PROGRESS WAS MADE! But I still need help...
I discovered a switch that was set too close. Now start button is still dead, However, When I trip the coin relay on the bottom board, the game resets and the G.O. unlatches. If I lift the G.O. back to latched the 1 player light and inning 1 are lit as they should. The playfield can then be lowered and the 1 player game works! So now only one thing to fix and one thing to verify.

Fix - start button
Verify after start button is fixed, that pressing it twice makes it a 2 player game.

Your assistance is greatly appreciated

This is in a 1968 Williams Ball Park. The only "switch test" is clamping a meter on the switch wire solder lugs and pressing the button. There are no boards or menus.

I am going nuts because I have really cool plans for the game. I made a cool custom backglass and I have cabinet stencils designed already. I have not been able to play this game for 3 years now. I have customized it and it is going to look amazing, but what good is that if it doesn't play?
Check out the custom pieces. Looking for some EM expert help.

Comiskey-BG2.JPG Grandstands-bleachers.JPG

That is what I am trying to do by looking at the schematic.

Files to help diagnose/make suggestions.

I appreciate ALL suggestions. I don't know how to send a pic in a PM so this picture is for freddy

DSC04817.JPG

This may be a dumb question, but if I set all four score wheels to non-0 and trip the coin relay causing them to all reset and display 0, doesn't that mean that the switch is set correct? The odd thing is that the start button worked before I replaced the solenoid that resets the switch bank. I attached the manual. If someone wants to take a look at the manual, send me an email to [email protected] and tell me you want the manual and I will email it to you.

Thanks again everyone for suggestions. I will review the switches again tomorrow. Let me know about my question... if I set all four score wheels to non-0 and trip the coin relay causing them to all reset and display 0, doesn't that mean that the switch is set correct?

Funny you should find that. I saw that as well and I am tracing the wires going back from the switch. So far I made it to the jones plugs. Then I had a good idea of cleaning each score wheel associated Bakelite contact traces and verifying the contacts are only making continuity when the switch is closed. I cleaned them up and they are even smoother than before. Unfortunately it did not solve my start button issue. So it is now back to tracing wires. Bummer. Any other help is greatly appreciated. It I snot easy determining what color the wires are after all these years. I am trying to trace them physically.

Yes, I have the manual and schematic. The schematic is posted on this chain. I can email it to you but the manual is too big to post here even zipped.

I understand about the zeroing out of the score wheels. But even before that the start button should do something.

I cleaned and verified they all work as designed. The two issues I have are these: FIRST the replay/start button on the coin door does nothing now. It used to work. The SECOND issue is that since the start button doesn't work, when I manually trip the coin relay the game startup sequence completes but immediately after that the Game Over relay unlatches. If you manually lift it a single player game works perfectly and all score features work perfectly.

The game is set for free play (the light is lit on the playfield) indicating credits.

Very cool cars. Here is my other classic.

Nomad-archive.jpg Nomad1.JPG nomad2.JPG

Very cool cars. Here is my other classic.

Nomad-archive.jpg Nomad1.JPG nomad2.JPG

The car was bought brand new in 1955 by my wife's grandfather. The young girl is my mother-in -law when she was 10. The picture was taken the day he brought it home. You can see the temporary permit in the back window. It was placed in storage in 1970. I acquired it from my wife's uncle 3 years ago and did a complete restoration.

manual switch relays 1/2

IMG_0021.jpg IMG_0022.jpg IMG_0023.jpg

manual switch relays 2/2

IMG_0024.jpg IMG_0025.jpg

The switch contacts have been cleaned. The button USED to work. When I put my meter on the contacts when the button is at rest there is no contact. When button is pressed contact is made.

That is measured at the switch solder lugs.

I put my meter across the coin switch and set the meter for continuity test. When I pressed the start button my meter buzzed! That is great, now I don't have to worry of a short in that circuit.

Nope, All three switches on that guy are normally open so what causes the coin relay to pull in?

