aurich, to better understand the significance of the letter 'H', people could pronounce your name if it was spelled without one.

Hey, let’s stop dumping on Aurich! One of the few that is qualified and expresses a (well thought out) opinion around here and can and has backs it.
I look forward reading more.
Not changed my mind on a Wonka pin game play wise, but I am interested to see if Jersey takes note.

I have a couple dialed in limited in stock. Nib, demo and used (my personal game). Why dont you buy one of them now, then when Wonka comes out you can find one to play, fall in love... and then buy that one from me too!

Haha it's all good, thanks, but I'm fine. Not gonna talk about something I've never listened to, there's nothing to discuss. It's like the good old days of 2016, everyone on Game of Thrones is still alive and a podcaster is riding my shaft non stop.

It's just forum posts, if you're getting overly worked up over it then I dunno, reevaluate your life, or your hobbies or get a dog or something.

BWAHAHAHAHA GOLD!

You have to take anything that Lawlor of Jersey Jack say with a pound of salt - these guys have one job right now: sell the game. How many times have we heard a designer say this is their best work?

The evaluation of greatness should be left to the players, not the folks peddling the machines to make a living.

Can you imagine a company rolling out a million dollar investment with "I've done better". lol.

Are Jersey Jake Shaker motors available through any outlet? If buying an SE how can you upgrade to this and what is the usual cost? I cannot find any on common pinball websites.

Check with the Sorny and Magnetbox retailers.

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Yea, I don't usually listen to his stuff, so I don't know all of the history, but I will admit I listened to his one to hear what you were referencing.

So basically he is insecure idiot...always has been, always will be. He can't take the criticism how he over-hyped the reveal, so his only defense is to lash out and call anyone that doesn't agree with him a "bedwetter'. What a grade school playground comment to make, but then again I guess no one ever accused him of being an overly mature individual. He basically says you can't have an opinion on a game unless you flip it, so if that is the case, his podcasts should be really short from now on, assuming he doesn't hold to a double standard.

People can have opinions on anything, and they can post those opinions on an open forum. They don't have to own the game, they don't have to flip the game, and they can even have opinions on opinions if they want to. Aurich had an opinion on artwork because that is what he does. I respect that opinion, and to lash out because he criticized the artwork of a game, which 'Special K' himself has done on numerous occasions, is a bit hypocritical. Here is an opinion....those TWIPPY awards you are so proud of.....my opinion is you didn't win those for your great podcasting. My opinion is you won those because people like to look at train wrecks. They wanted to see how much of an ass you were going to make of yourself after winning, and they were not disappointed. It was no accident they saved that presentation for next to last...it was done that way on purpose. Can you not see that?

Face it...you got your ego stroked by JJ when you got invited to play a game a week ahead of the reveal, like it was some great honor. You were used.....you got caught up in the hype, and because you want to be invited to do this again, you posted how this was going to be the game to change pinball as we know it. It is a nice game, and I am sure it shoots well, but nothing there is a new innovation. You lied, and because people called you on it, your only solution is to lash out. Grow up...it's just pinball.

K's a tool maybe he can fix the H

Finally, someone sees that it is a disaster theme! Code has made the theme solid. The title is the only issue. If Jack didn't reject the original title "killer app," the theme would have made more sense on reveal.

I listened to his podcast, I didn’t take it this way. He was pissed off/frustrated about all the nit picking, particularly by those who haven’t seen the game in person or played it. I don’t always agree with him, but I do on this. Pages and pages of going back and forth on minute details of a game most people have not seen or played. He spent time with the game in a quiet environment and loved it. The special when lit guys did too and also loved it.

I’ll reserve my own judgment on the game until I play it, but from what I’ve seen, it looks like a cool game. Does it have everything I would want, no, but I am willing to bet JJP will do everything in their power to make a great game. I have a deposit down on an LE.

Harry pooper has come and gone. Old news. Gnr was done, like Pirates, by Stern. Toy story is still going, so it should be okay.

In my opinion, jjps primary problem is choosing good licenses. Hopefully Pirates has them rethinking things. I personally think they would have sold double with an unlicensed pirate theme instead of a worn out series. Once I heard about Depp's face and lack of assets, I was out, no matter how good the design was.

