(Topic ID: 262018)

Williams Pinbot Flipper Issue

By Icebear1372

4 years ago


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  • 41 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by GRUMPY
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

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#1 4 years ago

I purchased and installed a new flipper rebuild kit for my Pinbot. However, whenever I turn on the power it instantly blows the fuse on the flipper board.
I have done the following to no avail
-isolate the each flipper (both blow the fuse immediately when the power is turned on)
- checked for loose wires

Before I had the issue. If i had very weak flippers and you would hear a distinct hum when when the flipper buttons were depressed.

I am also concerned because if I am reading the wiring diagram correctly, i think someone may have changes wires as I have blu /vio and blu /yel on the right flipper and grey / yel and blu /grey on the left flipper

#2 4 years ago

Can you send a photo of the coil as it is currently wired?

#3 4 years ago

Here you go

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#4 4 years ago

Those are definitely not Original flipper coils. The diodes are probably soldered backwards if the fuses are blowing instantly. Did you replace the coils or just the sleeves?

#5 4 years ago

I replaced the coils sleeves, switch and flipper mechanism. I used the kit from Marcos.

#6 4 years ago

Would it be possible for the diodes to be backwards since they came installed on the coils?

#7 4 years ago

This label on the coil is incorrect. If you follow this label you have a dead short.

coil 1 (resized).jpgcoil 1 (resized).jpg
#8 4 years ago

The cathode of the diode must face the positive voltage like this.

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#9 4 years ago

This is wired incorrectly.

coil 2 (resized).jpgcoil 2 (resized).jpg
#10 4 years ago

GRUMPY to the rescue!

#11 4 years ago

Grumpy, this isn’t my issue but just making sure I understand, he needs to swap the position of the white wire with the blue/yellow?

#12 4 years ago

Hello every and thank you Grumpy.
I just want to confirm. I have two issues here and both issues are also on both coils.

The wires need to be reversed so that I have two wires that come off the +50 volt side. That wire should be the grey and yellow on the left and the blue and yellow on the the right.

I then need to remove the diodes and reverse them.

Is that correct.

#13 4 years ago

I’m fairly sure the diode is good, but produced the results of a backwards diode due to the wires being on the wrong terminals. He was pointing out that the label on the diode was incorrect which is why whoever wired them has them on backwards. The label in your picture shows the +50 on the anode side instead of the cathode side like it’s supposed to. In other words, the diode is correct, the label is simply wrong and the wires need to be moved to the correct terminals.

#14 4 years ago

If you want, I can take pics of my Pinbot flipper wiring. Never touched it myself yet, but they could use a rebuild too. They do flip though, so the wiring must be right and the diode bands must be in the right direction. Let me know if the pics would be helpful.

#15 4 years ago

Diode is correct as you want the banded side attached to the thicker winding.

#16 4 years ago

Dozer, that would be awesome if you could post a picture as well.

#17 4 years ago
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#18 4 years ago
Quoted from Jmckune:

Grumpy, this isn’t my issue but just making sure I understand, he needs to swap the position of the white wire with the blue/yellow?

There is a couple of things that need to be done here. The diode is rated for 1 amp. I'm sure the flipper fuse that burnt was at least 3 or 4 amps. So the diode will have to be replaced on both coils. I would install the diode cathode side (band) to the lug with the thicker or primary winding. Also install the power wire to this lug too. The middle lug always gets one of the EOS wires. The last lug which has the thinner winding wire or secondary winding gets the other EOS switch wire and the ground wire. If your not sure which wire is which, the ground wire will be the same color as on the flipper switch.

#19 4 years ago

Something I have seen happen before is those 2 screws and Tinnerman nut that hold that massive stack of pain in the ass switches can cause a short. Sometimes a slightly bigger screw gets used so it has bite in a stripped out Tinnerman nut, or just because that was the only screw someone could find that is close to right. If it is bigger around, the threads of it can cut through the switch insulation and short out on the base plate. It's a shot in the dark for sure, but a tip that might help someone someday.

#20 4 years ago

Thank you grumpy and dozer!
Any other ideas? I switched the wires and the fuse again blew again on start up.

#21 4 years ago

Here are the photos of the rewire

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#22 4 years ago

Did you also replace the two coil diodes?

#23 4 years ago

Hello Completist.
I did not replace the diodes as once I rewired the coil the anode side was on the side with the ground. Do you think the diodes went bad? Is there a way to check them without removing them from the coil?

#24 4 years ago
Quoted from GRUMPY:

There is a couple of things that need to be done here. The diode is rated for 1 amp. I'm sure the flipper fuse that burnt was at least 3 or 4 amps. So the diode will have to be replaced on both coils.

#25 4 years ago
Quoted from Icebear1372:

Hello Completist.
I did not replace the diodes as once I rewired the coil the anode side was on the side with the ground. Do you think the diodes went bad? Is there a way to check them without removing them from the coil?

You really shoud just replace the diodes at this point. To properly test them you'd want to pull up at least one side of them, but at this point, its more economical and reliable to just start fresh with new diodes. I went to a service call last month for the same issue on a Rollergames with reversed wiring which resulted in blown diodes and fuses.

#26 4 years ago

Thank you everyone.
Cool will do.
Now to quickly run to Microcenter and see if they have the diodes. If not place an order to Great Plains

#27 4 years ago

Since you have 3 system 11 games you need to keep some diodes on hand, if you buy 1n4007 diodes you can use them on coils, switches, lamps and circuit boards.

#28 4 years ago

So fortunately Microcenter had one pack of 5, 1N4007’s. I have replaced the diodes and want to confirm this is correct for the position.

+50 volt will be on the white wire.

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#29 4 years ago

50 volts goes to the white wire.
EOS switch wire to the middle.
EOS switch wire and wire that goes to the cabinet switch to the left lug.

#30 4 years ago

No luck. I replaced the diodes, verified the +50 volt on the lug with the larger wire and again the fuse popped on start up.

What else could possibly be going on?

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#31 4 years ago
Quoted from Icebear1372:

What else could possibly be going on?

Start from scratch, disconnect the blue/yellow and the grey/yellow wires. Replace the fuse, turn on the power and test for voltage at both wires with a DMM.

#32 4 years ago

Okay. I did that. I disconnected the grey and yellow and the blue and yellow wires from the coils. I then turned on the machine and the fuse popped even with the wires disconnected.

#33 4 years ago
Quoted from Icebear1372:

Okay. I did that. I disconnected the grey and yellow and the blue and yellow wires from the coils. I then turned on the machine and the fuse popped even with the wires disconnected.

I think when you had the short across the diodes the you damaged the flipper power supply.

#34 4 years ago

Okay is that something that I can repair?
Or would it be worth pulling one of my other flipper power boards from the other machines to verify?

#35 4 years ago

You need the test the bridge rectifier on the flipper power supply. I bet that there is a shorted diode in the bridge rectifier.

#36 4 years ago

I believe you are correct.

image (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
#38 4 years ago

Thank you Grumpy. I will be ordering parts and will keep everyone posted. Do I need to go back through the coils when I replace the bridge?

#39 4 years ago
Quoted from Icebear1372:

Do I need to go back through the coils when I replace the bridge?

No, you never sent power to the flippers because the short this time was on the power supply and not the coil.

1 week later
#40 4 years ago

Success!
I just received the bridge rectifier from Great Plains. I replaced it on the flipper board and while I was at it replaced the old cap. Sure enough shoots like a champ now. Thank you everyone.

#41 4 years ago

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