I emailed those to you so you have hi-res version in your email

Anyone have any new ideas?

I just discovered a strange anomaly. I noticed that my 1st inning light was on and then off. I was watching the finger on the inning mechanism. closest to the wood base. When I manually trip the coin relay the finger moves one spot counter clock-wise which is inning one and the light turns on but then the long switch bank gets reset and then the impulse motor goes again. reset sequence continues and the finger moves back one position clock-wise and the 1st inning turns off again. I took the mechanism apart and cleaned it. There is also a mechanical stop so I know it is in the correct position. When you trip all seven targets you get an additional inning as well as hitting the ball in all three homerun fields. Both of these features work perfectly.

Are there any Ball Park owners that can watch the finger and tell me how theirs behaves? Does my startup sound right? It seems like it is right to me.

-NEWS FLASH-
I believe I have discovered the CAUSE of my issue, however that said, I am still at a loss to solve it. Let me explain...

I revisited the switch bank. EVERYTHING was gapped correctly and contacts cleaned. In the manual it said on page 9 under What to do if: "Game resets, but Game Over relay trips immediately: a. Check switch on Tilt relay, Orange-Green wire." b. Check switch on Lock relay, Green-Orange wire."

I then decided to start by checking for shorts starting at the Tilt switch (7a,b,c) and everything metered correctly. THEN I checked switch (8a, 8b). 8b - MB breaks circuit to this relay when tripped. BUT THEN... 8a - Is NC and the function is Hold circuit to transfer relay or trip Game Over relay. Which seemed related to my issue. I then put the meter and checked all 5 switch blades and they are ALL shorted together!

I would bet a bucket of baseballs that is my issue. Now where do I start to correct?

I wanted to clarify. All blades of the switch are shorted even when NO contacts are touching!

Shorted switch 8a-b

Shorted_Tilt_Switch.JPG

Here is a video of the inning issue. If it uploads anyway.

didn't like the .mov, oh well. I described it in good enough detail.

Thanks, I am excited with my find, but hoping someone with more experience can help

I just discovered a strange anomaly. I noticed that my 1st inning light was on and then off. I was watching the finger on the inning mechanism. closest to the wood base. When I manually trip the coin relay the finger moves one spot counter clock-wise which is inning one and the light turns on but then the long switch bank gets reset and then the impulse motor goes again. reset sequence continues and the finger moves back one position clock-wise and the 1st inning turns off again. I took the mechanism apart and cleaned it. There is also a mechanical stop so I know it is in the correct position. When you trip all seven targets you get an additional inning as well as hitting the ball in all three homerun fields. Both of these features work perfectly.

Are there any Ball Park owners that can watch the finger and tell me how theirs behaves? Does my startup sound right? It seems like it is right to me.

-NEWS FLASH-
I believe I have discovered the CAUSE of my issue, however that said, I am still at a loss to solve it. Let me explain...

I revisited the switch bank. EVERYTHING was gapped correctly and contacts cleaned. In the manual it said on page 9 under What to do if: "Game resets, but Game Over relay trips immediately: a. Check switch on Tilt relay, Orange-Green wire." b. Check switch on Lock relay, Green-Orange wire."

I then decided to start by checking for shorts starting at the Tilt switch (7a,b,c) and everything metered correctly. THEN I checked switch (8a, 8b). 8b - MB breaks circuit to this relay when tripped. BUT THEN... 8a - Is NC and the function is Hold circuit to transfer relay or trip Game Over relay. Which seemed related to my issue. I then put the meter and checked all 5 switch blades and they are ALL shorted together!

I would bet a bucket of baseballs that is my issue. Now where do I start to correct?

The other issue was that my credit button on the coin door no longer works. It was a three steps forward 1 step back.

OK, I got the start button working. Credit switch needed tweaking. I emailed you the inning video. It starts in the off position and then moves to inning one (next dot and inning one lights, then it goes back to off position and it trips to game over.

