(Topic ID: 124004)

Williams Swinger Restoration and (Eventual) Retheme


By RyanClaytor

4 years ago



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#501 3 years ago
Quoted from bingopodcast:

Thanks Pecos! In the end, it was not a long battle. I'm sure Ryan will chime in this evening. Now he knows my troubleshooting technique, some basics about electricity and pinball electricity in particular, and how to clean a machine.
Now he needs a bingo.

Nick - I would love to know your process/techniques. Have you considered doing a "bingopodcast guide to EM schematics" type of guide?

#502 3 years ago
Quoted from brandsilence:

Nick - I would love to know your process/techniques. Have you considered doing a "bingopodcast guide to EM schematics" type of guide?

Absolutely, though it will likely be in the form of one of my podcast episodes. I'm not great with visual aides, but most any schematic is aide enough.

I've done an early episode (I think sub ep. 50) on schematic symbols and troubleshooting, but I believe those episodes focused on Gottlieb schematics. I'll do one on a Williams or Bally flipper game that you can read along with on IPDB.

#503 3 years ago
Quoted from bingopodcast:

Absolutely, though it will likely be in the form of one of my podcast episodes. I'm not great with visual aides, but most any schematic is aide enough.
I've done an early episode (I think sub ep. 50) on schematic symbols and troubleshooting, but I believe those episodes focused on Gottlieb schematics. I'll do one on a Williams or Bally flipper game that you can read along with on IPDB.

I'll check that one out! Thank you!

#504 3 years ago

Looks like episode 17 and 18 were my initial stabs. I'll do a good combined show on Bally or Williams schematics.

#505 3 years ago
Quoted from bingopodcast:

Looks like episode 17 and 18 were my initial stabs. I'll do a good combined show on Bally or Williams schematics.

Thanks! I've scoured your episode descriptions and i've downloaded the following episodes that seem like more general info. I've listened to your podcast a number of times but never dug into to the catalog. Thanks for creating such a great resource.

Episode 17 - Schematic Symbols Described
Episode 18 - Using Schematics for Troubleshooting
Episode 24 - Relays and Sequences
Episode 26 - Drop Targets
Episode 30 - High Voltage
Episode 34 - Gigi and EM Adjustments
Episode 42 - Ding Ding Ding
Episode 50 - Some of My Mistakes
Episode 55 - Cabinet Repaints
Episode 85 - Score Reel Care and Feeding
Episode 118 - Cleaning the Bottom Board
Episode 123 - Cleaning Metal
Episode 127 - Cleaning your Cabinet
Episode 133 - Score Motors - Gottlieb
Episode 135 - Score Motors - Williams
Episode 141 - Using a Multimeter with an EM Game
Episode 142 - Basics of Electrical Theory
Episode 144 - Transformers
Episode 170 - Insert Leveling the Easy Way

ok, i'm done hijacking this thread now, Ryan!

#506 3 years ago
Quoted from brandsilence:

ok, i'm done hijacking this thread now, Ryan!

brandsilence and bingopodcast: PLEASE, hijack away!!! I'm happy to have more informational resources as part of this thread.

#509 3 years ago

Oh boy! Looks like a high score.

#510 3 years ago

Alright, so I've spent this week chatting with Nick each night (he in Virginia and I in Michigan). He's done a commendable job of suffering through my ignorance. But tonight, I felt like some pieces began falling into place and the puzzle that is schematics started to reveal itself to me.

I'll use an example of another thing we fixed tonight. This time at the start of our session I told Nick, let me talk through this one on my own and see if I can figure it out myself. He admitted he was hoping I'd say this. My guess is he needed a break from teaching his remedial electronics student. (Actually, Nick has been saintly through this whole process and I can't speak high enough words of praise for his patience and persistence with me.)

So tonight we tackled a problem with the pop bumpers.

swingerPops.jpg

- YELLOW and GREEN pops are labeled, "10 points or 100 when lit."
- Unlit, the YELLOW pops scored the appropriate 10 points when hit.
- Unlit, the GREEN pops scored the appropriate 10 points when hit.
- Lit, the YELLOW pops DID NOT score the appropriate 100 points when hit.
- Lit, the GREEN pops DID NOT score the appropriate 100 points when hit.
- The 100 point center pop DID NOT score the appropriate 100 points when hit.

Nick told me to start with the coil that was having a problem and work backwards from there. So, if you recall the Swinger schematic:

schematicColors.jpg

...and...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

The 6 volt line leads to and powers everything in the green section (lamps, for the most part?), while the 24 volt line leads to and powers everything in the yellow section (coils, for the most part?).

