(Topic ID: 224402)

Williams System 11 audio line level out possible? - High Speed

By mahoutsukai

1 year ago

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  • 4 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by mahoutsukai
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider


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#1 1 year ago

I have Williams High Speed (Williams System 11).
I also tagged Grand Lizard and Road Kings since they use the same sound.
Is it possible to tap into an audio line level out on the mainboard (and sound board if necessary)?

If anyone knows the answer, could you please provide some information?
Maybe something like: Chip numbers, pin numbers on chip that I can tap into to provide this signal, photos? General thoughts?
I am not a EE, but I know how to follow instructions and solder chips and etc. onto pinball circuit boards properly.

I am already using a second L-Pad on a 100HZ high passive crossover for the backbox, and a 100HZ low pass for the cab. The cab speaker is a stock replacement from Marco (stock on this pin is easiest since most current speakers magnets are too big to allow the playfield to fully open up for service)
I crank the bass up to just below any distortion, and then bring the backbox speaker (Mid/hi) up to a more acceptable level.
It sounds better.
The cab rumbles and shakes without distorting with balanced mid/hi at the backbox.
It is much more controllable being able to adjust the bass separate from the mid/hi-range.
However, with true line out, I think there is still opportunity for improvement.

I would like to tap into an audio line level out to try to obtain cleanest signal for proper and modern amplification.
I do not want to use a "high level to line level" converter, since this still does not bypass the circa 1986 amplifier chips in the pin.
I have seen there have been/are several projects with Adrino, Pinsound, etc completely replacing the sound on some pins, but nothing I see on the market for this pin... so I might look at this in the future, but I don't think this is a realistic hope anytime within the next 5 years.
I know the stock audio recordings are still not of the highest fidelity, but I would still like to know if it is reasonably possible.

I spent about 5 hours with Google and searching the Pinside forums for answers to this, but have not been able to find any information.

This is my first post, so "Hello out there!".
To introduce my game, here are some things I recently did to it:
XPin Power Supply, Xpin LED Display (Orange), NVRAM, Aluminium flippers, FreePlay's HS ramp, replaced the TIP 42 lamp matrix transistors with IRF9530 and 1K Ohm resistors (FYI: This Mod Saves about 10 watts), Bulbs: 100% LED. Safety: Fuses added between the transformer and bridge rectifier. L-Pad and passive crossovers for speakers. Power usage at idle: (Kill-o-watt measured): 82 watts

#2 1 year ago

The simplest is to use the outer terminals of the cabinet volume control. The shielded wire is ground and the other outer terminal is your fixed level (line level) signal.

#3 1 year ago

Road Kings is a different unique game only sound board (games after Road Kings was essentially the same board but added more ROM space.

HS and GL have only a 1408 DAC for sound generation. Road Kings is the first sound board that added the Yamaha synthesizer chips in addition to the 1408 (those would be used through the 1st gen WPC sound board.

The 1458 chips on these boards are the op-amps.

1 month later
#4 1 year ago

Thank you, I removed the linked games RK and GL.

Quoted from KenLayton:

The simplest is to use the outer terminals of the cabinet volume control. The shielded wire is ground and the other outer terminal is your fixed level (line level) signal.

Thank you. That worked.
I think I did this opposite of what you described. I also flipped them the other way... and could not hear a difference in the sound quality either way.
To the shielded wire I attached the positive, and to the unsheilded outer terminal I attached the ground. See photo.

I built a box for a woofer and the stock cabinet speaker. It sounds and feels better now.
Restoring cabinet soon, so please forgive the rough/temporary state, just contributing where the project is at so far.
- The playfield does still fully open.
- Speaker box materials: 3/4 MDF, wood glue, and decking screws
- Nobsound TAS5630 2.1 channel 150x50x50 watt RMS (aka Amazon generic $60 Chinese Amplifier)
- Eye Boot Eye-500 500W 48V DC power supply for amplifier.
- JL audio 6W3V3-4 6.5" Subwoofer 150 watts RMS.

The amplifier does a good job with the woofer, but even with the audio input disconnected, and the volumes all tuned down.... the 2x50 watt channels in the amp produce a low-hum. The hum is not noticeable on the 6" stock cabinet speaker, so I hooked it up to that. The backbox speaker makes the hum too noticeable, so I did not connect it to the Nobsound amp. The backbox speaker goes though a high pass passive cross-over through its stock connection.
Does anyone have any recommendations for a better quality mid/high amp, or maybe a better quality all in one amp?

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