Hi Raff
Don't get me wrong --- I do not like that Your pin has "Balls to Play" (instead of "Ball in Play"), I do not like the feature "every new ball starts with 'one bonus given for free' ". Your pin may have just one fault or maybe Your pin has 2,3,4 ... faults influencing - making the behaviour really strange. So I want to troubleshoot by simplyfying, excluding possible faults - for the moment I would like to concentrate ONLY on SINGLE bonus. See the JPG (I tried to squeeze - this turned out not very good) , see the JPG, the "encircled orange" threebladed Make-and-Brake switches. Look-up in https://www.ipdb.org/files/2648/Williams_1974_Triple_Action_Instruction_Manual.pdf these relays, switches , check for soldered-on wires NOT touching other solderlugs, proper gapping - I actually ask You to sneak-in inbetween the blades some stripes of paper to have parts on the switches open --- please make sure, guarantee: ONLY along "my green lines" current can pass through these switches.
Then do some tests (playing) "Single-Bonus-Mode" -
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 1 bonus ?
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 2 bonus ?
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 3 bonus ?
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 4 bonus ?
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 5 bonus ?
- what points do You get loosing the ball with 6 bonus ?

I would like to have "Single-Bonus-FEATURE" fixed / functioning --- then (maybe) looking at Double- / Triple-Bonus problems. Greetings Rolf

P.S.: I always have the impression "Counting down (Single Bonus) bonus-ladder and adding thousands of points to the Score-Drum" is one feature - but actually there are two features:
- AA - Counting down bonus-ladder
- BB - Adding thousands of points
but we may have a fault in AA or in BB or in both

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Hi Raff
I do not see the color of wires (soldered-on) in Your JPG in post-5 --- I believe You are on the right switches - but on the wrong side (a three-bladed-Make-and-Brake-Switch we can call "when the relay actuates one half of it opens and the other half closes") - I see the stripes of paper sneaked-in in side "closed when the relay is not active" - I wanted them in "open when the relay is not active". Anyway - I see the switches are proper gapped. Take the stripes of paper out - we proceed in troubleshooting.

Start a game then take the ball out, lift the playfield, secure it lifted, manually make 100 points on the playfield (maybe 10 times 10 points - or actuate something that gives 100 points or that gives 500 points) so the Ball-Index-Relay pulls-in and stays pulling. Manually make 3 bonus. Then look at the Double-Bonus-Relay and the Triple-Bonus-Relay - both are not allowed to be pulling (we are testing single bonus). Put a finger in the Outhole (You simulate "Ball is lost") watch the Double-Bonus-Relay and the Triple-Bonus-Relay - do they stay non pulling when the bonus is counted down ? You should be rewarded with 3 times 1000 points (bonus) - how many do You get ? Greetings Rolf

Hi Raff
You do get up early --- I thought I have time to write --- so I wrote the following text - before me posting: Your post-9 came in ...
I very much dislike "writing and then not posting" so here is my "obsolete (?) writing":

I fear "working on Score-Motor-Switches (JPG, my orange zero)". Do You have 1,2,3 SteveFury-24Volt-Test-Light(s) ? Two cheap car-bulbs of 12Volt mounted in series - two 12Volt-bulbs put one behind the other.

See the JPG - among other switches: "My red 1 and red 2" make the Bonus-Relay (my red 3) to pull-in. It closes "my red 4" switch, establishes Self-Hold-Current UNTIL a switch on the Advance-Unit (my red 5) opens - the Bonus-Relay quits pulling, moves all its switches (and a switch on the Bonus-Relay opening cuts the connection to the 1000-Points-Relay).
Please have a look at Your Advance-Unit - (most likely) a rod on the gear / wheel actuates a switchstack when stepping down from 1 bonus to zero bonus - my "red 1" and my "red 5". Look for these switches - do they actuate early, secure when stepping down from 1 bonus to zero bonus ?

We may have to use Test-Lights to learn about "at what time does the Bonus-Relay quits pulling (?)".

O.K. --- to post-9: What bonus do You get when triple bonus --- 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2 , 1 bonus on the bonus-ladder ?
Grumble - now it is late for me - I go to sleep --- by tomorrow I will do some more thinking. Greetings Rolf

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Hi dgAmpGuy
welcome to the topic - I see You do have an "Triple Action" in Your collection. Most I like (when helping on a problem) is "I also have the pin" --- I then can test theories on my pin ...
Maybe You have or You make some @SteveFury -Test-Lights and help with observations from Your Triple Action (?) - or You suggest tests You have made in Your pin "Do this and You should get that".