...that means the coil will be found in the 24 volt section. Also, conveniently, pretty much all the coils are located at the top of the 24 volt section, so you can kinda run down a list of all the coils until you find the right one.

Alright, so 100 points are not scoring. That must mean I should look for a 100 point relay of some sort.

I began scanning through the list of coils at the top of the 24 volt section, remembering I should be...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Moving from left to right (just like reading!!!)

...I came across this section...

schematicColors2.jpg

...where I spotted...

1stPlayer100ptDU.jpg

...which made me think I may have found something. On the contrary, a D.U. turns out to be a "drum unit" which is fancy phrasing for "score reel." Okay, so the "Player 1 100 pt D.U." is not the culprit. I scanned further down the schematic, again...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Moving from left to right (just like reading!!!)

...until I got around here...

schematicColors3.jpg

...and noticed this...

100ptRelay.jpg

Bingo! < - (That's for you, Nick.) I found it!

Now, what to do with it now that it's been found? Well, after locating the coil (found at the top of the 24 volt section), you begin to work your way down. Since...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

current flows from negative to positive

and the negative/yellow wire is at the bottom of the 24 volt section, then one of the switches between the coil and the negative/yellow wire is likely the reason for the malfunction.

However, the place I started to get concerned tonight was how to figure out what to do if there is a junction (which looks like this):

junction.gif

The 100pt Relay happens to have a junction between it and the negative/yellow wire. Nick told me to, once again, simply start...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Moving from left to right (just like reading!!!)

...by following the path of the left most line of continuity, checking the switches along the way to ensure that they are all doing what they're supposed to do (normally open, normally close, and making sure there is DEFLECTION [a bit of movement] when they touch), then moving to the right on the schematic doing the same thing.

The first item I came to when moving downward from the 100 pt relay was a make/break switch (which looks like this):

makeBreak.jpg

...on the Step-Up Relay. After locating said relay, it looked like everything was pretty much doing everything it was supposed to, save for one switch. On the make/break switch, when the make switch was supposed to break it did, in fact, break. However, the separation between the switch contacts was a lot smaller than the other switches. So I used my switch adjustment tool to...well...adjust that switch. Once gapped appropriately, I turned on the machine, tested the aforementioned pop bumpers and they all scored 100 pts appropriately!

That felt pretty good. Especially since Nick did his best to let me figure-out most of it on my own. This schematics-reading thing is pretty empowering, and pretty addictive. I can see why people start hoarding project machines.

#511 3 years ago

Ryan, you've done great and learned a tremendous amount in a short time. In fact, I think for your next project, you'll be set in no time.

Your problems were incredibly minor, as the above example highlights - in fact, just getting the machine to live required 3 simple switch adjustments. I think in total you ended up doing 6 switch adjustments after reassembling steppers and playfield units.

Two points:
1) I believe your pops are still not lighting, as discussed this is due to junk sockets.
2) I'm pretty sure that your machine is 100% (aside from the bad sockets in your pops and bad chimes)?

Ensure that you test several games as single player, then do the same with several two player games. Note any problems. If there are any problems, repeat your test. If there are no problems, you're good!

If you have repeatable problems, you now know how to troubleshoot, and you know what a Drum Unit is, so you should be set. I showed you the legend and how to read it - one thing we didn't touch on was how to determine Jones Plug wiring issues, but those are the hairiest types of problems, and you don't have any on this game (thankfully).

I'm only a phone call away should you need another lesson, but I think you'll be all set for any game you tackle in the future!

Congratulations! Enjoy Swinger!

#512 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

He admitted he was hoping I'd say this.

Oh, this was because you had gotten confident enough to tackle without any help whatsoever - I knew that was coming. To start, I had you look at the coil names and then showed you how to work backwards. It was only a matter of time (like three tracings) before you started doing it on your own.

If you'll recall, I had actually had you troubleshoot your lock relay as well.

#513 3 years ago

Oh fine, the day AFTER I come to visit you get the machine working

I kid of course. Sounds like swinger is up and swinging, or very close to it! Now you can get moving on the super secret retheme we are all dying to hear about

-Andy

#514 3 years ago

I understand tracing lines on the circuit diagram, but how do you relate that to the actual board? For example, you went down a wire labeled "W-R-1" (white and red?) on the schematic to get to the make/break switch, yet you talk about following the negative/yellow wire.

Are there any "circuit diagram compared to reality" threads I could absorb if I don't have my own personal Nick around?

