(Topic ID: 240376)

Williams Space Odyssey double bonus problem


By seanduffy

3 months ago



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  • 15 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 months ago by seanduffy
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    #1 3 months ago

    I have a Williams Space Odyssey that on double bonus only scores half the lit value. So if 10,000 is lit it only scores 5,000. the single bonus scores fine.

    #2 3 months ago

    Check this circuit for good contact and cleanliness.

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    #3 3 months ago

    I found a switch not making contact at score motor switch 4-C. cleaned the point and adjusted them. But I still have the same problem. The switch on the double bonus relay is good and has continuity. When i check continuity on the score motor switch The lower half of 4-C check as it should, the upper half shows continuity all the time, Whether its open or closed. This my be feeding through some where else but I'm not sure of that.

    #4 3 months ago

    What about the make/break on the Outhole relay? Check sw. C.

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    #5 3 months ago

    Hi seanduffy
    implicit (implied ?) currieddog asks "Does the Double-Bonus-Relay pull-in and stay pulling when the feature "Double-Bonus" should run / take place. Greetings Rolf

    #6 3 months ago

    Currie dog, switch C on the outhole relay has good continuity and is gapped correctly.

    Rolf, Yes the double bonus relay stays pulled in until the bonus unit rest is complete.

    #7 3 months ago

    Hi seanduffy
    (most likely) the Double-Bonus-Relay has two threebladed Make-and-Brake-Switches. Toggle-off, unplug the main power cord (Safety Reasons) - when You manually actuate the relay: Do these M&B-Switches actuate properly ? Greetings Rolf

    #8 3 months ago

    Rolf, I checked the make and break switches. I even ohmed them. They have good continuity and make and break as they should.

    #9 3 months ago
    Quoted from seanduffy:

    double bonus only scores half the lit value

    This switch on the motor may be gapped too wide

    For a switch to work 3 things are necessary
    1) When open, there should be a small space between the contact points (duh)
    2) When closing, the long blade's contact point should push the short blade's contact point enough to move the short blade
    3) The contact points should be clean, which they usually will be if #2 is happening

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    #10 3 months ago

    Hi seanduffy
    single bonus works in Your pin - see the upper half of the JPG - stepping down on the Bonus is fast (Score-Motor-5-IMP-B) and also the making 1000s of points is fast (Score-Motor-5-IMP-C) --- five times per turn of 180 degrees (half a revolution) - synchronuous stepping.
    Both the stepping (synchronuous) on double bonus should be slower - around half speed - see lower half of the JPG. When the "switch encircled red" is faulty - means still there is connection to Score-Motor-5-IMP-B: The Bonus-Unit is fast stepped down - the making points is "half speed" - the feature ends when the Bonus-Unit is stepped down completely. Greetings Rolf

    0Space-Odyssey-Work-03 (resized).jpg
    #11 3 months ago

    Howard, The switch an the long dwell is opening as it should and breaking contact. It also is closing as it should and has good continuity.

    Rolf, When double bonus is energized it counts down at about half speed of single bonus, Click-click pause click-click. when in singe bonus its fast
    click-click-click-click-click. But only score as if it is a single bonus

    Thanks again for the help.

    Sean

    #12 3 months ago

    Check the related sw. on these two relays? I also see that sw. C on each of the A, B, and C relays is tied into Double bonus.

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    #13 3 months ago

    Hi Sean
    where are You at problem-solving ? I struggle with understanding the logic of sequence in reality in the pin / in the schematics. I do have the four Player Space Mission - similar but not identical sections in the schematics. Today I tried on my pin "working with Test-Light(s)" - but I messed up, got false results, must do it again - but need daylight (and this has gone by now). In the JPG I show in the schematics what (alike) I wanted to test in my pin. "D-B means Double Bonus action", "S-B means Single-Bonus action also does simply shows 'pulsing five times on a turn of 180 degree (of the Score-Motor)' ".
    I do have some "SteveFury Testlight"s - see https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/reading-gottlieb-schematics#post-2634425 two cheap 12Volt-car-bulbs put one behind the other sums up to 24Volt-Test-Light. See in the JPG how I wanted to hook on my Testlights.

    My problem of understanding, top of JPG --- in the schematics of Space Odyssey it says "Bonus Unit is stepped down on 4th and on 5th pulse (compared with the pulses 1,2,3,4,5 on the Impulse Cam) - On the points the cam 2-L does suppress some of the Impulse-Cam pulses. I do not yet understand.
    With some imagination I partly understand "Space Mission" --- Bonus-Unit is stepped down on pulse-3 and on pulse-5. If I let suppress (in my imagination) the cam-2-L on the first pulse I'd then have "1 is suppressed, 2,3 give points and 3 steps down the bonus-ladder --- 4,5 give points and 5 steps down the bonus-ladder". This is a nice hypothesis but does not match with the drawing of Cam-2-L ... So I wanted to use my Test-Lights to learn about " what pulses does the Cam-2-L suppress - but I messed up.

    Sean - anyway: Test-Lights are a good tool - want to buy some cheap 12Volt car bulbs and make You some Test-Lights (?). I hope within some 24 hours I can write about results of "my testing again having daylight".
    (((Of course - as usual: The Double-Bonus-Relay (especially the solder-lugs on the relay) in my Space Mission is/are hard to get at))) Greetings Rolf

    0Space-Odyssey-Work-04 (resized).jpg
    #14 3 months ago

    Hi Sean
    what I do write here about my Space Mission is not much help on Your Space Odyssey - the interesting stuff might be wired different. I call for owners of an running Space Odyssey to look up in their pin and write about.
    See the JPG "my Score-Motor" - there are some switchstacks with an off-set (red dot, blue dot) but the Cam-2-Long-Dwell (green dot) does not have an off-set (in my Space Mission). I did use my Test-Lights to find out about WHAT pulse(s) of Impule-Cam is/are suppressed by the actuating of motor-2L (?). I did not really see it so I toggled-off the pin, unplugged the main power cord (Safety Reasons), lifted the motor on one side (on the left in the JPG) and slowly turned the motor the way the motor runs on its own --- watching the timing / actuating of the five times on Impulse-Cam and the actuating of the suppressing cam-2L. The result I show in the second JPG - it is "fake drawing". On Double-Bonus my pin steps down the Bonus-Ladder on impulse-3 and impulse-5, 1000 points I get on impulse-1, impulse-2, impulse-4, impulse-5 (impulse-3 is suppressed by switch on cam-2L opening). I hope for help from an owner of Space Odyssey. Greetings Rolf

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    #15 3 months ago

    Curriedog, Switch C an the A, B, and C relay have good continuity and are opening and closing correctly.

    Rolf, I will get my test light out and do some checking of my own and let everyone know what I find. This unfortunately wont happen until next week. I have too many other obligations at the moment. but should be cleared up to work on it again soon.

    Sean

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