through when I thought I had a few hours to decide and acted a bit too emotionally.

I worked to get the machine I bought to 100% function, which took more work, time and parts ($$$) than I expected. I sold at a loss, and that wasn't including labor. I got the BC for an okay price, but it has its own issues, number one being a crappy poor attempt at a translite since the backglass isn't there. The spinning wheel doesn't work properly and the ramps barely stay down because of damage. My wife loves it though and I'll spend to restore it as best as possible, potentially including a new CPR playfield and plastics when they are made. I have a local friend who suggested we might be able to screen the cabinet art in multiple sections as the decals are faded, torn, and unavailable. I'll put way more into it than market value will probably ever be. For that machine it will be worth it as it is a keeper, my wife, kids, and myself, and everyone who comes over, loves it.

My RG I have already put several $$$ and horus into, but probably paid a decent price. It's a diamondplate with the standard wall ramp damage (putting a cliffy on this weekend). I've done lots of boardwork and connectors on it and have been working on several other issues. I'll have it 100% soon so if I sell it at market value I'll probably break even not counting labor. I'll get it much much better than when I found it and it is fun. It was available and that is perhaps most important. Now I need a Bride of Pinbot to come available hasta pronto!

My original comment was based on below:

Given allowances for mistaking intent due to spelling and grammar, I read this as disbelief that mods could add any value to the machine, which is what I was responding to, with a question posing an example to see if that was what he meant. Not creating a straw man, nor making it a binary issue, I actually agree with you, for most buyers the reality is going to be somewhere in the middle, depending on whether they like the mods, availability of the machine, etc.

Definitely. Was told I would never find a DMD under $2k. When I was offered one for $1,500 I jumped at the chance.

Game plays well enough ( no major defects )...but the last guy tried to restore a portion of the playfield, and did a horrible job. The more I looked into the game, the more problems I keep finding. I'll fix them, but I likely won't get the time and money invested back.

It was my first pin...so I guess it's a life lesson cost. /shrug

It doesn't necessarily have to be the hot pins either. Black Knight - a very nice one indeed - just went up on my local CL asking $6900. I think this is quite high for this title.

I looked it up on Boston Pinballs records of Ebay sales and somebody did buy one for $6K. However the average price is $1200. In my mind, double the average is probably what should be the high end minty max price. But you have people with apparently more cash than they know what to do with fighting for certain machines. Crazy world.

Considering you could probably get a HEP restored one for less, yeah, I'd say that's a tad high.

Bah! That's a great newbie lesson if you ask me. A $1500 DMD game? At the worst you will break even or damn close to it. -The trade off for your labor is experience and getting to play it.

You my newbie friend, have won a free DMD Glare Guard. Assuming you are in the USA...
Privately send me your shipping information and I will get one out to you pronto.

Kim
http://www.wrongcrowdproductions.com/

That's a really nice gesture, Kim!

I certainly haven't gotten any steals but I don't feel like I've overpaid on anything either.

Paid high side of market for STTNG and JM......but for those two it was well worth it.

Should I be a dick and tell you what I paid for those games a few years ago?

no.

Lol at you for blaming your lack of reading comprehention on my grammar. English may not be my first language but you missed my point completly, I never said mods had zero value, just go back to my previous post and reread.

Back on topic, I never overpaid on value but if you add gas and food I shure did for one.

Here is a quote of the said post on previous page:

''Peoples here put 400$ of mods in their trons and expect a FULL cash back. That is a joke. Same with leds. If a pins have 600$ bucks of mods leds, shaker and other crazy crap I might pay a little more 100-200$ over market price but never full retail value''

the key word in my post is FULL.

To answer the OP no I never did unless you count gas and food then yes once.

very true::

Nah. They are taking longer to sell because now everyone is jumping on the bandwagon and trying to get top dollar for junk machines. If I get 4k for a mint BSD that doesn't make a beater BSD is worth 4k. So when that beater goes up for sale it sits... And eventually that person will lower their price. It's just people trying to capitalize on the increases.

personally i dont care for mods or leds. some led are ok i guess, most are not thow. most are done incorrectly and you need a welding mask to play the machine because people put way way too bright of led in pins..
some mods make the game not play correct, like the POTC cannons that sit atop the in-lanes. balls get trapped their quite often on a few machines ive played with that mod.

you know when i see cars go through the dealer auctions, just because it has a supreme stereo or nice rims and tires, doesnt mean it sells for more than the same condition stock car. in fact, they usually sell for less because they appeal to a certain group only. a STOCK pinball machine appeals to everyone as the buyer can add mods if they want. some mods, if removed leave drilled holes, sticky surfaces, defaced plastics and defaced machine tops, hacked wiring, etc.