Hi Raff
thanks for post-11. I summarize:
1 bonus - no points missing
2 bonus - 1000 points missing
3 bonus - 1000 points missing
4 bonus - 2000 points missing
5 bonus - 2000 points missing
6 bonus - 3000 points missing
7 bonus - 3000 points missing
8 bonus - 4000 points missing
9 bonus - 5000 points missing
10 bonus - 5000 points missing

To see a pattern I'd prefer " 9 bonus - 4000 points missing" - then making up a theory based on the fact that Williams (and Bally) Score-Motors are built 180 degrees symmetrical. On every cam there are two identical halves - then the theory would be "the halves should be identical but they are (faulty) not identical --- one halve has "no-fault" - one halve has "a fault", we say halve-first is good and halve-second is faulty - to find out about which is which: With a bit of paint (paintmark) You mark on the index-cam one "Home-Position" --- whenever You look at Index-Cam You can say "Paintmarked-Home-Position" or You say "NOT-Paintmarked-Home-Position" --- then doing the tests again - this time always starting with "Paintmarked-Home-Position".
(((This theory needs "accidentally / by chance" You happened to do the "1 bonus test" having the "no-fault" Home-Position active (when You did the test) )))

The Score-Motors usually have a (Service) Plug to unplug --- so get ready for a test --- unplugging, manually activate the Bonus-Relay - then doing the "Score-Motor-Turn(s) manually - pulling / rotating on the Index-Cam or maybe on cam-4 or another cam".
I never have done such a test "me manually turning the Score-Motor" - I do not know how easy to be done --- I fear doing this so I made me (about 4) @SteveFury -Test-Lights. Cheap, simple 12Volt-Car-Light-Bulbs --- two mounted one behind the other (12Volt plus 12Volt adds to 24Volt) - long wires, gator-clips on the ends --- I hook-up, then take the Test-Light near the Score-Motor-Index-Cam and lay down the Test-Light. I watch the Index-Cam on the motor and also I can see the Test-Light(s) flashing-up, pulsing, turning-off again --- I do tests "motor not unplugged".

See the JPG --- four Test-Lights hooked-up and all the Test-Lights lay near the Score-Motor-Index-Cam --- a friend does the "manipulating stuff on the playfield" --- YOU stare into the cabinet, at Index-Cam and at the four Test-Lights. You should see "DDD Bonus-Relay-Test-Light turning-on, stay lit", on every turn of 180 degrees of the motor "CCC*** flashing-up five times", on every ... "AAA flashing-up six times", on every ... "BBB flashing-up two times".
And when this works we then look at "when does the DDD turn-off showing the feature (Bonus count down) ends".

Please make You some (four) Test-Lights - they really are handy when chasing faults (((I also like Jumper-Wires to force some connections, I am not a fan of DMM, meters - we may get false readings, I am not used to use meters))). Please write about making (or not making) Test-Lights. Greetings Rolf

P.S. CCC***: I would like to use this CCC as an (musical, rhythmical) Motronome to get me the beat 1,2,3,4,5 --- can also be used when testing single-bonus.

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Hi Raff
here https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/em-pinball-circuits-basics-to-not-so-basic/page/2#post-3184715 SteveFury shows using a Test-Light in a Gottlieb Pin. See in the first picture two 12Volt-Car-Bulbs, one leftbound the other rightbound. So the Outsides of the two bulbs have contact. Current flowing from a wire runs through one bulb, outside to outside --- runs through the other bulb and on in another wire. One gator-clip he clips on at GOTTLIEB-wire-black-is-wire-HOT and the other gator-clip he clips-on here or there or on another place --- doing sevral tests.

Maybe You buy cheap 12VOLT-Car-Bulbs of another form and the connection is made other --- the diagram showing "wire-bulb-wire-bulb-wire" I show in post-13. See "My AAA and BBB and DDD" are just hooked on a coil --- left-to-left (wire-on-Test-Light, solderlug on the coil) and right-to-right (wire-on-Test-Light, solderlug on the coil). But the wires on the (AAA BBB DDD) Testlights are looooong - You clip-on, then take the Test-Light(s) near Score-Motor-Cam-INDEX - lay the Test-Light(s) on the wooden panel. The "CCC Test-Light" is in the schematic a bit more complicated hooked-on --- but is shall be (in Your pin) hooked-on as shown in the JPG.

