at the factory in January when i picked up my TF

I usually don't chime in on this kind of stuff as there are enough people 'in the know' that pass on inaccurate information. I was told by a Stern employee...that has been 100% accurate on EVERY piece of information that they'e passed to me in the past years...that Lonnie is doing ST.

I asked about Lyman's involvement in ST and was told...'pretty much all programmers are involved in almost every Stern game in one way or another, ST will be no different.'

This was about 2-3 weeks ago and before Tanio was on board.

Now reading into this it almost sounds like they didn't wanna kill the buzz of the Lyman\ST thing...but that's just my interpretation

Common sense says there's no way Lyman does back to back games with 3 other programmers on Staff and more ACDC updates coming.

Before the game was for sale. So there was really no point in you saying the early code was weak. Very few were able to play that version. It was pre-release.

Considering SR's recent success with AC/DC and the value of a license like ST, more than one programmer is a given.

Saying you won't buy a game because X won't be programming it is stupid. Play one, then decide.

I got it shortly there after. It was weak sauce with 1.21 as well. didnt really shape up until 1.4

What exactly was missing? Weak sauce tells me nothing.

Dots lots of dots. It was all just generic place holders. The scoring was mega unbalanced as well. All you could basically do at that point was make 8 shots and change the song. No other strategy was there at that time. The game didnt really get fleshed out for the premium until the vip thingy and the color changing inserts either. AC/DC was just not that good when i took possession in march of 2012.

Some of the lucky people who got there LE at the end of TPF can verify this as well. It was super bare bones. Thats to be expected. But to think the game was awesome sauce out of the gate is eehhhh not really true.

I would be reluctant to buy any stern pin that wasn't programmed by Lyman or had a whole lot of Lyman's rules input. IM is a great example of the latter. The new guys may change my mind someday but they have a way to go IMO.

The biggest thing about Lyman is you know if stern pulls the plug officially he will finish it on his time.

Me too....people can believe what they want but I'm pretty sure that what SR has SAID and whatever he WANTS is going to happen, especially on what he calls the "most ambitious effort by far" to date....

Lyman on the lead with the second team at his direction....

I think there are already a number of pre-orders for LEs and all we know is the theme and the designer. The thing could come out with a blank playfield with a few drop targets in the back and be priced at 10k for all they know at this point. The amazing thing about this hobby is how people are so ready and willing to throw large sums of cash around at a whim.

Your telling me, you guys only own all your games from the same programmer/designer? I like games from different programmers and designers. They all bring something different to the table. If you have to much from the same people, they feel too much like the same thing. That happened to me early on, when I owned 4 games and they were FH, ES, TAF, and TZ. All 4 felt the same. Needed to diversify.

Nice to see that Play before buy seems to be taking the lead. People are doing less heads in asses. Good work people.

Who said that?

Are you telling me if your choices of music were the beatles, tiny tim, tay zonday and david hasslehoff you would listen to them all instead of just the beatles?

Neo dude...... you need a vacation.

I hate Star Trek,so won't be buying either way.

The Hoff sings??

That's ridiculous, and absolutely untrue.

We won't need a picture.

You're obviously not German!

And you obviously have good taste in music =)

No, no, dude... THIS ONE...

That's it. I'm renouncing my German heritage Monday.

Hey, we've still got Beer. And Porsche's!

This is exactly what I have been saying in just about every single one of my posts on the topic. Lyman will likely work on the project but probably not as the lead. In the video Mr. Ritchie says Lyman will be working on 'our' next pin couldn't he very well be referring to Stern's next pin? Stern has too many programers on payroll to have one person lead every project just kind of the reality of the situation.

In the quote below, you seemed to suggest that it wouldn't surprise you if Lyman didn't work on the game at all.

Smiley at the end or not, do you really think they would yank Lyman from the game after Steve has already said he is on the game? I don't think there's a chance in hell. That's what surprised me. That you think they would just pull Lyman completely off the game. Why even throw stuff like that out there?

For all you guys saying no Lyman, no way, do you like IM or Tron at all? Both have ridiculously basic rules. Hell, I could've written them. Yet they both still manage to be really fun games. Basing your purchasing decisions based strictly on who is the lead programmer is crazy. Don't do it.

The sentence you were referring to had nothing to do with whether or not I thought Lyman would work on the project. Not sure how you equated it to that but needless to say you definitely miss understood. The reason I said it is that there have been more then a couple times things were mentioned at an expo that did not come to fruition not sure why you are harping on that quote so much.

And again in the video it says Lyman will be working on "our" next project to me it sounds like he was referring to Stern's next project not his own. I beleive Sterns next pin was Metallica after these comments were made. The video actually backs up my earlier statement that things are taken out of context sometimes.

I agree play a pin before you rule out owning it for sure. The only disagreement we appear to have is on whether Lyman will lead the software team on ST. I say no you appear to be implying yes. No biggie to me as I have no problem agreeing to disagree we will wait and see who was right I guess. If I turn out to be wrong it wouldn't be the first or last time.

