(Topic ID: 298190)

Will you ever consider buying a NIB JJP pin?

By megalo17

77 days ago


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  • 110 posts
  • 73 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 66 days ago by robotron
  • Topic is favorited by 5 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Will you consider buying a JJP pin in the future?”

  • Yes. Playfield damage is overrated IMO. 33 votes
    11%
  • Yes. Eric’s and Pat’s designs are too good to pass up. 31 votes
    11%
  • No. Jack insinuating that pf damage is caused by the customer was the last straw. 114 votes
    39%
  • Maybe. Depends on if they fix the QC issues. 111 votes
    38%

(289 votes)

This poll has been closed.

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There are 110 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
11
#1 77 days ago

As a buyer of two JJP NIB pins, both with substantial clearcoat issues, and only receiving washer and post kits, I know what my answer is. Wondering how others really feel. The shock and anger has worn off, replaced with ‘shame on me’ for buying again. Actually, I don’t regret my GnR and jjpirates purchases, because it’s Eric. However, I make purchase decisions based on principles. JJP’s utter silence on the clearcoat issues has been deafening, and now Jack tries to insinuate that owners are partially to blame? Is this real life?! I’m done.

#2 77 days ago

Whether I ever buy one or their games depends on a lot of factors, but I think it's clear that Jack needs to apologize and probably keep his mouth shut for a while.

#3 77 days ago

Not anymore...

#4 77 days ago

I'll cross that bridge down the road, but really like the games I own.

#5 77 days ago

Just did Andy my play field is flawless! July build

#6 77 days ago

The short answer is yes.
Perhaps I’ve been lucky, but I’m quite happy with all three of the machines I own.
The longer answer would be it depends what they come up with in the future and if I like it.

#7 77 days ago

My [email protected] is supposed to be delivered this month so..... I've owned all jjp pins and they have been amazing and a pleasure to own. At this point I see no reason I won't buy another. They are just so fun and suit a home environment so well. I'm not happy with the issue's they have had by any means. However the fun they have brought us have outweighed any of the negatives I've had so far...hopefully it continues to be like that lol.

#8 77 days ago

Never again! Only have a WOZ left. All others are long gone!

#9 77 days ago

I bought Emcle love the quality was close to buying a few others but still waiting for that got to have pin limited on space and something has to go for next pin Keith rules on the rules

#10 77 days ago

Yoda Popcorn (resized).jpg

#11 77 days ago

If they make a theme that's a must have for me OG or franchise then Yes. I've had pooling and light chipping in spots with Stern, nothing major but it didn't bother me. JJP #7 Blade Runner. I'm in for an LE.

#12 77 days ago

I wouldn't hesitate if they made a theme i wanted, played well and fun. Fixing the electronics so that the flippers/slings actually have some pop in them is a much bigger issue to me than a little pooling.

#13 77 days ago

Nope.

NIB pricing for all the manufacturers is past my budget at this point, regardless of quality.

#14 77 days ago

I was going to get GNR. But went with Halloween instead, because of all the JJP horror stories.

#15 77 days ago

Hell fuck no. They keep churning out defective playfields. Change their warranty so the defective playfields aren’t a warranty item. Raise their prices. Leave customers out to hang with shit playfields. Fuck no I won’t buy another NIB JJP.

#16 77 days ago
Quoted from Ty-Arnold:

I was going to get GNR. But went with Halloween instead, because of all the JJP horror stories.

But hold on. What if all those damaged and chipping playfields are actually the owners' fault?! I cannot believe this is Jack's defense.

#17 77 days ago

Spend 499 on a playfield to replace the fucked up one they shipped you for 12,500 then spend 40 hours swapping everything over. No thanks I’m not interested in supporting a company like that…

#18 77 days ago

I just took delivery of my GnR this week on the condition from my distrib that he would take care of any issues, even a playfield swap down the road if needed. I wouldn’t have bought this machine without an insurance policy so to speak as the factory warranty appears worthless.