Jeff, I just called but there was no answer. I am in AZ so it is earlier. It is 6:30pm now. I am not sure how late you wanted to play so feel free to call whenever. I will research the inning solenoid and see what it is connected to.

Ok, looking at the S.U. Side picture. The lower A-22 is the inning SU, the B-26 is the single inning reset SU. And the M-30 is the total inning reset.

Great news! Start button works and resets correctly to 1st inning for a 1 player game now. However if you press the start button again it doesn't change from a 1 player game to a 2 player game as it should. It resets and starts a 1 player game again. We are getting super close now.

Any ideas?

I don't believe it has a player unit. I noticed other posts that mentioned the pins for 10 cent coin adj. and 25 cent adjust. So the .25 pin can be in 2,3,4,5 and looks like a storage position. The .10 can be in 1 or 2 plays. I turned it on and started a game and it worked as it did last night. Then it tried the pins in a different spot. Then the start button didn't,t work again. ugh! I have a hunch that the score motor switches worked last night, but must have been too close and sitting overnight messed it up again. I wanted to make progress before getting a shower. So much for that idea. Oh we'll off for a shower and then church. I will beat on it more when I get back home.any ideas? Is my hunch correct? I have had switches re-adjust and break again in the past.

I thought you were saying like the out unit or inning unit. I think that relay is in the head. I will take a look in a few. Just got home from church.

Ok, we have all seen Clays picture that gives instructions to free play a Williams EM. Well Since I tried it and it didn't work for my 1968 Williams Ball Park. I tried to straighten everything out and wanted to ask anybody how to make this SPECIFIC game set to free play.

credit_unit.JPG

If you look closely Clays picture and my Ball Park are different. I have more switch blades. So just as you thought the top needed to be closed, I did that and it didn't work. I was able to get it to free-play a single game but then pressing it again just reset the entire game instead of moving to a 2 player game.

I believe I shorted almost every combination. If I remember what worked the closest for the one player was to short blades 1-2 and 3-4 counting from the top. I rotated the wheel for the picture. If wheel is rotated so credit window shows no credit that the post on the gear rotates and at zero credits changes the MB from blades 3 and 2 to 3 and 4. That also opens blades 1 and 2 since the nylon spacer on blade 2 rides on blade 4. I believe the bottom switch is for max credits and should be normally closed.

Just made even more progress. The start button STILL doesn't work, however when you manually trip the coin relay the game resets and goes to 1 player inning one and works perfectly. BEFORE manually tripping the coin relay a second time would start a new 1 player game inning 1, but I noticed a switch that needed to be adjusted on the .10 and .25 relays. NOW manually tripping the coin relay a second time trips the 2nd coin and a 2 player game is started.

I can almost hear the crack of the bat and the taste of beer and a Chicago dog!

The start button still doesn't work. I was super close with the manual trip of coin relay once for 1 player and twice for 2 player. I then looked at the remaining 4 potentials and now manually tripping the coin relay twice just starts a new player 1 game. ARGHHHHH! Good thing I don't own a chipper! This game is the proverbial 2 steps forward and one back. The credit unit has been set for free play blades 1 and 2 are shorted permanently, blades 3 and 4 are closed blade 5 is NC and blades 6 and 7 are closed.

The start button still doesn't work. I was super close with the manual trip of coin relay once for 1 player and twice for 2 player. I then looked at the remaining 4 potentials and now manually tripping the coin relay twice just starts a new player 1 game. ARGHHHHH! Good thing I don't own a chipper! This game is the proverbial 2 steps forward and one back. The credit unit has been set for free play blades 1 and 2 are shorted permanently, blades 3 and 4 are closed blade 5 is NC and blades 6 and 7 are closed.

Is there any way to delete a post. once in a while I found it duplicates it.

I will go super slow and carefully after work.