#515 3 years ago

Ha! Well, the wire colors are crucial as well as identifying the relay, stepper or other unit involved.

Following the yellow common wire helps you to understand the direction the current flows. Thinking of it this way is a cheat: it actually flows in both directions because it is A/C, but it is much easier to understand if you think of it as unidirectional. But the problem is rarely with the common, it is between the common and the black hot wire above the coil. Using the wire colors will help you find the exact switch on the relay that is a problem.

With the manual, you can compare to the schematic and see what is what. The manuals for Williams games are very detailed and show each switch on a detailed drawing of the relay, which is fairly useful if your labels are worn away. Wire colors are still important.

Hope that helps, but happy to go into further detail if you'd like.

1 week later
#516 3 years ago

I'm waiting on a parts order to fix my chime unit. (My fault for delaying the order, not a delayed order from long ago.) Anyhow, despite being able to order the majority of the parts, I can't find a supplier for the main unit, which has a broken brackety thing:

IMG_9990a.jpg

...and here's a highlight of the busted part:

IMG_9990b.jpg

So, basically, the top done got broke off, and now it won't hold the wire coat-hanger thing in place to secure the chime. So, whenever something scores 100 points, it kinda flops around inside the cab (a behavior I'm trying to remedy).

Now for a couple close-ups:

IMG_9991.jpg

Here's a look from the other side:

IMG_9993.jpg

Once disassembled, I realized it was part of the whole unit. Not simply a replaceable part. So, I've been trying to figure out a way to fix this, as no one seems to have a spare chime box to part-out (https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-em-seeking-parts-thread/page/34#post-2804649)

IMG_9997.jpg

Just for comparison, here's what the unbroken side looks like.

IMG_9995.jpg

Alright, fellas, any ideas for fix-it-try or does someone possibly have a Williams 3-chime unit laying around?

Thanks, as always!
-Ryan

P.S. Here's hoping all the Americans on this thread had a dandy Turkey Day.

#517 3 years ago

Clay discusses it here:

http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index3.htm#chimes

I think the exact same thing is shown and he mentions adding a new post with pop rivets. But not much detail on exactly how to get that piece. Hopefully someone will chime in with more information on that.

#518 3 years ago

Hmm.... like this one? My Super Straight didn't come with a chime box at all. I found one on epay and bought it and it came with this. I guess it was a 4 chime game and I only needed 3.
IMG_5740.JPG

The other choice would be to find a good local TiG welder who could fab the little part and weld it on in place of the broken one. Shouldn't be too hard or expensive. Does your fancy university have a welding department?

#519 3 years ago

I get how Clay's fix would work. You bend over the broken part and rivet a little bar in it's place to the side of the box with a hole in the proper place. The holes in the bars are plenty generous enough to allow for it.

#520 3 years ago

Hey XVSToys,

I feel like you mentioned this to me somewhere recently (the EM seeking parts thread?), but I spaced on reading it until now. Bah! Bad on me. Thank you for reminding me here.

Quoted from xsvtoys:

he mentions adding a new post with pop rivets. But not much detail on exactly how to get that piece.

Right?

Quoted from xsvtoys:

Hopefully someone will chime in with more information on that.

+1!!!

Oh, hey...

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

I get how Clay's fix would work. You bend over the broken part and rivet a little bar in it's place to the side of the box with a hole in the proper place.

Hmmm...I've never riveted before...or punched holes in metal (use a drill?). I still kinda feel like I did before your explanation. ...sorry. (Remember, you're talking to a cartoonist, not a machinist.)

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

Does your fancy university have a welding department?

That's a fabulous idea. I'll ask around some of the more useful people in my department (not the resident cartoonist...pfft).

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

The other choice would be to find a good local TiG welder who could fab the little part and weld it on in place of the broken one. Shouldn't be too hard or expensive.

Okay, this sounds like it might be the most plausible thing for me to do.

http://www.yellowpages.com/lansing-mi/welding-shops

Looks like a lot of them specialize in trailers. Sounds like BIG stuff. I wonder if they do small stuff, too. Any tips on what to look for before I start cold calling?

*cue pensive moment*

Now that I'm thinking about it, while I do not weld, I can solder (more or less). What if I got a couple of small washers and soldered them to each side of the janked-up nub there? Would that work, or is the solder not strong enough to withstand the constant banging? (I feel like a diagramatic drawing is in order...*sigh*...hold on):

cockamamieIdea.jpg

Finally...

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

Hmm.... like this... I found one on epay and bought it and it came with this.