#19 77 days ago
Quoted from Ty-Arnold:

went with Halloween instead, because of all the JJP horror stories

I see what you did there.

#20 77 days ago
Quoted from V8haha:

Spend 499 on a playfield to replace the fucked up one they shipped you for 12,500 then spend 40 hours swapping everything over. No thanks I’m not interested in supporting a company like that…

Only to have it happen again after you do the swap.

#21 77 days ago

Playfield situation is ugly… no way I would buy until I see proof they have it fixed. If my playfield chipped it would drive me crazy… and a playfield swap is expensive and while it would be fun to do myself, no way I have that time. Honestly other serviceable things breaking not as big of a deal, but the playfield, got to get that right JJP.

Question is what does that proof look like ? New vendor would be nice, how about release statistics of the warranty claims. The only place I get my quality info is what is available to me as a consumer. Let’s see, 1) pinside threads and pictures showing chipping playfields, 2) a warranty that frankly is pretty poor at protecting the customer. 3) fact that company has struggled with playfields previously 4) JJP offers solution that I buy a playfield for $500 and magically get it installed.

Hard part is it is really hard to know if this is just a few vocal folks, if so, JJP should just replace with a populated playfield and move us all on… or if it is a Xbox 360 red ring of death situation. So given above, I come to the conclusion that there is a good chance that I would buy a pin with a flawed playfield and have to live with it…. Not something I am interested in.

And I get that things happen, but when they do and you are the company that had the thing happen, you need to fix it. And I get that it is not easy… these companies do not have the financial resources of a Microsoft..not pr the manpower

So yeah I’m out…. I’ve been on the border of buying a NIB pin for awhile…. This stuff clearly keeps me in the keep waiting camp.

For JJP…. Changes they should make:

Make sure their warranty front and center, be explicit… if chipping is potentially part of the normal on their playfields call it out and own it. When someone buys a JJP game they should know what to expect…

A better warranty would be awesome…,but your call.
Improve the quality so the warranty does not cost you a fortune. I’ve seen how much that can add up to and it is not cheap.

Get a new vendor for playfields. Current vendor is killing you.

Keep designing killer games…. I love everything you guys have been doing on the design front.

Create a spare parts kit for your games that you sell with a new game…. With things that commonly break over time… plastics, wear items, etc, get a parts business running that makes money.

Agree with above that jack probably should not have accused folks of damaging their playfields.. even if he thinks it’s true… not the right call unless he has something specific he could call out that could help folks prevent damage.

#22 77 days ago

Yup...I've got a GnR LE on order

-18
#23 77 days ago

Theme and gameplay are king. Playfield chips are like... what? Who cares, a steel ball is smashing this shit all day long.

Although there's a faction of pinball fans who want their machines not played and more like trophies so, maybe they get upset about that. Looks like about 40% of pinside types do anyways.

#24 77 days ago

Yes, bought NIB Wonka, DILE, WOZ and GNR LE. Got into pinball during the pandemic!

Minor issues in my opinion were as follows:
Wonka- kids multiball magnet held the ball so needed to be adjusted (JJP talked me through it), I scuffed up the side art (JJP sent me replacement).
DILE - no issues and shot so smoothly but my family didn’t like the theme.
WOZ - crystal ball SIM card went bad (JJP sent me replacement). No place like home registered randomly during the game (JJP explained to me that I needed to adjust the metal sensor by the rubber). Witch got stuck (JJP explained that it was a bracket tightening issue and walked me through it).
GNR LE - Rubbers failed early and I noticed a small art uplift near the AXL post after all of the pinside stuff. Didn’t affect gameplay and nothing sure I would have noticed but JJP sent me washers and it’s all good.

I completely respect and understand the opinions on both sides of these issues. I will be all in on Toy Story if that is next but you can see that I haven’t had many issues/issues that really bothered me.

#25 77 days ago

Ive owned Wonka and GnR LE(sold both) and considering buying a Toy Story or Eric/Steves next game but would really like to hear what they are doing in future for playfields. I dont like the stance they have taken on this, and would like to hear them speak about why the next game will be better.(they will probably stay silent on this).

