(Topic ID: 282675)

Williams "Aztec" won't allow a 4th player?

By Crowebar

3 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 12 posts
  • 4 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by Crowebar
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 3 years ago

I just bought my first Pinball machine. It is a 1976 Williams Aztec EM Pinball machine. The prior owner said he hadn't done anything to it.
It plays fine. We logged a lot of time on it in since yesterday, but it will only allow 3 players to play. When you hit the credit button to add the 4th player, nothing. I downloaded the schematic and the manual but was hoping someone could point me in the right direction before I dive right in! I have pretty decent skills in mechanical, electrical and soldering.
Thanks! Looking forward to this new adventure/hobby!

#2 3 years ago

Hi Crowebar, Welcome to pinside!!

On the Coin Unit stepper (probably in the bottom of the cabinet), there's a toothed ratchet wheel with a pin sticking out of the side. When you add players, the toothed ratchet wheel turns so that pin moves and opens a switch. The switch should open after you've added the 4th player, but it's out of adjustment and is opening when you've added the 3rd player.

The switch has a White&Blue wire on one terminal and a White&Brown wire on its other terminal.

#3 3 years ago

What Howard posted.

I've seen this issue a number of times. The manufacturer put that in to keep customers from accidentally pressing the start button one time too many and losing a credit if the game was already up to four players.

#4 3 years ago

Thanks guys! I think I found the motor that controls the 1,2,3,4 player. It is the only thing that I could see moving when I hit the credit button. It does the same thing every time I hit the credit button. I goes all the way around and stops in the same place for 1-3 players but nothing happens when I hit the credit button again for the 4th player? The pin seems to be seating perfectly in the cog for 1-3 players. I took some pictures. I could try a video if it would help?

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#5 3 years ago

One of those 2 steppers behind the score motor is almost certainly the Coin unit.
If you'd like to try a phone call, send me your cellphone number in a private message and I'll make a first reply with a text message.

#6 3 years ago

Crowebar,

You've at the wrong tree.

The switch that Howard was referring to is located on the side of the coin unit stepper that has a copper-colored gear and horizontally oriented springs. The first pic below shows a coin unit from a different Williams 4-player. It is usually the stepper farthest to the rear of the main cabinet. The switch that is designed to open after the 4th player is added is shown in the 2nd pic. Howard suggests that the switch is misadjusted and is opening after the 3rd player is added. That switch is in series with the credit unit stepdown coil, so it prevents a credit from being deducted when the switch is opened.

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#7 3 years ago

Thanks for the help Howard and Runbikeskilee,
I found the coin stepper switch and someone in the past had bent the leaf way down so that the contacts would open at 3 players. I was able to adjust it so it wouldn't open until the 4th player was added and it worked! HOWEVER, I learned after playing quick 4 player game that the 4th player gets to play forever! It is always 1st ball for that guy no matter how many balls are lost! Seems like someone in the past did this as a quick fix. Any ideas?

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#8 3 years ago

When playing a 4 player game, the ball count step up coil circuit does not go thru the coin unit disc. Instead only the player unit disc advanced to player 4 will complete the circuit. Clean disc and wiper. inspect positioning of wiper finger alignment to the rivets

#9 3 years ago

Crowebar, It is possible that the ball count had been failing to advance when the machine was in 4-player mode, so a previous owner perhaps hacked the switch adjustment on the coin unit to prevent the machine from going to 4 player???

PBDave likely is on to the issue. For educational purposes, check out the schematic at area D /5-6 and you'll see the circuit that goes through the Player Unit and bypasses the Coin Unit when it is in the 4-player position. Should be looking for a Blu-R wire and a R-W wire in and out of the Player Unit. Then, inspect the Owners Manual on pages 16 & 17 and you'll find that circuit on the uppermost terminal strip at lugs A & B.

Like Dave said, try to clean the rivets inspect that the wipers are centered on the rivets. If you take it apart, mark the revolving disc position with respect to the fixed board first. Also inspect for any wires that may have broken off the solder points on the terminal strip. If that doesn't fix it, the machine might have a bad wire on a Jones plug.

Lee

#10 3 years ago

Hi Lee and Dave.
I started with cleaning the disc and wiper and it seems to be working fine now. One more quick question, what is the preferred method for cleaning the contact traces and contact points? I have a impregnated eraser designed for cleaning electric commutators and brushes. What about 600 wet dry sand paper? The com stick I used was pretty conservative but did the job. Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks again!!! My family is addicted to pinball now!

Thanks! Dick Crowe

#11 3 years ago

Glad to hear you got it going 100% and that the family enjoys the game too. Aztec is a fun game with a variety of tragets to shoot for.

Sounds like you did ok with cleaning the contact surfaces on the stepper unit. For some additional stepper cleaning tips, check out section 2D in Clay's EM repair guide. If you scroll down, you'll see some photos of the Williams coin unit switch that you just worked on. http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm#steps

cheers,
Lee

#12 3 years ago

Thanks Lee! Howard shared the same article in a PM. Absolutely an amazing document. I'm so glad I read it. I'm a dive in and go for it guy. I could have really screwed this thing up.
Thanks again for your help on the few issues I had. The game is playing well and even a few little quirks seem to be gone now. Probably the switches cleaning themselves as we play. I have no idea how long it sat before I picked it up. It's getting played now!
Dick

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