Sooo, I got really excited for a second. However, on closer inspection I BELIEVE I have something different. Check it out. Here's my Swinger chime unit (without a tub and nylon-tipped plungers bonking the chimes in the middle BETWIXT the nubby bits):

photo 1.JPG

...while THIS is my Jubliee chime unit (with a tub and nylon-tipped plungers bonking the chimes on the outter edge BEYOND the nubby bit):

photo 2.JPG

No, that's not my thumb in the viewfinder on the upper-right in the picture above, it's the forehead of my helper:

photo 3.JPG

All this to say...I think those are two different units (not interchangeable???) and yours appears to be of the tub variety (the kind I do not have on my Swinger). But, as you've come to know, I'm open to suggestions. Do you think yours could work as a replacement?

In other news, I just refreshed the "EM seeking parts" thread and found this...

Quoted from bflagg:

Ryan, I probably have what you need. I know I have 2 complete chime units and I'm pretty sure they need to be rebuilt but aren't broken. Let me know if you still need and I will find them. - Barry

Another Texan. You guys are the coolest. I'll let you know if Barry has the non-tub version.

#521 3 years ago

Ryan, no, solder is not strong enough. You need something that will permanently bond the metal to metal. Precisely what welding does.

Solder (silver solder) would hold for a time, then vibrate apart. Silver solder has higher tensile strength than typical lead-free or leaded solder. Nice drawing, though!

All chime units are interchangeable, with enough work, as we've discussed before. It's not even that much work!

You only have to ensure that they are driven at the proper voltage - based on the coil rating. If you are swapping in a solid state chime box, you simply cut the diodes off the coils.

As various manufacturers did have differences in their chime designs over the years (as you can see from the two examples in your games), they also potentially used different coils. Just make sure your coils are driven by the appropriate line (check your schematic for whatever the donor game was, if you know it - if not, I and others can help you figure it out based on similar games). Ballys are probably 50v (depending on game), Williams and Gottlieb 25 or 24v. I can help with a retrofit, as I'm sure most of these folks can as well. You have a solid Jones plug that you can transfer to a new unit. It'll mostly be plug and play (after you transfer the wiring).

As we discussed - if you can find an intact donor unit, you'll be better off. Not that originality matters on this game as it will be rethemed... so do as your heart, and your helper, command.

#522 3 years ago

Well! Excuse me AND my inside-out (with tub) version of Williams chime units! LOL!! I'm pretty sure it would work with a parts swap. Same thing, different arrangement. BTW, I met bflagg last weekend at the Houston show. Nice guy! I'm looking forward to playing his Space Mission in Dallas next March.

I don't think the solder solution would last too long. If you want to look into the welding rout, you need a guy that does TiG. (Tungsten arc welding.) It's a technique for joining small materials. Think joining two razor blades together. But I think the best solution is to get one from me or Barry. And if I send you mine you can send me yours back and I can fix it for someone else or use it in a future project.

Shawn

#523 3 years ago
Quoted from bingopodcast:

You only have to ensure that they are driven at the proper voltage - based on the coil rating. If you are swapping in a solid state chime box, you simply cut the diodes off the coils.

Ha! Where were you two years ago!!???!? I blew a LOT of fuses before I figured that one out! I received the chime box fully populated and merely rebuilt the mechanical portion. I jury-rigged a jones plug from a project donor machine, wired it up and plugged it in. It looked right. I couldn't believe it would work once or twice and then blow a fuse. Someone finally asked on the APP thread and ding! I cut off the diodes and all was well after that.

#524 3 years ago

Ryan, looking at your pictures I have come to several conclusions.

First, the top of that metal chime "tab" has been broken and pushed up and over to the side. Compare it to another tab and you will see, hopefully, what I am talking about. You might be able to bend the top of that tab down and over to close the gap. Put the end of one of the existing round lockdown bars into the hole of the non-broken tab and lay the other end onto broken tab. Tap the bent piece down and over carefully with a hammer. This should close the gap. You will still need to find a way to weld the smaller gap. The metal piece might break off in the attempt, but no real loss if it does. Or you could replace the whole metal assembly.

It doesn't make sense that Williams made a chime unit without the plastic "resonance box." You want one on the chime box as it makes for a better sounding chime. I'm guessing that your Swinger chime box originally came with the plastic "tub."

#525 3 years ago
Quoted from bingopodcast:

Ryan, no, solder is not strong enough. You need something that will permanently bond the metal to metal. Precisely what welding does.