Instead of making Your Test-Lights (Test-Lights are really a handy helper): I am suspicious that Score-Motor-cam-6-switch-B (is an threebladed Make-and-Brake switch) is no good --- one of the two symmetrical "cuts" on the outside of the cam is no-good (no actuating) --- the other of the two symmetrical "cuts" on the outside of the cam is good (actuating). You may toggle-off the pin, unplug the main power cord (Safety Reasons) - then manually turn the Score-Motor and watch Score-Motor-cam-6-switch-B (make several revolutions and watch) does the middle blade truely travels fom Outer-Blade to the other Outer-Blade.

I really like Test-Lights - I advice / suggest You also make four. Greetings Rolf
P.S.: See that the cam-6 is sitting next to the IMPULSE-cam.

Hi Raff
(((first of August is the National Holiday in Switzerland)))
Yes, I am suspicious --- BUT is the fault there ? I dislike adjusting threebladed Make-and-Brake-Switches, I dislike adjusting Score-Motor-Switches --- I do quite many tests to check --- when my tests tell me "the fault is there" I then do adjust such a switch --- but maybe the tests tell me "fault is somewhere else" --- I do not adjust / mess up a delicate switch.
The Test-Lites are "my many tests" - I would like to learn about (true or not true) "The CCC lite always, reliable flashes up 5 times on a turn of 180 degrees --- but the AAA lite sometimes flashes up 6 times - some other times faulty only flashes-up 5 times" --- do we must work on the Score-Motor-cam-6-switch-B Yes or No.
IF (if, if) You do want to try: Look down in Your pin, down to the motor-cam-6, the third blade (counting the blades top-down) has soldered-on wire-BR-O-is-brown-orange --- use sandpaper, clean the contactpoints - then try the pin --- when no effect: slighty bend this blade upwards a bit then try again.
Still I suggest the Test-Light approach. Greetings Rolf

Hi Raff
how can You make such good pictures (post-21) ? I see the switchstack on cam-6 riding on the Outside of the cam --- switchstack is lifted - the middle-blades of switch-A and switch-B are pushed upwards having contact with the upper blades of the switches --- all great, but of interest is (once You turned, turned further further the motor so) the switchstack on cam-6 plunges down into the valley on the cam --- then, plunged: Does the middle-blade on switch-B truely have good contact with the lower Outer-blade of the switch ? And You then turn, turn turn - turn 180 degrees further so the switchstack plunges again - does the middle-blade on switch-B truely have good contact with the lower Outer-blade of the switch ? Greetings Rolf

Hi dgAmpGuy
thanks for Your pictures (post-27). (Raff and) I may have to ask You for help doing a test with "sneaking-in - inbetween switchblades on a switch" a stripe of paper. Also - when You have a good idea: Bring it up (((I do struggle and maybe I do love too much the Test-Lights and so overlook some facts))).

Hi Raff
I am pleased with (Your post-26) the AAA --- the dropping out of the Bonus-Relay functions --- after 3 times shots of electricity towards the 1000-Points-Relay the connection is cut. Good.
I am pleased with the BBB --- the dropping out of the Bonus-Relay functions --- I believe the Score-Motor-Switch-3B let one shot pass and the Bonus-Relay accepts and let pass. Good.
I am somewhat pleased with the DDD --- what actually is "DDD -- 1 bonus --- The light stays on" ? I am pleased when it means "when manually activating 'ONE-Bonus-in-triple-mode' the DDD lights-up, stays lit until the AAA has flashed-up three times - then the DDD quits beeing lit". I am not pleased when the DDD stays lit forever.

I am not pleased with the CCC (8 flashes). I can live for the moment with 8 flashes means proceed in troubleshooting, I better could live with 7 flashes but actually I expect and want 5 flashes. So I do not want to proceed on the original problem - I want to stick to the somewhat mysterious CCC, 8 flashes. At the very end of post-13 I stated "want to use the CCC as Metronome (an Typo: Motronome)" --- I still dream of "You have the Test-Lights near the Score-Motor-Index-Cam, a friend triggers the Bonus-Count-Down and You watch the Score-Motor-Index-Cam and the lights" and so I need the metronome (CCC).

Please check the threebladed Make-and-Break-Switch on the Triple-Bonus-Relay (the ipdb-manual on page-21 (ori-19) says "switch-D" --- when the relay is actuated, pulling - does faulty the middle-blade still have contact with Outerblade-having-wire-red-blue-soldered-on ?

See the bottom-part of the JPG here - my "CCCnew" - a fresh attempt to get me the Metronome (of five nice flashing-ups) --- I am not interested in whatever relay we see in the schematics --- I just want to use Score-Motor-Switch-IMP-E to give me "nice 5 flashing-ups".