Mostly I just want to see more flow and fun to shoot games from them. GnR was a spectacle but not super fun to shoot. Wonka and Dialed in are my favorite JJP games to play so looking forward to Pats next design.

#26 77 days ago

No. Not until they stop shipping games with crap playfields.

I did the same with Stern when their QC sucked ass. Stopped buying NIB.

Make a good product, and if I like it I’ll buy it.

Ball’s in your court JJP.

#27 77 days ago

No, but I never did to begin with...

Im one of those weirdos that actually has patience and will wait for a used one, saves allot of headaches.

#28 77 days ago

Nope….but I already had other reasons before Playfieldgate. Now it’s just “double nope.”

#29 77 days ago

I answered maybe, but really the answer is yes... As long as they do right by their customers (which they can still do by communicating and changing their current stance), and fix the playfield issues.

15
#30 77 days ago

Let me sum up my thoughts about JJP:

I hate craptastic Mirco playfields.

I love Lawlor and Ritchie layouts.

I hate Jack’s ignorant statements.

I love over the top sound, art, lights, rules.

I hate sneaky warranty changes.

I love fun licenses like Pirates, Toy Story, GnR, etc.

I hate having to pay for fixes (woz light boards, hobbit habitrails, GnR playfields) which should be free.

I love games that maintain or appreciate in value.

So yea - I hate them and I love them.

#31 77 days ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

Theme and gameplay are king. Playfield chips are like... what? Who cares, a steel ball is smashing this shit all day long.
Although there's a faction of pinball fans who want their machines not played and more like trophies so, maybe they get upset about that. Looks like about 40% of pinside types do anyways.

This genuinely confuses me. If theme matters, wouldnt the playfield art for said theme matter? Some of the chipping is minor and can be covered by a washer. Some cant and it will likely only get worse as you continue to play. So if the cab and glass were a theme you like and the playfield was just a whitewood, you are ok with that? I think games are meant to be played and damage will happen eventually, but I also payed for the licensed art. I have a heavily routed Shrek and even though it has more than 100K plays on it, the playfield is damn near perfect. I dont think anyone here is complaining that after 20K plays it isnt perfect, but if its like that after 20?

-3
#32 77 days ago
Quoted from SpyroFTW:

This genuinely confuses me. If theme matters, wouldnt the playfield art...

For me no. A few chips don't affect the game at all. I play beat up EM's and SS's all the time where half the art is missing but the game is fun as heck. Would I complain if half my art was missing on a NIB? Yes... But a few chips on a post? Something I literally can't see with the glass on? Tiny imperfections? I personally don't care one lick.

#33 77 days ago
Quoted from SpyroFTW:

This genuinely confuses me. If theme matters, wouldnt the playfield art...

For me no. A few chips don't affect the game at all. I play beat up EM's and SS's all the time where half the art is missing but the game is fun as heck. Would I complain if a NIB was missing half its art? Yes... But a few chips on a post? Something I literally can't see with the glass on? Tiny imperfections? I personally don't care one lick.

My DI had some chips. No biggie.

My WOZ isn't glass smooth and has dimples. No biggie.

My Hobbit had some pf issues. Didn't care at all.

And the people who can't understand the other side of the opinion here are hilarious. It's like, there are multiple perspectives in the world and yours isn't the only one. Dog pile on the minority opinion all you want if that makes you feel better.

18
#34 77 days ago

I'm going to call this how it is: the man who the company is named after his practically stated that YOU are the reason PFs are falling apart. Not the QC, not the PF supplier, not anything wrong with their process - YOU are to blame.

I can't imagine going to ChickFilA, getting burnt tenders, walking to the counter and showing them the burnt tenders and them state to me: "You must have done that, prolly have a fryer in your car. Was definitely you." and I go "Oh, you know what, you're right. Your food is just SOOOOOO good, and I am just so addicted that I'll just bust out my wallet and buy more. Thank you for helping me see how foolish I was. It is clearly my fault." and the cashier goes " My pleasure."