OKAY! Good to know.

Quoted from bingopodcast:

Nice drawing, though!

That ole' thing?

Quoted from bingopodcast:

if you can find an intact donor unit, you'll be better off

Okay, so I've sort of been asking around about this in a couple different places (here and the EM seeking parts thread) and over yonder, Barry (along with a bunch of other confirming voices) agree that the tub and non-tub chime units are the same thing. In fact, Barry went a step further and uploaded some pictures here:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-em-seeking-parts-thread/page/35#post-2821446

...which I will now steal I MEAN APPROPRIATE and re-post here for the convenience of the Swinger Resto/Retheme thread family (these pix are courtesy of Barry a.k.a. Pinsider bflagg):

withTub.jpg

withoutTub.jpg

Brilliant.

Essentially, they are the same thing with the coils mounted on the opposite side of the unit wall. This was speculated to have been done because the outsides of my chimes were sheared off, leaving nothing for the plungers to bonk. Yay, Pinside! (I love this place.)

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

Same thing, different arrangement.

Thanks to all of Pinside telling me this, I finally understand.

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

BTW, I met bflagg last weekend at the Houston show. Nice guy!

COOL!!! Seems like it.

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

If you want to look into the welding rout, you need a guy that does TiG. (Tungsten arc welding.) It's a technique for joining small materials.

Great! Glad to know...although between you and/or Barry, I'm guessing I'll be able to avoid this route.

Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

Ha! Where were you two years ago!!???!?

He was probably still in junior high. You know Nick is, like, twelve-years-old, right?

In all seriousness, Nick has got to be one of the smartest guys I know. No idea how he has acquired the knowledge he has (I mean...making short work of electro-mechanical BINGO machines!??!) in such a short amount of time.

Quoted from Pecos:

...the top of that metal chime "tab" has been broken and pushed up and over to the side. ... You might be able to bend the top of that tab down and over to close the gap.

You know, I kinda saw that, but didn't put the pieces together as you just have! Good eyes (and problem solving), Pecos!!!

pecos.gif

(Sorry, couldn't resist the gif)

Quoted from Pecos:

It doesn't make sense that Williams made a chime unit without the plastic "resonance box." You want one on the chime box as it makes for a better sounding chime. I'm guessing that your Swinger chime box originally came with the plastic "tub."

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Thanks to all of Pinside telling me this, I finally understand.

#526 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

http://www.yellowpages.com/lansing-mi/welding-shops
Looks like a lot of them specialize in trailers. Sounds like BIG stuff. I wonder if they do small stuff, too. Any tips on what to look for before I start cold calling?

A couple years ago the flimsy welds broke on the top section of my Tron trough. I looked up welding / metal shops in the yellow pages, and just walked in the nearest place with my trough. The owner had one of his guys fix it for $10, took about a minute. I'm sure he was happy to pocket ten bucks for basically no extra labor cost. Now I have much beefier welds that will probably never break as long as I own the game.

Coincidentally, the owner told me he used to fabricate ball troughs, until DE/Sega/Stern went with someone cheaper. Which is probably why mine broke in just a couple years of home use. You get what you pay for.

It's neat how many people & companies with pinball connections you stumble across in the Chicagoland area.

#527 3 years ago
Quoted from yancy:

I looked up welding / metal shops in the yellow pages, and just walked in the nearest place with my trough. The owner had one of his guys fix it for $10, took about a minute. I'm sure he was happy to pocket ten bucks for basically no extra labor cost. Now I have much beefier welds that will probably never break as long as I own the game.

Nice story! Sounds like everyone came out happy! Good to know there are welders willing to work on this stuff, but I think I've got a Williams Chime box coming to me from Texas right now.

(Bflagg and I have been in contact.)

Quoted from yancy:

Coincidentally, the owner told me he used to fabricate ball troughs, until DE/Sega/Stern went with someone cheaper. Which is probably why mine broke in just a couple years of home use.

Ha-ha! Cool about the pinball connection! ...bummer about the quality downgrade.

#528 3 years ago

I love this thread.

#529 3 years ago
Quoted from Pahuffman:

I love this thread.

Thanks, Pahuffman. You made my night with this post. ...makes all the laborious picture-taking and gif searching worth it.

- -- ----- -- -

In other news, while I await the arrival of my new (to me) chime box and a parts order (which includes the all important up-post solenoid) to complete the RESTORE portion of my Swinger project, I bought another project machine.