No, version 1.3 was fine. When you say things like 'vip thingy', you don't exactly sound like much of a player. Many of us playing the game on location enjoyed 1.3 just fine. No VIP pass.

Again, if you say 1.3 was no fun, I have a hard time taking what you say about gameplay seriously. 1.3 was better than at least the last 10 Stern games.

Yes it did. Here's exactly what you were replying to...

Dude, I said you misunderstood what I was trying to say. If you don't want to believe me then it is all good. What I meant is that it would be a mistake to take everything said at expo as fact not that Lyman would not be working on the project. My stance was clear throughout the thread if you want to quote something and attach your own meaning to what I was trying to say regardless of what I say so be it. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Either way talking in circles like this adds nothing to the discussion so why don't we just let it go. I'll leave the smiley out as it seems you don't care for them.

DAS IZ GOOT!

As far as the designer thing. Seems many here think Lyman and Ritchie are the only ones that can make a good game. Everyone has a good game or 2 under their belt. And all of them have turds as well. It's always hit or miss. Just because So and So does it, doesn't mean it's an automatic success.

You mean like SR, Lyman and Keith all working on WPT?........wait, that one has unsung greatness in it...

Its not just the video of him saying it but there was a pinsider that spoke to him one on one and according to him SR was clear about who he was working with, but like you said, that doesn't mean that other combos can't be good...it's just that these guys are the best!

NO

I never said anything about who will be the lead programmer. We have no disagreement. There's no misunderstanding either. I think you were pretty clear about your thoughts. You flippantly suggested that Lyman might not work on the game at all. Simple as that.

I was excited for ST already, but I'd honestly be even more so if Tanio was on it. Anyone who knows him can vouch that he was born for this job, and is no stranger to pinball or game design/coding. His credentials from Valve alone speak volumes. Bring it on.

Liars

The LE will sell out in a few days & people will bitch "not fair I want one to flip" even if the popes cat programmed it.

I will buy any good game programmed by anyone but I won't buy unfinished code.

So the programmer means nothing to me, the finished game a year later or never is what determines what game I buy next.

Example: I am going to buy a RBION if Metallica isn't finished this fall & the consider Metallica next year or never depending on code & possible game issues we haven't discovered yet.

Me too...heading to the Boerne Starplex!

Steve and Lyman are like batman and robin they kick ass together, but apart its just not the same

So, apart... which one is Night Wing? Lyman?

Batman is infinitely better without Robin. I don't think the same can be said of SR without LS.

Steve and Lyman are like batman and robin they kick ass together, but apart its just not the same

Sometimes when they're together it's not so good either though.

goddamnbatman.jpg

How old are you? Ever played any of these games?

Firepower
High Speed
Flash
BK
BK2000
F14
STTNG
Getaway

Steve is one of the most creative people you will ever meet. In or out of pinball. His record speaks for itself.

i've played them all.

Firepower- ok
highspeed- meh
Flash- boring
Bk- Horrible on so many levels
BK2000- meh, but way better than BK (not saying much)
f14- fun for what it is
STTNG- great
Getaway- take it or leave it.

How old are you? Those games kicked ass on location. Not even close. HS was the top game for years around my parts.

One of the very telling things about Steve's older games is that you rarely find them in real minty condition. They all got played to death on location. Damb near every last one of them. When you consider the number of games built, that's a whole hell of a lot of fun over the years. If you're gonna question Steve's track record, you better question all the other designers too.

Steve is my favorite designer. Have or (had) most of his titles.

Ed Krynski and Steve Ritchie are my two favorite designers of all time. I would buy Star Trek sight unseen whether Lyman is programming or not. That said, I am under the impression that Stern has restructured its software group and Lyman will have input to all games. And yes, Tanio promises to be a breath of fresh air in the industry.

I absolutely cannot wait for this game!!

If Star Trek is not the next Stern game, and perhaps not even the next (given the comments on another thread), it seems quite possible that Lyman will be the lead programmer per Ritchie's statements on the video. Either way, Ritchie was the reason I went pre-order on ST. It's all about the flow!

What the hell are you talking about, HS is an amazing game and to rate it.... Meh, you need play alot more HS!

And black knight!

35 and my thoughts on your list are...

Firepower - Nothing special
High Speed - Okay
Flash - Not my cup of tea. Probably because it kicks my ass. Although Tron does the same and I love it. So who knows...
BK - Fun game, but gets old fast.
BK2K - Haven't spent enough time on one to have an opinion.
F14 - Never played one, but want to.
STTNG - Great game. One of Steve's best. Only game on this list I would like to own someday.
Getaway - Lot of fun. The supercharger is an awesome toy.

So... I'm not sure what the list was meant to prove, but there are my thoughts on it.