Can't find what you typed on your thought of the game Mate

Frustration, maybe...but who made him the 'nit picking police'? He picks and picks on other themes, and picks and picks at Pinside and other folks based only on observation, but it is not OK for anyone else to do? He is entitled to his opinion just like everyone else, but he doesn't own part of JJP, so why is the picking his concern? Why is he all of a sudden the person that is going to put a stop to something that has been going on for a long time, and something he himself is a master at?. The reason as I said is very simple...he got caught in a white lie, and he has to deflect the blame somehow. It is kindergarten 101....the quickest way to get the focus off yourself is to create controversy about someone else.

You cannot listen to that podcast and come away saying there was any redeeming value of any sort. Just some guy looking for attention.

And getting it, it seems.....

Yep, you are correct.....I thought about that part too.........lol

Wow! What a mess this thread is. Special When Lit guys, Zach, and even Kaneda were right, there sure is a lot of nit-picking and silly immature statements being made about a game 90% of you haven't played. Need to check out the Black Knight forum and see if you guys are ripping that one apart. I grew up watching this film and got to see, hear, and play the game at MGC. It is beautiful, shoots like butter, sounds great, and represents the film well. Is it the second-coming of pinball? No. It's just a great game with all modern stuff thrown in. Will it change the pinball landscape? Yes. JJP now has a game at a price point to directly compete with Stern Premium, AP, and CGC. So now when a buyer looks at price, they will be comparing directly to JJP, not having to consider paying more for JJP. That point has potential to change things. You guys are arguing about the middle part of the letter "H"? Grow up.

I hope it is everything you say....as I have said multiple times, I hope this is a huge hit for JJP, they need it, and although this one isn't for me, I AM looking forward to the next couple on deck. At this point the ball is in JJP's court. They need to get quality games shipped to do as you say and compete with Stern Premium. Their history hasn't been so stellar in that regard, but we are rooting for them this time.

DI is perfect exactly how it is. It doesnt need anything. I see the name fitting for the game. Its a balls to the walls shooter game. Stacked modes can get nuts and if you’re running good on this game you are indeed “dialed in”. In my opinion this is an excellent players game.

Great to hear someone else who played the game and liked it. I think the graphic treatment Aurich pointed out speaks to the effort and expertise put into that department, and allows manufacturers the opportunity to either fix it or request better assets for their next releases.

Personally I'm trying to decide between Wonka (not having played it) and POTC, which I have many times and really enjoy.

Pirates is faster and feels more packed. Shots are more unique as well. You really get the feel or Eric as an original designer. Wonka shoots smoother. It feels like Dialed In. You also have a situation where you are hitting shots to set up another shot from one of the other flippers. I'm not really into that style of gameplay, so my personal vote is POTC. However, DI has grown on me and I think Wonka will, too. I don't think you can go wrong with either.

Just a reminder that there's a JJP WONKA 'Tutorial & Gameplay' stream today at 3pm (central).

twitch.tv/jjplive

Maybe we'll get a few questions answered?

Arguing? No, we were talking about the assets the JJP was given by the license holder. Maybe you should read the thread before casting stones.

The art stuff can get a little nutty around here.

Your average person - and by that I mean 99.8 percent - ain’t gonna find the H upsetting or notice that a gradient fill on GOT violated some unspoken rules of art design.

In a way it must be a curse to have such a refined artistic eye!

Now Lotr LE golden penis is something you can’t ignore!

That post is really living rent free in some people's heads.

Just enjoy your games people. Nothing I've ever loved has been diminished by reading that someone else didn't like it. You want to talk about growing up, work on not letting the approval of strangers affect your enjoyment of things.

Ignorance is definitely bliss.

As a listener of his show I can explain it from my perspective. I don’t care whether the pinball podcaster I listen to is hypocritical or full of double standards. Those words are used as if it’s obvious that anyone guilty of them should not be listened to. I listen because:
- his opinion is genuinely and authentically given, meaning he never holds back even if his opinion does change from episode to episode
- he is entertaining giving his opinions
- he keeps his focus tightly on the hobby and rarely strays to other things
- he’s politically incorrect in a world sometimes stifled by political incorrectness
- I don’t have to agree with opinions to enjoy opinions

Meanwhile I also listen to other podcasters that do it entirely differently. It’s nice to have variety and different opinions.