This time I ventured the way of the Gottlieb EM with their 1968 effort, Paul Bunyan. I started another thread for that beauty and if you enjoyed all my ignorance and excessive documentation on this thread, you're sure to appreciate this one as well:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/paul-bunyan-restore

The only source of disappointment might be that I didn't develop a dissertation-length title for the thread.

For those worried I'm going the way of the Jpop (too many project, none will get finished), here's my priority list:

1) Get Swinger 100% functional
2) Start cleaning up my Bally Hay-Ride and Work on Artwork for the Swinger Retheme (concurrently)
3) Finish Hay-Ride clean-up
4) Dig into Paul Bunyan and get 'im functional

Thanks to everyone here for following along and offering a kind word or a helping hand to guide me through this restoration project. I hope some of you will consider doing the same on my upcoming couple of projects. It'd be nice to see some of the Swinger Restore family over there as well.

-Ryan

#530 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Barry a.k.a. Pinsider bflagg...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

...and I have been in contact...

...and today that...

Quoted from RyanClaytor:

...Williams Chime box...

...just arrived in the mail...

IMG_0106.jpg

...along with some other goodies from PBR to help me complete this restore.

- -- ----- -- -
Just wanted to take a brief pause for a good guy alert. BFlagg and I were in contact over the weekend. He sent me the chime box (immaculately packaged, I might add) first thing on Monday, it arrived on Thursday, and he even PM'ed to make sure I knew it arrived. Couldn't ask for much more. Thanks, Barry!!!
- -- ----- -- -

After unpacking Barry's chime box and disassembling mine, I started the task of documenting the disassembly and cleaning up all the parts as best I could.

For some reason, I had envisioned needing to completely straighten these hooks out in order to remove them:

IMG_0111.jpg

...but after a minor tweak with a pair of needle-nose pliers, it popped right off (duh):

IMG_0112.jpg

Good ole' physics.

I also had some reasonable success in metal polishing.

This:

IMG_0116.jpg

Became this:

IMG_0118.jpg

And even though this is going in the garbage, I couldn't resist showing you the glory of the discarded chime bar:

IMG_0113.jpg

#531 3 years ago

Also nice to see this old fried coil...

IMG_0121.jpg

...replaced with a shiny new one:

IMG_0122.jpg

After a lot more scraping and polishing (I swear that black foam stuff turns into solidified tar), I finally started reassembly. Here's the main chime unit assembly:

IMG_0125.jpg

...which I started piling stuff on top of:

IMG_0127.jpg

I'm curious if I'm doing this right...

IMG_0128.jpg

...because once I put the chimes back on...

IMG_0129.jpg

...I couldn't fit those plastic washers over the black sheaths that cover the tiny posts. I stopped kind of abruptly and didn't snap a picture of this predicament, as my mother-in-law is in town and she came down the basement to hit the sack (very near my work space and didn't want to keep her up). Anyhow, I'm hoping some of you EM aficionados will know the plastic washers of which I speak and be able to point me in the right direction.

'Til next time...

#532 3 years ago

Here's what mine ended up looking like...
IMG_6359.JPG

#533 3 years ago

Maybe you need to trim the sheaths? I don't remember if I did or not. I'm thinking I may have just pushed down on it until I could get the securing pin through. I also noticed that "one" of us has his chimes in backwards. After checking pics on IPDB, I see that it's ME!! Aww jam it!!

#534 3 years ago
Quoted from Mk1Mod0:

Maybe you need to trim the sheaths?

I'm going to assume so, too. It looks like the sheaths were simply cut by hand in the first place (a bit off-level on each edge, definitely not machine cut) so they probably err on the side of too long, rather than too short (good thinking, PBR!). Alright, so here we go.

Today, sheaths were trimmed:

IMG_0143.jpg

Then the reassembly process started over again.

Sheaths:

IMG_0144.jpg

Foam Rings:

IMG_0145.jpg

Chimes:

IMG_0146.jpg

Plastic Washers:

IMG_0147.jpg

Then I remembered to take some more photos of my metal polishing process. This dirty ole' chime-topper (or whatever it's called):

IMG_0149.jpg

Is hit with my trusty wire-wheel affixed to hand-drill to knock off the bulk of the grimy bits:

IMG_0150.jpg

Then I use a green scotch brite pad to knock-down the scratchy tooth created with the wire wheel:

IMG_0152.jpg

#535 3 years ago

When I'm finished, it looks something like this:

IMG_0153.jpg

Good enough for my standards. I'm guessing I could buff it out even further, but usually by the end of these first couple of polishing steps I've had enough hand-polishing. If I could find a tool that I could chuck into my hand-drill and was the approximate coarseness of a green scotch brite pad (and other tools of even higher grit) I'd probably continue polishing until it was a mirror finish. However, I'm powering the green scotch brite with dainty artist-hands, so I get weary. Anyhow, further reassembly.

