(Topic ID: 262039)

Williams Stardust Advance Unit

By redrock

1 year ago


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  • 12 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by HowardR
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    Stardust 500 RE (resized).jpg
    Stardust 6B (resized).jpg
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    Stardust Advance Unit PCB (resized).jpg

    #1 1 year ago

    My Stardust Bonus Unit work fine with the Advance Unit's four selections. But the other six (Extra Ball and Gates) have a motor run away. I think it's the Eject Relay not releasing. I have been tracing (wire color and logic) what's holding the relay on but can't find any release. All the motor contacts -- especially the INDEX -- have been cleaned and operate correct through all the cams.

    Could it be the Advance Unit "C" contact? Because the schematic has no "C," just 0-9? (I have an original schematic, too.)

    Stardust Advance Unit PCB (resized).jpg
    #2 1 year ago

    C is just common so no

    #3 1 year ago
    Quoted from redrock:

    the schematic has no "C," just 0-9

    If you're talking about the Advance Unit between 15D and 16D, the C (common) wire is the one with the arrow colored red here.

    pasted_image (resized).png
    #4 1 year ago
    Quoted from redrock:

    motor run away

    If you mean that the motor keeps running, the first step is to find out which of these switches is keeping it running

    pasted_image (resized).png
    #5 1 year ago

    Redrock, Are you saying that when the advance unit gets to position number 5, the score motor starts running and doesn't stop?

    #6 1 year ago

    Thank you all for your fast interest. Howard, yes that is my pin. My original shows a 1 but logically I understood that the top figure was for the bonuses (works) while the one below was for the Extra Ball and Gates (run a way). (So the 1 really is the C.)

    Howard, your second comment is where I have looked in detail and all the relay switches are open except for the Eject Relay. When the first switch on the Eject Relay is manually opened (yellow/O-G) the motor return to home and stops, just like the bonus unit zero switch shuts down the Eject Relay when it returns to zero after all the bonus points have been scored. In the run a way mode I have tried to follow all the O-G wires [sometimes it seems O-BLU] (hard) to see where it is getting power but no luck. (The bright side is that I have a better understanding how the motor with its 30 deg. cams work; with special emphasis on IND. C.)

    edednedy, no. Using the gate as my example, closing the Eject Relay switch the gate opens but nothing else happens except the motor run a way.

    Should the term "eject" really be kicker; although kicker is already used?

    #7 1 year ago

    I made a mistake: looking again at the 500 and 5000 switches in the bank that the seven switches to yellow are located (6C), the 500 top switch is normally closed, controlling the Eject Relay. When opened manually, the run a way stops. (The 5000 is normally open.) But the long blade of the 500 switch is on the bottom so when the replay is actuated it can only move down to open (from closed) -- the opposite of the 5000 where the top blade is on top (open) and moves down to close the switch.

    So now my question is why is the N/C 500 not open like shown on the schematic?

    #8 1 year ago
    Quoted from redrock:

    So the 1 really is the C.)

    No, the C is the Yellow&Blue wire hooked to the arrow that moves from 1 to 2 etc.

    #9 1 year ago

    Thanks Howard, all these little clues help me think through the problem. 5A pulses the Bonus Unit and Gate Relays, so the gate opens. A few degrees later 6B pulses the 500 relay which should actuate the relay and open the N/C switch that will stop the motor and kick the ball. Jumpering yellow power to the 500 relay work. But 6B doesn't generate the pulse.

    So I'm working on 6B yellow and white -- hard to get to the contacts though.

    #10 1 year ago

    Stardust 500 RE (resized).jpgStardust 6B (resized).jpg
    When I jumper W-2 from 6B to the 500 relay coil, the coil cycles from on to off with the motor running. If I momentarily touch the coil, all is OK -- the kicker kicks and the motor stops. It's like there is too little time for the coil to remove power before the INDEX cam starts over. So I might have two problems.

    Although I have cleaned the contacts, tomorrow I will disassemble the stack to see if anything is amiss.

    Thanks for your help.

    #11 1 year ago

    To close the post, I found the problem, although I still have additional run aways that need work. The Bonus Re. Sw. was not normally closed, like the D. and T. Bonus were (see above), so a little bending did the trick. For the novices like me just getting into the hobby, you have put in the hours and keep trying.

    The key, which I have not done before, is to understand the score motor and how it rotates to pulse different things. Using the service switch to stop the motor and move the cams slowly to each notch, you can trace each pulse. Originally I thought my problem was the Eject Re. but to open this relay and stop the motor, you need to actuate the 500 Re., which required 6B to pulse the 500 Re.

    Faded wires are an issue so you have to use a light or meter -- with multiple connections than can fool you in thinking there is a connection when there might not be. I couldn't do this without the help from Pinside to focus the mind; I hope that I can help others in the future, too! Thank you!

    P.S. Two emails to Robin were not answered: how do I add my machines to my profile?

    #12 1 year ago
    Quoted from redrock:

    how do I add my machines to my profile?

    To add to current collection:
    https://pinside.com/pinball/my-pinside/collection

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