I overpaid on my very first pin DH in poor condition 7 years ago -£500 so around $750.

But after getting into the hobby and meeting some decent guys on the UK pinball forum I picked up

IJ-£1200- actually this was a bit of a dog but now beautiful
TZ -£1200
CFTBL-£1200 - green hologram and near NIB
MM-£3500
AFM-£3000
LOTR-£2800
CC - £5200 - from Denmark
BBB- £10,000
TAFG-£3800-from Germany
DH-£1200- much better than my first one from Germany
CFTBL -£1500

For $ add half again. So bargains for me especially MM, AFM!

I feel sorry for people in a hobby (one that's supposed to be about fun) that get overly caught up in how much their pins are worth, or whether they got a good deal. Thinking like that just ruins the enjoyment for me. If you think you got a "bad" deal, play the hell out of the pin and remember that you'd be paying 50 cents a play in the wild. It adds up. Learn to fix the problems and appreciate the value of the knowledge and be proud that you've made the pin better than when you bought it. If you have to sell it, don't worry about what you paid for it, just send it to a good home for a fair price. Learn from your mistakes and move forward. Leave the heartache of making a profit to the guys who are only in it for the money. I'd much rather be the guy playing for fun than the poor sap who loses sleep over losing a little money on a HOBBY.

Well said, Jam_Burglar.

You know what happens when I go on vacation? Or to a movie? Or buy a car? I plan to lose money. That's right, I leave the house with the express purpose of coming home with a smaller net worth. Crazy, huh? It gets crazier: when I got into pinball over a decade ago, I planned to lose money, just to play some silly game.

*Real* (or maybe a better word for it is *substancial*) mods like the ramp lights and the arcade mod on Tron will probably get you your money back when you sell the game as these mods are highly regarded and many people in the market for a Tron would be putting these mods on the game after they bought it anyway. So *free installation* is maybe the only loss by the seller.

Then there are mods like TZ's "quarter on edge" that virtually no one is going to assign any value to if it's in a game that is for sale.

That leaves a lot of mods somewhere in the middle ground; shaker motor, LEDs, armor kits, etc. To some buyers they add value, to others they are a turnoff. All you have to do is wait for a buyer who sees them as a plus and you should get most of your investment back.

Terry.

My first official *thumbs up* to a Pinside post!
Terry.

Don't worry, prices will go up and up forever and the party will never end

I really could care less, my pins are never leaving unless I decide to upgrade my SM condition or get a black....

I'd like to talk about the price of skyrockets these days. Good fireworks are getting
darn expensive.

I will...Shadow with barely any sanctum wear $1900, TSPP $3500 NIB, very nice JP I just got late last year...$1900. I suspect Rare's prices were even lower.

This is true of anybody who has been in the hobby for a while. The prices over the last few years have risen at an insane rate.

I am currently paying more then it will be worth for an over the top Whirlwind restoration. It's my choice and my game. No harm no foul. If I had to sell it, I would probably loose money. It will be awesome while I have it.

You do realize you made two separate posts right? First:

This is the one I responded to, and re-reading it, still believe I responded to it fairly.

The second post clarifies your position, but I posted before that one, I don't have the ability to see into the future.

Not trying to attack or blame anyone for anything here. Just trying to have a meaningful discussion, which can be an uphill battle on the interwebz. The good news is, it seems like we actually agree on the mod value thing now that we are on the same page.

I hope yours is done soon . . . I think I'm right behind you on the restore list though I don't think my game has been sourced yet. I'm hoping these slow days of summer will star jarring lose a couple machines from down here so one on my list can be nabbed and restored.

It's way to late to try and make yourself look like a dick. It happend when you clicked on the "Send post>>" button.