Chime toppers (OR WHATEVER!):

IMG_0154.jpg

Looping the coat-hanger-y thing back into closed position with a needle nose pliers:

IMG_0156.jpg

Secured:

IMG_0158.jpg

Then I started doing pretty much everything wrong. I attached the bracket which holds the chime coils and realized I might have installed it too soon, as the coils wouldn't fit:

IMG_0160.jpg

However, after referencing my Jubilee chime unit:

photo 2.JPG

I realized I attached the bracket on my Swinger chime unit in the wrong place, a bit too high. So I moved it down further, like on Jubilee:

IMG_0161.jpg

However, something odd was happening. It wouldn't tighten down flush with the main unit. When I rotated it a bit to look from the other side, I noticed the screws holding the bucket in place were protruding through the main unit, hitting the bracket on the other side, and not allowing it to lay flush:

IMG_0162.jpg

#536 3 years ago

Here's an image from the extreme side showing how the bracket could not lay flush against the main unit:

IMG_0163.jpg

This chime unit is the ultimate Frankenstein reassembly. Some parts are from Barry's unit, some parts are from mine, some are from Pinball Resource, while still others are from Pinball Life. I decided to use my coil bracket in reassembly because it had less solidified black tar (former dampening foam) caked on, leaving me less to clean. However, after closer inspection, my bracket wasn't lying flush against the main unit because of its solid face, whereas Barry's bracket had the required holes to allow the bucket bracket screws to protrude through:

comp.jpg

After a brief hipster-whining session, I bit the bullet and began chiseling-off the petrified foam of yore.

IMG_0168.jpg

With enough wire-wheel hand-drilling and some 91% isopropyl alcohol on Q-tips (for cleaning that pesky corner), it eventually let-up...

IMG_0169.jpg

...enough for me to cover it up with a new piece of foam, anyway (thankfully, my one piece of black foam came off the other bracket with relative ease):

IMG_0170.jpg

The top bracket...

IMG_0165.jpg

...also got the polishing treatment:

IMG_0166.jpg

Solenoids were reinstalled (on the outside of the unit this time...hopefully in the correct order) and then back it went onto the inside-cab wall:

IMG_0171.jpg

#537 3 years ago

Ryan,

These pics from OXO might help:

oxo_chime_box_side.jpg

I have no idea what that oily substance is running down the side of the plastic box. No oil was used inside OXO while in my posession!

oxo_chimes_poor_mans_rubber_grommet.jpg

I might as well change out the rubber rings while I'm at it. These have gotten rather hard!

oxo_chimes_solenoids.jpg

This rubber pad under the solenoid plungers has seen better days. Maybe I can replace it with a stretched out flipper rubber ring?

#538 3 years ago

After the assembly was all said and done, I was left with only two screws unused:

IMG_0172.jpg

We'll see what falls apart once I get the machine sewn-up and powered-on.

Alright, chime unit reassembly: COMPLETE!!!

happy-walk-cycle.gif

Next item of business was to replace the main coil on the up-post. During our telecommuting trouble-shooting sesh, bingopodcast and I DMM'd that bad-boy and found the lugs to have no connectivity, so something was wrong with that coil. New one (on the left) arrived from PBR a couple days ago:

IMG_0173.jpg

New one installed:

IMG_0175.jpg

It's not pretty, but it was the attempt that stuck after about 47 soldering tries.

happy-walk-cycle.gif

To make a long story short, chimes work without sending the plungers rocketing into the playfield (as they would have on those severed chimes I was working with before), and the up-post now raises and lowers at appropriate times (before it would raise, but not lower, due to the bum coil).

GIF-chuffed-nailed-it-pleased-successs-GIF.gif

So, Swinger is getting darn close to where I want it to be. I even recorded a brief video of my son playing it for the first time. Unfortunately my iPhone4 decided the video was too much to handle with what piddly memory it has remaining. A shame, too, as I really wanted to show off the lightning-fast, Bruce-Lee-esque pop-bumper action. (With the combination of the fast action and the gaping wide outlanes, I was a little concerned my son wouldn't like this brutal new addition to our line-up. But, champ that he is, kept wanting more.)