The next step in troubleshooting the original problem then is "Your friend triggers activating 'TWO-Bonus-in-triple-mode' --- what are the results ? (AAA, BBB, fixed CCC or CCCnew, DDD) Greetings Rolf

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Hi Dave
I looked-up a bit on dgAmpGuy - we met in Your Miss-O topic --- how about starting a topic on Yours Triple Action problems ? I agree with Your post-30 in here - I add to it: "8 pulses" - maybe false counting, "1000 Point-Relay" - it has the right number of pulses because "dropping-out of Bonus-Relay" works. We assume for the moment "1000-Point-Relay to 1000-Point-Score-Drum works".

Hi Raff
the situation we're in is not very pleasing - I hope You're not in a hurry. To work on the original problem I must have a Test-Light "flashing-up five times in a turn of 180 degrees (Score-Motor)".

Thanks for Your post-31 - most likely (99.999%) the Bonus-Relay drops out the right time.

A little confusion - in Your JPG in post-31 I see Test-Light clipped-on at coil on 500-Relay "side-wire-red" is clipped-on (which is correct) - but in the text You write "500 point relay coil black side", hmm.
Why do we not have the CCCnew flashing-up 5 times ?
Can You "make 50 Points" on Your pin ? Some standup-switches on the left and the right side should trigger this feature. (((When "making 50 Points" is not working: The CCCnew-Test-Light is entitled to not flash-up.)))
Is the CCCnew Test-Light shot / non-working ?
See the JPG, second from top is again the wiring of CCCnew.
On Top of the JPG I put some text to "Self-Hold-Switch on a relay", here 500-Relay --- and we see how we can test a Test-Light. A 24VAC-Test-Light is a consumer as all the 24VAC-Coils are consumers --- basically hooked-on on one side to "Common-Wire-Yellow (return-side to the transformer) - and on the other side hooked-on to wire-RED or maybe Wire-BLACK (the HOT-Wire coming (through a fuse) from Transformer-Hot- / -Power-Side. See in the JPG "Testing a Test-Light" shown on top of the JPG is the same as shown towards the bottom of the JPG - the Test-Light hooked-in in-between "wire-Yellow and wire-red" (((wire black is solid / always connected to transformer-hot, wire-red connection to transformer-hot has some switches in the connecting wiring))). Please test Your CCCnew-Test-Light.

In Your JPG in post-28, on the left: I cannot see if the Test-Light is clipped-on at "Switch C on the 50-Point-Relay, side wire-w-o-white-orange is soldered-on". I am curious: When You sneak-in there into the switch-D on the relay, in-between the two blades on the switch a stripe of paper for insulation --- when You sneak-in the stripe of paper: Does the feature "making 50 points" not works anymore ? (The stripe of paper must hinder the switch to electrically close) Greetings Rolf

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Hi Dave
maybe a good catch (?) - Your (post-30) "the Score-Motor doesn't stop at 180 degrees".

Hi Raff
good - when You make 50 points - the CCCnew flashes up five times as the Score-Motor does a turn of 180 degrees. I wrote about - I want the CCCnew to act as an metronome --- on about every turn of 180 degrees the CCCnew flashes-up five times. The first question is "When You do the counting down ONE-Bonus-tripled test: Does the CCCnew flashes up 10 times means two times five flashes as the motor turns 360 degrees ?" If "No": Please write. If "Yes": We must consider: The Score-Motor is a helper for many features --- just after the "Bonus-Count-Down-Feature" comes the feature "stepping on the player and/or ball, kicking out the new ball" and this feature also has the help of a turn of the Score-Motor by 180 degrees.

I refer to the JPG in post-28 --- please do a "ONE-Bonus-tripled test":
DDD lights up and stays lit
immediately the Motor starts turning
within a turn of about 90 degrees the AAA and CCCnew flash-up synchronuous three times
then the BBB flashes up once and at the same time the DDD turns off, no more flashing-up on AAA - the CCCnew flashes up two more times - motor finishes the first turn of 180 degrees then makes another turn of 180 degrees (for the next feature - stepping on ball etc.) and in this another turn the only light You see is the metronome, CCCnew flashing up five times.
Try to follow the schematics (on DDD, AAA and CCCnew synchronuous three times, BBB flashes up, DDD turns off, CCCnew continues for a while its steady job.

