Williams Scorpion sound ROM

Maybe Quench can help you out.
Or Gaston from the PinMame div.

#3 3 years ago

MJH

20eyes

10y 84,550 941 2

I just checked my Scorpion and its labeled Sound Rom 1 and its a prom not an eprom.

#4 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Quoted from 20eyes:
I just checked my Scorpion and its labeled Sound Rom 1 and its a prom not an eprom.

Thank you! Scorpion solved.

Still can't figure out what this one unlabeled ROM goes to tho. I think its going to end up being a shuffle board game or maybe WMS used this sound board in some other kind of coin op gear besides pinball, defender vid, and a couple shuffle boards.

#5 3 years ago

CRD

chad

Game Guy

11y 140K 15,202 9 4

OP
Quoted from barakandl:
Thank you! Scorpion solved.
Still can't figure out what this one unlabeled ROM goes to tho. I think its going to end up being a shuffle board game or maybe WMS used this sound board in some other kind of coin op gear besides pinball, defender vid, and a couple shuffle boards.

I believe all videos that had a sound board were of the pinball level 6,7 style.

#6 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Quoted from chad:
I believe all videos that had a sound board were of the pinball level 6,7 style.

Best i could figure out is Defender video was the only one to use the rectangular shaped sound board. The rest of the vids used the square shaped with a 16k ROM from the manuals. They very well could have made another video with the rectangular sound board in early production and then switched to the square shaped one.

The data I have is a PROM as WMS called it and 4K in size. Does kind of have some of the defender vid noises when I explore the sound by trying different input combinations. It does not match any MAME Video sound rom or Pinball Sound ROM, so seems unique. Wish the label had not fell off of the chip, I can tell it had one at some point. Came installed on a board in a bulk lot of sound boards, so the history of that sound board is unknown.

#7 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

Can you send me a copy of the file?
Maybe I can match it with some games....
inkochnito @ kpnplanet dot nl

Peter

#8 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Hi Peter,

I sent you all the WMS sound PROMs i dumped. A few of them are unique like Contact, Phoenix, Pokerkino, World Cup, and Disco Fever all have a unique sound ROM but internet downloads typically include the SOUND1 image.

xxx-xx-unkown.716 is the unkown ROM. I built an adapter for my GQ-4X to read the PROMs as a 2716 so they are actually four repeated copies of the smaller PROMs in the 2716 formatted image files.

Andrew

#9 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

OP
Quoted from barakandl:
Hi Peter,
I sent you all the WMS sound PROMs i dumped. A few of them are unique like Contact, Phoenix, Pokerkino, World Cup, and Disco Fever all have a unique sound ROM but internet downloads typically include the SOUND1 image.
xxx-xx-unkown.716 is the unkown ROM. I built an adapter for my GQ-4X to read the PROMs as a 2716 so they are actually four repeated copies of the smaller PROMs in the 2716 formatted image files.
Andrew

You are correct on the first games having unique sound roms.
The files on the ipdb are old and wroung.
Currently the PinMame collection is correct with the right rom files for those games.
I only found a SOUND3 image to add to the list (used is several games).
Which game is omni?
I haven't matched the unknown file jet...

#10 3 years ago

PIP

Quench

Pinside member

8y 114K 8,039

Quoted from Inkochnito:
Which game is omni?

Omni is a shuffle game.

OP
Quoted from barakandl:
xxx-xx-unkown.716

@barakandl, I uploaded an audio dump from this "xxx-xx-unkown.716" ROM a few years ago in your old thread about it. Don't know if you remember. I can upload again.

It contains a number of sound effects from Williams "Joust" video game of 1983. So this unknown ROM is unlikely to be earlier than that. Plus most of the sounds are too long for Pinball so it's more likely for something else. The ROM size is too small to be of an 80's video or Pinball game - Williams already doubled/quadrupled it by then.
There are two shuffle games from that period ('81-'83) "Big Strike" and "Triple Strike", both ROM releases in the wild are missing the sound ROM dump.
I had a listen to TNT amusements videos of these shuffle games and the sounds don't quite match your ROM but who knows.
Plus your ROM was marked WMS. When did Williams and Midway merge?

#11 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Quoted from Quench:
When did Williams and Midway merge?