Can't wait to play Wonka at Allentown! The game looks fantastic to me and the shots look so damn smooth.

Long overdue time on the range tomorrow...hoping to enjoy some smooth shots myself.......lol But with that said, I do agree the layout looks good.

Meanwhile I’m super excited for Wonka and am likely to buy one. My one concern is not the critique of potential slot machine feel, the (current) lack of assets, or supposed over hype, but the music in the game. On the stream I found it grating but am hopeful that it’s different when you play it.

Thanks to this thread I listened to another K podcast. I don't get it, this guy is entertaining 80% of the time but then the other 20% of the time he goes off on these creepy and juvenile personal attacks that leave me wanting to take a shower and compelled to delete the podcast off my phone. I just have a hard time listening when someone is calling other people bed wetters and casting aspersions on the cars he imagines them driving, among other 7th grade level insults (apologies to most 7th graders). This is all when I completely agree with the point he's trying to get across too and am annoyed by the people he's insulting too.

Eh, but to each his own -- a lot of pinsiders are apparently entertained by this so I guess he should keep doing what he's doing (he's right, why change what works -- lifetime Twippy award coming up). It's just that on some weird deep level it really surprises me that this doesn't turn off more people and it certainly doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy about the hobby, but it is what it is. I'm in the minority here and I'm sure this post is annoying to most-- so this will be my last post on this topic, I promise. Anyway,I probably should just start playing more pinball and stop hanging out in the forums so much (or at least stop posting useless rants).

That should improve with coding. I am hoping they also add sound to go with some of the video clips.

Wait, are we supposed to be listing our cars in our collections too? I missed Robin's update on that apparently. I'm not sure I'm insecure about my manhood enough to do that.

I hear there's Honda dissing, but I'll tell you what, most impressive pinball/car thing I've ever seen is someone fitting a Twilight Zone perfectly into the back of a Honda Fit. That's gotta be the most stealth pin hauler in existence, it was like a magic trick.

In fact, if someone said to me "I bought a cheap car so I could afford more pinball!" I'd shake their hand.

I find it funny there is this much “drama” in pinball at all. Back in the dark times, in the long long ago, before Pinside, RGP, or any place to gather virtually and talk pinball, the only time you got to talk and discuss pinball like we do on here was at Expo, auctions, once in a while a tournament, of if you caught your operator collecting from the coin box, or you were talking with your distributor.

I guess even pinball ended up with internet “influencers” and cliques and industry “insiders” that for some reason keep people coming back to Pinside for the latest gossip and dirt on. I remember everyone just reading Play Meter and asking each other what machine was killing it on earnings. Now we have to have a Gala Night at the Metropolitan Museam of Fine Art everytime a pinball machine is revealed? What happened to walking into your distributor’s workshop for a box of lamps and some rubber rings and seeing the latest title sitting on the shop floor and a tech under the playfield doing techy things? And let me just nip those thoughts about saying anything about LEDs and Silicone rings...

What happened is money, marketing, and competition........Oh, and rich people with nothing better to do....lol.

Real nice job with the stream by the JJP guys. It was so much easier to hear the callouts vs the reveal last week. There's a lot more in there than what I could hear last week. They played 2 full games and talked through the gameplay as they played. Very good players so they hit most of what's in the pin and many more video clips vs what we got to see last week. Probably saw Wonkavator 3-4 times.

