(Topic ID: 196101)

williams sys 6 Flash takes points away when playing

By heypat

6 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 20 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by barakandl
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

Untitled2 (resized).png
Untitled (resized).png
Screen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.18.31 PM (resized).png
Screen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.17.55 PM (resized).png
#1 6 years ago

Going through my latest project, Williams Flash.

Just about ready to move it into the collection from my workspace in the garage and I noticed it is not keeping score properly. I checked each switch individually and they score the proper amount.

I noticed while playing at random times the score will reduce by a large amount like 70 or 80 thousand. Never seen anything like this and its random and not related to any one switch.

has anyone ever seen this before?

Im assuming this must be MPU related, Board was clean when I got it, not battery damage and good sockets (not scanbe) reflowed all pins and new connector on the driver board. Game had some burnt coils and blown transistors on the driver board but that has all been repaired.

pop bumpers seem kind of weak but other than that and the score everything is working as it should.

Any ideas where to start?

#2 6 years ago

Could it be the 10,000 score digit displaying incorrectly? Should be displaying a 9 but shows a 2 perhaps? Or something similar?

#3 6 years ago

Do you have any examples of specific scores before and after?

#4 6 years ago

in display test. do the digits count 0 to 9 in order? any numbers repeat? ie... 2, 2, 4, 4, 6, 6 etc...

#5 6 years ago

All digits display properly in test mode. I have a short video of it happening. Will see if it lets me upload it.

#6 6 years ago

Looks like no video allowed, I took screen shots. Score dropped from 175k to 103K

Screen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.17.55 PM (resized).pngScreen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.17.55 PM (resized).png

Screen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.18.31 PM (resized).pngScreen Shot 2017-08-19 at 4.18.31 PM (resized).png

#7 6 years ago

You have to post the video on YouTube and link it up.

#8 6 years ago

open the coin door and push the MPU diagnostic button. The LEDs should flash twice.

See if the top led or both leds stick on (ram problems).

#9 6 years ago

I'm guessing the zero is supposed to be an eight, but the middle segment is missing.

#10 6 years ago

Passes diagnostics. Both led's flash twice. Display has all segments in test mode.

#11 6 years ago

Loaded the video to youtube, here is the link.

#12 6 years ago
Quoted from heypat:

Display has all segments in test mode.

And all numbers 0-9, right? If you score more after it goes down, does it continue counting from the new lower score, or does it jump back up eventually?

Does anyone know if the diagnostic button tests the roms?

#13 6 years ago

OK, so i figured out it is not actually decrementing the score. It is not showing the number 8 or 9 when adding the score. Testing today just using a switch worth 1000 points it will show 15k,16k,17k,10k,11k and then 20k.

It is adding the score but shows a zero for 8 and a 1 for a 9. In test mode it displays all digits including the 8 and the 9

#14 6 years ago

Sounds like you're somehow selectively losing one of the bits somehow

#15 6 years ago

Does anyone know which section of the MPU would cause this problem?

Has anyone seen this before?

I cannot find any references to it on line

#16 6 years ago

I think I'm going to start by putting a socket on the MPU for the pia and put a new pia in to see what that does for me.

#17 6 years ago

missing d3 input or its stuck low? see this chart for the 7 segment decoders.

Untitled (resized).pngUntitled (resized).png

#18 6 years ago

Untitled2 (resized).pngUntitled2 (resized).png

#19 6 years ago

Fortunately IC18 was socketed, so I pulled the 6820 last night. Man it was in there tight, I mean real tight. Put in a new 6821 and then the game would not boot. I have substituted before without issue so either this game does not like it or the new 6821 is bad. The legs on the old 6821 were tarnished so I cleaned them up and put the old chip back in and the problem is gone.

It was warm out when I noticed the problem and kind of cool last night so I need to run it on a warm day to make sure it was not a thermal issue. I will likely put in a new socket this weekend just make sure that was not the problem as well.

Thanks to everyone for their assistance!

#20 6 years ago
Quoted from heypat:

Fortunately IC18 was socketed, so I pulled the 6820 last night. Man it was in there tight, I mean real tight. Put in a new 6821 and then the game would not boot. I have substituted before without issue so either this game does not like it or the new 6821 is bad. The legs on the old 6821 were tarnished so I cleaned them up and put the old chip back in and the problem is gone.
It was warm out when I noticed the problem and kind of cool last night so I need to run it on a warm day to make sure it was not a thermal issue. I will likely put in a new socket this weekend just make sure that was not the problem as well.
Thanks to everyone for their assistance!

good to hear. The Fairchild and other 6820/21 have legs that turn black and rot. That rot was probably sticking to the IC socket contacts making it tough to remove. A lot of time legs will break off when you try to remove them.

Since it worked reseating the chip, one of the PIA binary count data bit Ds was floating (then pulled down by resistor bank). If it comes back, that IC socket may need replaced. IC socket could be the reason the new PIA didnt work, maybe some of the rotting leg gunk was jammed up in the IC socket and it took two insertions to wipe the contact clean.

Promoted items from Pinside Marketplace and Pinside Shops!
400 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Green Brook Township, NJ
2,100 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Milan, IL
From: $ 11.00
$ 170.00
Displays
Digipinball Shop
 
$ 9.95
Eproms
Pinballrom
 
$ 65.00
Boards
Pinball Haus
 
$ 11.00
Electronics
Yorktown Arcade Supply
 
$ 12.50
Lighting - Led
RoyGBev Pinball
 
1,300
Machine - For Sale
Allentown, PA
Trade
Machine - For Trade
Woolwich Township, NJ
$ 27.95
Eproms
Pinballrom
 
From: $ 9.00
From: $ 5.00
Cabinet - Other
UpKick Pinball
 
From: $ 90.00
Tools
Pincoder Store
 
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/williams-sys-6-flash-takes-points-away-when-playing and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.