That's nearly EXACTLY what's happening here. If you are considering buying another game after all the issues that have been had, all the empty promises where they claimed they would take care of you YEARS ago now, and now you're being told YOU'RE the problem, and you're still willing to shell out now nearly over $10K PER release because "Toy Story" or "Back to the Future" -- there's no hope for you. You have the ultimate Stockholm Syndrome and are emotionally blind or have way too much "fuck you" money and are ready to rationalize ANY deficiency.

The evidence has been mounting for years, and this "pinball pioneer" just cast the blame on you.

#35 77 days ago

If I end up hating Halloween, GNR was next on my list. On the fence - looks great but The playfield issues and comments from mgt are deeply concerning.

#36 77 days ago

Everybody says no until the next machine is announced and then mysteriously hundreds of orders are put through for the next title. Many people may be mad at JJP for all these issues but just won’t be able to help themselves on the next title seen it far too many times.

#37 77 days ago
Quoted from NPO:

I'm going to call this how it is: the man who the company is named after his practically stated that YOU are the reason PFs are falling apart. Not the QC, not the PF supplier, not anything wrong with their process - YOU are to blame.
I can't imagine going to ChickFilA, getting burnt tenders, walking to the counter and showing them the burnt tenders and them state to me: "You must have done that, prolly have a fryer in your car. Was definitely you." and I go "Oh, you know what, you're right. Your food is just SOOOOOO good, and I am just so addicted that I'll just bust out my wallet and buy more. Thank you for helping me see how foolish I was. It is clearly my fault." and the cashier goes " My pleasure."
That's nearly EXACTLY what's happening here. If you are considering buying another game after all the issues that have been had, all the empty promises where they claimed they would take care of you YEARS ago now, and now you're being told YOU'RE the problem, and you're still willing to shell out now nearly over $10K PER release because "Toy Story" or "Back to the Future" -- there's no hope for you. You have the ultimate Stockholm Syndrome and are emotionally blind or have way too much "fuck you" money and are ready to rationalize ANY deficiency.
The evidence has been mounting for years, and this "pinball pioneer" just cast the blame on you.

I would encourage everyone to listen to what Jack *actually* said in the interview. He didn’t say the cause of every PF issue is because of the customer.

As to your ChickFilA hypothetical - there’s no way I would deny myself those delicious little nuggets because of one idiot employee who would be fired on the spot for saying something so stupid. Nor will I deny myself the fun of buying a Toy Story or Back to
the Future and selling it for +/- what I paid for it. My money, my choice. Feel free to label me whatever you want, I don’t care.

#38 77 days ago
Quoted from Damonator:

I would encourage everyone to listen to what Jack *actually* said in the interview. He didn’t say the cause of every PF issue is because of the customer.
As to your ChickFilA hypothetical - there’s no way I would deny myself those delicious little nuggets because of one idiot employee who would be fired on the spot for saying something so stupid. Nor will I deny myself the fun of buying a Toy Story or Back to
the Future and selling it for +/- what I paid for it. My money, my choice. Feel free to label me whatever you want, I don’t care.

I know JJP is producing Toy Story next, however Does STERN not have the BTTF license ?

#39 77 days ago
Quoted from Damonator:

I would encourage everyone to listen to what Jack *actually* said in the interview. He didn’t say the cause of every PF issue is because of the customer.

Where can I find this interview? Would like to give it a listen.

#40 77 days ago
Quoted from John-Floyd:

If I end up hating Halloween, GNR was next on my list. On the fence - looks great but The playfield issues and comments from mgt are deeply concerning.

I am lucky in that I have an early GNR and zero issues with the playfield. Buying a used one with a good playfield may be the best way to go if you want the game.

#41 77 days ago

I mean, there are women the keep going back to men who abuse them because they love them. I guess if a few dudes wanna keep giving jjp money after defective playfields and bad customer service, then there could be worse things.