A few notes from the twitch stream from JJP chat answers and what was said during game play:

- Could not get full approval for 'Brat' so it was approved as 'Kid'

- Every memorable scene you remember from the movie will be represented

- There will be a ton of movie call outs - have faith

- When will we be able to see the actual CE play field? - soon

- The game will ship with complete rules, but choreo and polish and tweaking and balance can change

- How do the 6 playfield magnets get activated? - During multiballs and maybe other modes

- Build order - SE, LE then CE, then remaining SE then LE

- Candy Man song can not be used - Owned by M&M Mars and they wouldn't permit it

- We have the license to the music of the oompa songs - it will be there

- Are we going to get the Wilder "Jackpot!" callout in the game, instead of the voice actor? since he already said it in the movie and all? - do you really think a group of pinball programmers wouldn't use the one pinball line from the movie? i'm telling you all right now if you can think of a memorable line i'm guessing there is a 99% chance it wil be in the game

- The game is not finished from a choreo perspective

- What's the most dangerous shot ? - the right ramp standup is brutal. Avoid at all costs

- CE powder coating will be red and it will be clear coated (3 step process)

- Computer modes (there are 4 of them) all share the same time like TSPP

- For people who like to customize there game, I allow you to change the color of the score digits. I think i have 6 or 7 colors

- Are remaining tilt warnings displayed somewhere? they will be in the UI, we are working on that. it will probably be a sign that says something, not so much a count

- Does the wonkavator virtual ball lock on the standard edition work the same as the physical lock on other models. As in does it carry over to other games/players? It does not carry over from player to player. It's virtual... each player would have to complete it in 1 game.

Thanks for the update, I forgot all about the stream, those are good things to know.

I missed this if it was answered already, is lock stealing the only way to play with the 'nicer' versions, or is it optional? Because I love lock stealing, but not sure I love it on a complicated game. It's great on games like EATPM and TNA, where the play is real basic and the multiballs are basic, and starting a multiball or risking leaving it for the next player is part of the charm.

I imagine competitive play will be on the SE anyways, just in terms of games being available in public spots and the prices.

I 'think' it was said last week that you could turn the 'stealing' off on LE/CE. I'm not 100% sure though.

One other thing... Several chat questions were asked about the CE topper, but none were answered. I think it would be cool to have a WH2O type topper with a flowing chocolate river. If JJP doesn't do it, I think that would be a big selling mod if someone could figure out how to do it. I'd be in for one!

During the stream they did call out that the topper was going through final approval. It will have light integration with the game play.

Watched a good bit of that stream...game is really growing on me...Other than not seeing much magnet action, this could definitely be an add for me (CE)...Well done, JJP!!

you can watch the stream replay here:

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/413508090

I liked the game after the reveal last week. Liking it even more after seeing the JJP guys play and talk through it as they played today. I really think this will be a good seller for Jack.

I didn't see much magnet either and the comment from them was that they are smaller than in DI. I'm pretty confident that they wouldn't have gone through the extra cost/code if they weren't going to be used much.

Awesome that they are still adding video assets and the oompa loompa songs, I was worried that the licensing didn't included the Ooompa Loompa songs for some reason. Shame about Candy Man, but doesn't sound like there was anything to be done about it and personally it wasn't my favorite song of the bunch -- though I can see why others would be disappointed by this. Really sounds like the movie integration/call out concerns are all going to be gone once the code is complete. This is looking like it's going to be a great pin for fans of the movie.

During the stream the question is asked about Candyman @23:42 "will "Candy Man" song be used?"

At 23:58 the response was it wasn't about money. Mars candy (who owns the rights to the song) just refused to allow it to be used.

Agreed...based on what was released regarding size and layouts of the magnet concept, anticipating a pretty unique effect when coded in. Liked the game ALOT more after the stream today...

I just watched the stream, amazing shots and layout....loved the shot at the top and the fact you can cradle the ball on the upper flipper. Lawlor is truly a pinball savant.

I forgot about seeing the ball being cradled by the upper right flipper. That was pretty cool!

What's funny is, for me obviously, I almost feel Wonka's theme execution is actually TOO good! Compared to the muted license of Pirates, it's a bit much for me to imagine playing more than 2 or 3 games back to back. Pirates' tone, it's lack of assets being bombarded constantly, as well as it's sound design being structured in a way that feels more in the background, than incessant, is more pleasing for me.

Wonka was so great to witness and play last Friday, but there's a part of me that enjoys the theme and the flow and rhythm of Pirates more than any other JJP game. As much as people criticize the lack of it's license, to me it strikes the perfect balance of IP and original design that no other JJP game has so far. It doesn't rely on its license for the breadth of the game experience, rather it's license bolsters it.