(Topic ID: 285731)

Williams Jackpot (Gold Rush) start up problem (Part 2)


By Dengaman

3 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 5 posts
  • 3 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 62 days ago by tcape61
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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Jackpot Game Over latch relay (resized).jpg

#1 3 months ago

Last 2 years I was restoring a as seen in the previous topic:

[url]https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/williams-jackpot-gold-rush-start-up-problem[/url]

After countless hours I gave up on it when I got a new job because of the time I took besides the family. But now with the pandemic, lockdowns and a new year I have new faith (and to much pride) to give up on a great machine, which is a beautiful lamp at the moment hehe...

But to start from the beginning:

Got it in non working condition. First problem was the lock relay burned out, wires were sticking out... So new one soldered and cleaned all the Jones plugs. After that on left flipper button the game lights went on.

Little shallow lighting so cleaned the Jones plugs, sockets, lights, coils, playfield. Everything was kept connected, and after that it was working with only 3 problems:

- 100 coil on the 1p was not working.
- 1000 coil on the 1p was sticky so reset was a loop.
- Replay unit counts up when inserting coins, doesn't count down when starting a game.

Cleaned the plunger and replaced the sleeve of the 1000 coil, soldered a broken wire on the switch on de 100 reel and the game would reset properly and work like a charm. 1 player, till 4 players, did test the game and everything worked ! Except the replay unit, but that looked like something for later... It was a kind of free play, so for testing purposes not that bad.

And yesterday I played the game for an hour or so and powered the machine down. Wanted to play later and it doen's start up correctly anymore.
At first the start up button didn't work at all, checked a lot and now it starts up but doesn't go all the way. The start up sequence I found online is:

1. When the start button is pressed, the credit unit is decremented.
This is done through the credit unit zero position switch and the 2nd
coin relay (and the ball count zero position switch).

2. The end of stroke (EOS) switch on the credit unit decrement coil
will energized the coin relay.

3. The coin relay will trip the game over relay.

4. The coin relay will energized the reset relay. The score motor will
run.

5. The reset relay will energized the ball count unit reset, through
the score motor.

6. The reset relay energizes the 2nd coin relay latch and game over
relay latch coils.

7. The reset relay will energize the score reset relays, through the
score motor.

8. The score reel reset relays will zero the score reels, through the
score motor. The score motor will continue to active the score reset
relays until all the score reels reach the zero position.

9. The reset relay activates the bonus unit coil until the bonus unit
zero position switch is activated.

10. When the bonus relay drops out, the outhole relay is energized
through a different bonus unit zero switch and score motor switch.

11. The outhole relay will run the score motor. The bonus unit will
step up once. The ball will be kicked to the shooter lane.

The problem is narrowed down to two things not working in the sequence above:

1: in step 1 the credit unit is NOT decremented (was there from the beginning).
2: in step 3 the coin relay will NOT trip the game over relay.

After step 8 it does nothing... So no ball is kicked to the shooter lane, game is numb, so no flippers, no points can be scored so I was thinking about the tilts... Checked all, but no tilt can be triggered.

So after that I triggered the Game Over trip manually and check the ball count unit and coin unit. Both get reset on start up. After that I checked both units manually.

When I activate the start button again, coin unit goes to 2p, and activating the start button again coin unit goes to 3p and so on. Ball count unit I can activate the plunger manually and when I do that it goes to 1, 2, 3 and then goes out (on 3 ball play in the backbox), again the game over trip is not triggered so the game does not go to Game Over.

What is that deal with this, it worked fine for a week, and now I am clueless after testing all of the above.

#2 3 months ago
Quoted from Dengaman:

2: in step 3 the coin relay will NOT trip the game over relay.

I'm not sure about that startup sequence, but let's solve this first. The Game Over relay is an interlock relay with two coils. The Latch coil fires at the start of a game and the Trip coil fires at the end of the game.
Jackpot Game Over latch relay (resized).jpg
There are three switches along the path in red that need to close for the Game Over relay Latch coil to fire. There are also other clues you can look for to narrow your search.

For example if your Total Play meter fires when you start a game you know that the Coin relay switch and Score Motor 1D switch are working. If your Ball Count Reset solenoid fires then all three switches are working and something else is preventing the Game Over relay from latching.

/Mark

1 month later
#3 62 days ago
Quoted from MarkG:

I'm not sure about that startup sequence, but let's solve this first. The Game Over relay is an interlock relay with two coils. The Latch coil fires at the start of a game and the Trip coil fires at the end of the game.
[quoted image]
There are three switches along the path in red that need to close for the Game Over relay Latch coil to fire. There are also other clues you can look for to narrow your search.
For example if your Total Play meter fires when you start a game you know that the Coin relay switch and Score Motor 1D switch are working. If your Ball Count Reset solenoid fires then all three switches are working and something else is preventing the Game Over relay from latching.
/Mark

Would this start sequence apply also to Lady Luck? I'm having an issue where the game resets after pushing the start button, but stays in "game over"
Thanks

#4 62 days ago

Probably not. This part of the schematic is pretty different in Lady Luck. Your game over issue probably needs its own topic.

#5 62 days ago
Quoted from MarkG:

Probably not. This part of the schematic is pretty different in Lady Luck. Your game over issue probably needs its own topic.

I figured out the issue, reset bank would not energize. I'm going post how I arrived at the solution with something similar to your drawing, was fairly simple but may be helpful to someone.

Thanks for the response

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