#42 77 days ago
Quoted from pinzrfun:

Nope.
NIB pricing for all the manufacturers is past my budget at this point, regardless of quality.

That's how I felt about things until Ultraman was announced and I saw the video. It'll still be generally true for me, but.....yeah.....the pricing for NIB is out of control, and honestly I'm kind of at the point after playing a bunch of the recent Stern LE's that I *do not* want a Pro game in the vast majority of cases anymore, so at minimum I'm looking at Stern Premium prices.

JJP is way way over that, so that's a hard no, and especially with their QC issues lately.

#43 77 days ago
Quoted from insight75:

Where can I find this interview? Would like to give it a listen.

https://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-p6mbh-f7d2079?utm_campaign=w_share_ep&utm_medium=dlink&utm_source=w_share

The discussion is around the 22ish minute mark.

-3
#44 77 days ago

I've now bought 5 JJP LE's and have overall been very impressed with them all. There's been a couple minor headaches with some but nothing really major. If I was going to buy a NIB JJP or a NIB Stern I recommend waiting at least 6 months from release to get your game. It's not worth the early build quality headaches to get one of the first games in my opinion. Look at the early Stern Mandalorian's that are having ball guides digging into playfields, that will be corrected in later runs. So far my July 2021 GNR LE looks amazing and it was one of the best NIB pin unboxing experiences I've had to date.

I'll likely keep buying JJP pins but that's assuming my GNR LE holds up well and again I'll wait at least 6 months from the initial run to get a game. From a code, gameplay, animations, features, cabinet / hardware quality, and ruleset perspective I think JJP's are in a league of their own which is why I continue to buy them.

#45 77 days ago
Quoted from NPO:

I can't imagine going to ChickFilA, getting burnt tenders, walking to the counter and showing them the burnt tenders and them state to me: "You must have done that, prolly have a fryer in your car. Was definitely you." and I go "Oh, you know what, you're right. Your food is just SOOOOOO good, and I am just so addicted that I'll just bust out my wallet and buy more. Thank you for helping me see how foolish I was. It is clearly my fault." and the cashier goes " My pleasure."

True story, when I worked at a Chick-Fil-A for a few years we had a twice a week customer that came in every day up until I quit that would always order things "extra well done"....what they actually MEANT was "put that stuff back in the pressure fryer and run it another full cycle until it's as hard as a brick on the outside". I have no idea how the hell anyone consumes that without breaking their teeth.

#46 77 days ago
Quoted from Damonator:

As to your ChickFilA hypothetical - there’s no way I would deny myself those delicious little nuggets because of one idiot employee who would be fired on the spot for saying something so stupid.

i think that's the whole point - a $7/hr chicken flipper employee would be fired on the spot, yet someone charging $12,000 for games with defects dances to the bank.........

#47 77 days ago
Quoted from insight75:

I am lucky in that I have an early GNR and zero issues with the playfield.

Same but done until issues are resolved.
I don’t like what I’m hearing so far.
Everyone is different, easy vote for me.

#48 77 days ago

The insinuation that customers are to blame and only a few pf’s have issues is insulting. Jack’s role seems to be greatly diminished within JJP, he’s a hype man at this point. Why JJP allows him to talk about quality issues is beyond me as he puts his foot in his mouth frequently. I love his passion and desire to create an alternative to Stern but accusing hobbyists of sabotaging their own expensive toy is Dumb. While an apology would be a start, fixing the pf’s and providing a higher level of customer service should be the focus.

#49 77 days ago
Quoted from Frax:

I'm kind of at the point after playing a bunch of the recent Stern LE's that I *do not* want a Pro game in the vast majority of cases anymore, so at minimum I'm looking at Stern Premium prices.

I'm the same way, if I ever do go NIB again it will be a Premium. Even if I go used, to be honest. But with prices where they are, I'd have to sell a couple games and, well, i dislike doing that....

#50 77 days ago

Thanks for sharing. Listened and agree the overall response should be insulting for those with issues.

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