Around 1988-1989 I think. Pretty sure Atlantis was the last Bally-Midway branded game and it even had some WMS stuff in it like the sound board.

#12 3 years ago

JAY

I_P_D_B

Pinside member

10y 45,550 316

Quoted from Inkochnito:
The files on the ipdb are old and wroung.

Hi Peter,

Wrong, as it bad and doesn't work? Or just an older version?

If you identify which of the three ROM files in the IPDB Scorpion listing you are talking about and tell me what's wrong with it, I can visibly note it so owners of that ROM will see the note and know to send a better one.

Otherwise, those who own a good version have no reason to click on the IPDB version to find out it's broken, and nothing changes. But, if they see the note, they may help.

Thanks,

Jay

#13 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Quoted from I_P_D_B:
Hi Peter,
Wrong, as it bad and doesn't work? Or just an older version?
If you identify which of the three ROM files in the IPDB Scorpion listing you are talking about and tell me what's wrong with it, I can visibly note it so owners of that ROM will see the note and know to send a better one.
Otherwise, those who own a good version have no reason to click on the IPDB version to find out it's broken, and nothing changes. But, if they see the note, they may help.
Thanks,
Jay

Scorpion is correct with SOUND1 but other games like Contact, World Cup, Pokerkino, Phoenix may have the wrong sound ROM on IPDB.

The wrong SOUND1 rom has been packed into the internet download of ROM files for a long time so it must not sound that off because you don't see too many complaints about wrong sound effects in these games, but it has come up a few times if you search.

I sent you an email with all the WMS early sound ROMs that are probably not on IPDB yet.

#14 3 years ago

JAY

I_P_D_B

Pinside member

10y 45,550 316

OP
Quoted from barakandl:
I sent you an email with all the WMS early sound ROMs that are probably not on IPDB yet.

I added the pinball ones. Thanks.

#15 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

Quoted from I_P_D_B:
Hi Peter,
Wrong, as it bad and doesn't work? Or just an older version?
If you identify which of the three ROM files in the IPDB Scorpion listing you are talking about and tell me what's wrong with it, I can visibly note it so owners of that ROM will see the note and know to send a better one.
Otherwise, those who own a good version have no reason to click on the IPDB version to find out it's broken, and nothing changes. But, if they see the note, they may help.
Thanks,
Jay

They have the incorrect sound rom version.
I've updated the PinMame rom files of Contact, Phoenix, Pokerkino, World Cup, and Disco Fever with the correct files.

#16 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

I've got some result comming in.
I'll let you know soon.

#17 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

I've got a reply from Gaston, one of the great minds behind PinMame rom checking.

"I found one of them!
xxx-xx-unkown.716 is for the PROM sound version of Laser Ball (system 6, game #493).
According to the manual this game can either work with regular sound ROM 2,
or with this PROM when the sound board is jumpered for PROM operation.

Scorpion is correct with SOUND1.

This Pokerino file is the unique sound ROMs for early WMS games.
Most, if not all, of the ROM sets on IPDB had the wrong SOUND1 image file packed in.

The Pokerino manual states that inner / out flipper contacts are 43 / 44,
and funny enough, best sound match for that game is the Contact sound ROM!
At least that will produce the least annoying sounds when flippers are pressed.

OMG, the original game really sounds that bad:

So confirmed, Pokerino ROM is correct as well.
I'll add the corrected versions to the code ASAP.

Cheers,
Gaston"

#18 3 years ago

INK

Inkochnito

Pinside member

I've also taken the liberty to upload all the wroung files listed above.
The files are now replaced on the ipdb with the exception of Pokerino.

#19 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl

Wow a PROM version of LaserBall. I have that game setup right now running SOUND2. I will check it out and see if it sounds any different than SOUND2.

#20 3 years ago

237

slochar

Pinside member

7y 86,550 6,913

It would stand to reason that they could burn the same code onto a prom or eprom - now, masked rom versions that's a different story.

While the files themselves may be different, are the actual sounds any different? It may be that there are different versions of the sound roms with the same data but having different indexes to the data, kind of like how the stern speech roms have the some of the same data at differing locations.

It might be nice to be able to slice and dice the sound rom data for custom usage. I know there's some games that don't use some of the sounds I've changed trizone to have different sounds on the drop targets vs. the stock ones just for fun.

#21 3 years ago

AMS

barakandl