Here is where I am at:
1. start button doesn't work.
2. manually trip coin relay and 1 player game resets to inning 1 and starts. all score features and bonuses (hit all targets for extra inning and all 3 homerun sections for extra inning) work.
3. at startup manually trip coin relay twice for 2 player game and it resets to inning 1 and starts. all score features and bonuses (hit all targets for extra inning and all 3 homerun sections for extra inning) work.
4. manually trip coin relay and 1 player game resets to inning 1 and starts. then manual trip second coin on main switch bank, 2 player game starts inning 1 after 3 outs it switches to player 2 and after 3 outs goes to game over. all score features and bonuses (hit all targets for extra inning and all 3 homerun sections for extra inning) work.

Credit unit MB has been cleaned and is closed.
Verified no opens from switch to coin relay. It buzzed out.
#1 relay (YR/GR) was cleaned and is closed.

Not sure what you meant by "3 or 4 Transfer relay or second coin relay (GR/BY)"

Maybe I am confused or thinking too hard, but tell me if it should be doing this:
I can clearly see the top blade is open and the middle blade is closed with the bottom blade on the Index B switch however, if I test continuity across the top two lugs Wires O-G and Yel even with the top blade visibly open with middle blade it still rings out having continuity.

Could this be my problem? Is something shorted?

Index-switch-B-.jpg

But then again that confuses me more because if I press lightly on the top blade closing the top two blades the motor rotates.

Can anyone reply to my last 2 posts?

I just looked at the 2nd coin relay on the main bank on page 14 it says that switch 4B BR-Y/G-R schematic E8 is Normally Closed. It rang out touching each of the 4B solder lugs.

I was not sure what to specifically look at on Transfer relay so I verified all contacts make and break as they should. What do you want me to jumper and test next?

I will go for bypassing the most and then scale it back or if the button works, is there a problem leaving it that way. Since it is home use and I don't plan on selling it. The custom backglass I made wanted the real estate so I am not using the credit window or the grand slam number window (since that is a lame feature that makes no sense anyway. Thank you Jeff for hanging in there with me on this. I have had the game for 3 years now and never played a complete 2 player game. I can't wait to play. My custom pieces turned out and are turning out great.

When I jumper from the yellow/red wire on relay number 1 relay to the Blue/Green wire of the start button, the start button worked! pressing it again just starts another 1 player game instead of making it a 2 player game, but forward progress.

When I jumper from the yellow/red wire on relay number 1 relay to the Brown/Yellow wire of the Transfer relay the start button did NOT work.

So what does that tell you?

When I jumper from the Blue/Green wire on start button to Transfer relay Brown/Yellow, the start button worked! pressing it again just starts another 1 player game instead of making it a 2 player game. So identical results

Progress, now the Start button works with no jumpers! However, pressing once starts a 1 player game. about every 5 tries it will kick into 2 player as it should. The 2 player lights up and game is ready inning 1. The odd thing is that as soon as I press the first pitch (doesn't matter which pitch button), it reverts back to a 1 player game. Pressing pitch button then works as it should.

I took the assembly out of the head and readjusted the credit switches and that did the trick. It was awesome even as it was being able to get it working more. It feels great to have the start button work. I really appreciate your help. Thanks!

Oh also it didn't matter what pitch button you pressed I checked that same result.

OK, I want to resurrect this demon. First off I had the game working fine for a few months, thanks to you guys, then it resorted to its same issue. So I said screw it and figured I would take a break and complete the redesign and take it all apart and repaint. After reassembly This is where it sits again... Start button does nothing. Once I manually trip the coin relay it completes the start sequence and a complete ONE player game works. After three outs it goes to G.O. like it should. The start button is dead after a game and once I trip the coin relay it starts a ONE player game. Pressing the start button AGAIN just resets and starts a ONE person game. While I am very bummed that reassembly didn't make all my problems go away. I just hope people here are not tired of me and this pitch and bat game.

Head installed.JPG

Batter View.JPG

Blimp View.JPG

Coin-door installed.JPG

Head Complete.JPG

New-cards.JPG

Outfield Area.JPG