After poking around the playfield a bit to test for other problems, it seems the green pops are not lighting when they're supposed to (but they are scoring the appropriate amount when they're SUPPOSED to be lit). Also, the 100's chime is not chiming when anything of 100 points worth of value is hit. 10's and 1000's chimes are working just dandy, though. Finally, when my son was in the middle of his second game, one of the flippers started to become unresponsive. I let him finish before I lifted the playfield. Turns out the whole flappin' flipper coil fell off!

I retrieved the coil stop and found the coil hanging from some wires, however, I think I'm going to need to do some searching on the bottom board to find those screws.

See you for my next demonstration of competence.

brilliant.gif

#539 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Turns out the whole flappin' flipper coil fell off!

I retrieved the coil stop and found the coil hanging from some wires, however, I think I'm going to need to do some searching on the bottom board to find those screws.

I tracked down the screws on the bottom board this afternoon. Can you see them?

fb5a013c-f8c5-4f9e-b350-769b5a783f5f.jpg

I couldn't locate the nuts, which are attached to the back of the other flipper, so I'm pretty sure this whole mech fell apart because it wasn't actually screwed into anything (no threads on the bracket).

happy-walk-cycle.gif

Next stop: big box hardware aisle.

#540 3 years ago
Quoted from Pecos:

These pics from OXO might help

Look at your cute transparent arrows. Remind me to send you a ridiculous pointy-hand file.

In all seriousness, thanks for the shots, Pecos. I'm guessing we uploaded our comparison chime-box pix within minutes of one another.

#541 3 years ago

Big box hardware aisle achievement: UNLOCKED!

f3202643-7599-47aa-9618-bbd3fce2b216.jpg

Flippers are back in working order. When I took the flipper mech off to re-install the back coil stop, I noticed the front coil bracket didn't have any nuts securing it on the backside either. Needless to say, they're all secured now. I took a peek at the other (left) flipper and thankfully it is fully secured.

Not a lot left before this puppy is 100% functional. A few lights out, a chime coil not firing, but that's about it.

Gettin' close!

cc.gif

#542 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Not a lot left before this puppy is 100% functional. A few lights out, a chime coil not firing, but that's about it.

Make that, only a chime coil not firing.

I feared the light fixes might be another schematic trace, but I managed to simply replace a couple lights and jiggle a couple of others in order to get them functional. So here are the newly functional lights (starred below):

newLights.jpg

- Center Pop Bumper
- Bottom-Left Pop Bumper
- Top-Left Passive Bumper
- Top-Right Passive Bumper
- Top-Center arrow insert

Here they are again in their unedited glory:

lights.jpg

I'm convinced the lights that now function due to wiggling are because of me being a cheap bastard and using old lamp sockets in an effort to save a nickel. I'll be taking the whole machine apart, eventually, for the re-theme, so I can easily swap out the old sockets for new ones at that point. In the meantime, we'll see if I can deal with that green upper-right pop bumper that won't light...or if I order a new lamp socket and make it right before the re-theme.

#543 3 years ago

I am convinced that pop bumper sockets were built under a government contract using the lowest bidder. Haven't seen one yet that impressed me. I suspect when I redo my next game I will be hard wiring in some LEDs or something.

#545 3 years ago
Quoted from RyanClaytor:

Unfortunately my iPhone4 decided the video was too much to handle with what piddly memory it has remaining. A shame, too, as I really wanted to show off the lightning-fast, Bruce-Lee-esque pop-bumper action.

Took some time to clear the memory on my iMoan and uploaded this quick (20-ish second) video of my son playing our mostly functional Swinger. This one's mainly to show the snappy pop-bumper action...not a lot of gameplay here:

This, however, is a longer gameplay vid. My boy managed to keep the ball alive for about a minute. No small task on Swinger (and likely better than I could do):

#546 3 years ago

Even if you reuse old sockets, Dremel brush the insides and gently squeeze the side tabs in if the bulbs are a little loose and you can bring many of them back to life.

#547 3 years ago

Ryan, you've gapped the switches on those pop bumpers perfectly! Well done. It also helps that 1972 was the year that Williams changed over to DC pop bumbers! THAT is how EMs in the 70s used to play!

Thanks for posting the videos. It looks like you already have a pinball wizard on your hands. It's scary to think how good he will be in a few short years.

#548 3 years ago

Awesomeness Level +1000

#549 3 years ago

How about the retheme now, I have been waiting 8 months and have no more popcorn.
Nice work so far.

#550 3 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

How about the retheme now, I have been waiting 8 months and have no more popcorn.
Nice work so far.

^

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