(Topic ID: 272269)

Williams Aztec: Will not reset - Will not release ball - Will not play

By The_Great_Man

3 years ago



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  • 7 posts
  • 2 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by MarkG
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Aztec Outhole relay (resized).jpg
#1 3 years ago

Ok. So I had my Aztec playing perfect then....The ball started not releasing from the outhole. I could give the apron a little bang and get the ball to kick out and the game would play. Then it stopped kicking the ball out completely. I opened up the machine and checked every switch in the box and playfied and they all seem to be good.
1. If I turn the machine on and hit the credit button - nothing happens.
2. If I manually add Bonus to the game and activate the outhole switch - the Bonus counts down to 0 but does not then reset to 5,000 and activate the ball release coil.
3. If I manually add Bonus to the game and then activate the Reset relay - the Bonus will count down to 0 but no scores will show on the scoring reels and the Bonus will not then reset to 5,000 and activate the ball release coil.
4. If I manually add Bonus to the game by activating the Bonus advance plunger and then release the Bonus with the Bonus release plunger - When the Bonus gets to 0 it counts back up to 5,000 and the Ball release coil activates.
5. If I manually activate the outhole relay - the score motor runs a little and the ball release coil fires.

With all this going on I can not get anything on the playfield to work at all . Lights are all on but can not get the game to play.

I know this is a lot of information but maybe someone could give me a place to start. As best as I can tell the game is not resetting properly and kicking the ball out to tell the playfield that a ball is coming. But I have no idea where to start trying to fix this problem. I have taken the switches off the cam 4 on the score motor and they seem fine

Thanks for any help that will get me out of my latest edition of Em Pinball Depression.

#2 3 years ago

First issue is this - I think.

If I manually add Bonus to the game and then activate the outhole switch - The Bonus goes down to 0 but then the Bonus does not return to 5,000 and activate the outhole relay and then the ball release coil. But when the Bonus is at 0 - If I manually add Bonus to the game - by activating the plunger on the Bonus unit - the Bonus goes to 5,000 and then activates the outhole relay.

So I think I need to get the machine so that when the ball goes in and activates the outhole switch - the Bonus counts down to 0 and then activates the outhole relay to reset the Bonus to 5,000 and kick out the ball.

BTW - None of this activates the scoring reels at all and the game is stuck on Player 1 - Ball 1. The Ball and/or Player does not advance

Also is it possible the Tilt is stuck on and how would I release that.

#3 3 years ago

Best summary I can give:

1. Can not get anything on the playfield to work.
2. Can not get game to advance Ball in Play count - But I can do this by manually activating the plungers on the coils.
3. If I manually set Bonus on the game and then activate the reset relay - The Bonus score will not show on the score reels.

#4 3 years ago

Getting somewhere. I cleaned everything on the Tilt relay and now the game playfield will work. The game will turn on and set to Player 1 Ball 1 and you can play the ball...But when the ball hits the outhole - the Bonus counts down and stops at 0. The Bonus does not reset to 5,000, the Ball Count does not move to Ball 2 and the Ball does not release.

So I am thinking that when the Bonus counts down to 0 it should activate the Outhole relay and the game will work. What on the Bonus unit activates the Outhole relay?

#5 3 years ago

There is a schematic on IPDB.org.
Aztec Outhole relay (resized).jpgAztec Outhole relay (resized).jpg
If the Outhole relay doesn't fire after the bonus counts down I'd start by checking the two switches in the red box.

/Mark

#6 3 years ago

Thanks Mark.

I just cleaned all the switches on the Bonus Relay and found and cleaned the switches on the Bonus Unit that you showed me - Not sure which of the switches on the Bonus unit works the Outhole Relay - and then I replaced the outhole switch. The game is now working but still not sure exactly what the problem was. I think I am learning that even if switches are making good contact and appear to be clean - They might still need more cleaning or even replacing. I probably should order a bunch of leaf switches so that I am ready for the next problem.

I am trying to learn how to read these schematics. I would read the part you have in red as - There is a Make/Break switch on the Bonus unit that closes and then goes through a Normally Closed switch on the Bonus Relay??? and that closes the connection and activates the Outhole relay???

#7 3 years ago

A visual inspection of a switch can prove that the switch isn't working (if the leaves don't touch for example) but it cannot prove that the switch is working. You need a coil, meter, bulb tester or some other device to prove that current can flow through the switch.

If you want to pinpoint the cause of a problem you need to test the game after each change you make. Otherwise there's no good way to unwind which of the several things you did fixed the problem. Testing after each change also makes it easier to identify what made things worse if that happens. Unless you're restoring a game or have some experience with such things a wholesale/shotgun approach to cleaning switches often leads to more problems.

To find switches of interest from the schematic in the game you usually check the wire colors and the switch types which are specified on the schematic. Replacing a switch (or coil) is not something you commonly need to do unless it has been damaged somehow. They don't usually wear out.

Your interpretation of the two switches is correct. There are good references online for understanding schematics. There are plenty of good examples right in this forum if you read through other technical issue topics and try to understand the solutions. Simple things like wire colors and switch types are often specified in a legend on the schematic - including the Aztec schematic. Gottlieb, Williams and Bally all published manuals that explain circuit basics too. There are links to two of them on my website at:

https://www.funwithpinball.com/resources/parts-catalog-list

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