Then do a TWO-bonus-tripled test - You should see "AAA flashes-up six times but CCCnew does only five times in a turn of 180 degrees", "BBB flashes up two times". Greetings Rolf

Hi Dave
You may also make You some Test-Lights - they are handy. Another good tool for testing is a Jumper-Wire.
Test-Light(s) we can set permanent - and we get the information "coil should fire" or "coil does fire" depending how we clip-on.
Jumper-Wire(s) we usually use to force connection - often we clip-on one side of the Jumper-Wire somewhere and lay the other end of the Jumper-Wire NEAR where we want to force connection --- near - we lay the end of the Jumper-Wire on wood. Then we plug-in, toggle-on, start a game - get ready for the "Jumper-Wire-Test" - we hold the free end of the Jumper-Wire on its insulation and (short) tip-on --- do we get the reaction "the coil in question fires ?" ?

Hi Raff
great - You found the fault --- hmm, not much glory to me. May I assume Your (post-37) "Knocker does not go off" means "Knocker does not fire" ?
See the JPG - along "my orange wiring" there should be connection when "game has been started" - so toggle-off the pin, unplug the main power cord, establish "Test-Light" - then plug-in, toggle-on --- the Test-Light should light-up, stay lit - You then start a new game - Test-Light turns off - then comes-on again --- what is the Test-Light showing in Your pin ?

If the Test-Light lights-up: Want to test with an Jumper-Wire --- toggle-off, unplug the main power cord, clip-on one side of the Jumper-Wire at Solder-lug on Knocker-Coil, side wire-B-W-is-black-white is soldered-on --- lay the other end of the Jumper-Wire on wood - near the Coin-Relay. Plug-in, toggle-on, start a game --- then grab the free end of the Jumper-Wire - ON ITS INSULATION --- tip-on and take away at "Coil on Coin-Relay, side wires-BLACK are soldered-on" --- does the Knocker fire ? Greetings Rolf

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Hi Raff
when Your switch on the coin door (25 Cent slot) is missing or not connected: You well can set an permanent jumper AA or BB ( I suggest BB) --- or You choose a switch on whatever-relay to clip-on at wire-in-the-pin-color-yellow - on a switch that is connected to wire-yellow see "my red dots" in the JPG.

A question for You to think about:
What made the company to implement "KS" ?
What made the company to implement "KR" ?
What made the company to implement "KB" ?
Greetings Rolf

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Hi Raff
(((Yes - permanent set Jumper-Wire connecting "Transformer-Lug-wire-common-yellow" to "Switch on the Coin-Relay-Lug-wire-O-BLU-orange-blue".))) Here https://www.ipdb.org/files/2648/Williams_1974_Triple_Action_Instruction_Manual.pdf on page-18 (ori-16) we see this is switch-F on the Coin-Relay.

Sensation --- see !!! on switches -B, -C, -D on the Coin-Relay: Solder-Lugs HAVING soldered-on "wire-common-yellow". So instead of doing the "Transformer-lug-wire-yellow to Coin-Relay-Switch-F-Lug-wire-O-BLU-orange-blue" permanent Jumper-Connection --- simply set "Coin-Relay-Switch-D-lug-wire-yellow to Coin-Relay-Switch-F-Lug-wire-O-BLU-orange-blue". Or if You have better access: From switch -B or -C (yellow). In reality in the pin there (probably) is a naked wire connecting -B to -C to -D, lugs-yellow. Greetings Rolf

Hi Raff
great - the Knocker works. Look at the JPG in post-42, "my blue lines, starting in the upper left corner - then down to "my red AA": Parts of the wiring in Your Triple Action is missing / disconnected.

A Jumper on Coin-Relay forever ? It depends on what You want to do with the Coin-Door.
- A complete restauration ?
- A bit of work to wire as much so You do not need the jumper on Coin-Relay ?
- Set the pin to "free play" and ONLY using the Start- / Credit-Button on the front of the pin - therefore solder-on a permanent short wire (to do the job of the jumpering) --- THEN MAKE A GOOD documentation.

See the JPG here --- "my red A" is the "Anti-Cheat-Switch" (upper left corner in the JPG in post-42) - so You have this switch. "My red B and the red C": There Your pin should have the Coin-Switches --- are in Your pin switches mounted ? Greetings Rolf

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Hi Raff
You did not write what You want to do with the Coin-Door (wiring). In Post-45 You write "Knocker works with the permanent set Jumper-Wire". You may let the Jumper there - or (better) instead of the jumper You solder-on a short wire instead. I will make an JPG You can print out --- and You lay that print-out-paper into the pin (place where the coin-box is / was). Greetings Rolf

Hi Raff
IF (if, if) You choose the solution "permanent set jumper 'Coin-Relay-Switch-D to Switch-F' " then You should document the jumpering with something like the JPG I show here. Greetings Rolf

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