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(Topic ID: 246108)

Will JJP survive past 2020?

By adamsebas

1 year ago

Topic Stats

  • 466 posts
  • 142 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by TomDK
  • Topic is favorited by 8 Pinsiders


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    #101 1 year ago

    This thread is quite silly. The fan boys are going to say yes and the non fan types will say no.

    Regardless of shipping systems improving, it always boils down to dollars and cents. JJP makes some okay games, with code depth. The real problem is always how much is charged for that offering?

    At nearly $10k for what is essentially a Stern Premium, no company can last long, no matter what they do, unless every offering is near what the original WOZ offering was, with a lot of bells and whistles. But WOZ now costs a whopping $11,500.00 with no mechanical monkey, etc., which originally cost only a few years ago, $6,500, with lots more on the playfield.

    Wonka has been severely scaled back to have way less mechanical issues. It is obvious what is happening. The price has not been scaled back to match the BOM. High pricing will effectually diminish JJPS’s efforts for sure. Only fanboys, will pay those kind of prices. Plus the chipping/clear coat issues with JJP play fields, will cause great downward pressure on the company. Who wants to buy into those problems?

    #139 1 year ago

    Wide body games have been a huge problem for JJP. They just don’t flow well. The ball meanders and has more stop and go, instead of the fast sought after flow action. That is why Pat won’t make a wide body and all his offerings are standard. It’s like trying to change a tennis court to a larger size. The game would suffer greatly, just like wide body pinball does. It has been determined almost a century ago, the table size and its not wide body.

    Wonka has better flow than all other JJP tables, but the ball gets lost and that really detracts from the fun factor. Same issue with the ball on the left side of DI. Where is it? It gets lost, so the game play is just not that fun. You only hear the trap door opening, but don’t see the ball at all go into the hole. It is very unsatisfying.

    Wonka also suffers on the level of no real innovation found on the playfield. It feels and looks stripped down. This will surely hurt sales in the long run. High prices need to have high value. There just isn’t high value found on Wonka. Movie theme integration is severely lacking. The music is at best elevator music. The machine could have been soooooo much better if David Thiel was still at JJP. The narrator is just plain annoying. This game is going to be a very tough sell at nearly $10,000.00 here in the USA. I’ve looked up the crazy pricing of this game in other parts of the world and it’s insane. Big time losses are going to occur when anyone that has bought Wonka tries to on sell it to the next person. So sad, it could have been so much more at a reasonable price. JJP has big pricing issues: out of all the pinball manufacturers and they don’t see it, or maybe they do, but unwilling and think people are dumb enough to keep buying into their high pricing scheme. The person that started this thread might be right.

    #141 1 year ago
    Quoted from Skyemont:

    One q to you? What games do you have in your collection?

    No wide body games is the short answer. I do appreciate there are some that like wide body games. POTC is the only wide body game that I personally like the game play of and is a good game code wise. The 3 rings and opening treasure chest being pulled is what destroyed that sale for me. Those 2 important features could have been done without issues so many ways.

    #272 1 year ago

    After reading all your posts here, I’m coming to some conclusions on the viability of certain pinball companies:

    1. Stern has the model down to a fine science on how to stay relevant and successful in a very hard business, i.e., pinball manufacturing.
    2. Spooky has their own unique business model and stays in business based on how they’ve set that up. Non refundable pre-sold table orders.
    3. CGC has their own business model that works for them, mainly because they are just making repeats of old games everyone loves.
    4. American Pinball has an interesting business model that remains to be seen.
    5. JJP is a somewhat of a total mess. They pick outdated or not relevant themes or themes already been done many many years ago by others. The real person running the company appears to be Pat. His years of experience seems to have the real owners ears, meaning the investor family that has taken over. They don’t know pinball, but trust what Pat tells them. Pat is old school, which is not a bad thing necessarily, but can hurt a company in 2019 and may cause them to be struggling to survive in 2020, which is the theme of this thread.

    JJP has made one poor decision after another and has left their core reason of existence: being a high end boutique company for collectors. Wonka comparatively a stripped down table with no special mechs, at high pricing, is evidence of leaving that core reason of being in business. With rumored GNR on the horizon, once again a theme already done in the long ago past, might really hurt the company. Rumored Toy Story with little to no movie assets, based on JJP history, will be another potential loser and potentially not a strong pinball theme (although if done like WOZ many mechs, I might buy it even if assets are weak, if Pat does the layout, because it will play much better than WOZ).

    #277 1 year ago
    Quoted from Skyemont:

    Trying to stay on topic now. YES, JJP will be around in 2020. Done!

    You’ve got to be on JJP payroll...or the biggest fan of JJP there is. Lol

    #282 1 year ago
    Quoted from Aphex:

    Of all the available JJP games the only one I’d want is Dialed In. I’ll never understand the hate for this game

    No reason to hate the game. It’s loaded with lots of cool mechs and plays rather well. Maybe JJPs pinnacle, along with POTC. It is just plain and simply linear, so becomes rinse repeat over and over. Many find that monotonous after owning it a while. Not much more than only one way to approach the game, makes it boring. The animations on the phone are quite fun, leading to each mode, although.

    #285 1 year ago
    Quoted from CLEllison:

    If they keep putting out games where the playfield shells out, how many people are going to continue spending $8500 to $10k+?
    If anything will put JJP out of business that sure as hell will do it. You cant expect someone who buys a new Ferrari to just accept that the paint flakes ya know?

    That is a major issue that no one in their right mind would buy into, knowing that will happen. Just look at all the POTC playfield issues.

    #315 1 year ago

    The real humorous thing is, there is no contest here. Stern is the giant in pinball. JJP is a very small niche player originally designed for collectors. It isn’t Stern vs. JJP, that is ridiculous by any business sense comparison. JJP is a niche boutique player and in the same category as Spooky and other small manufacturers. In all JJP existence they’ve made only 5 games. During that same period, Stern has made many times that and employs 350+ people at their factory. They don’t lay them off constantly like JJP does on their small lines, with lots of temp workers, hence many quality issues coming off the line from time to time. JJP fan boy defenders do give us all a good laugh though, so keep it up. It’s funny, you don’t hear Spooky or other niche fanboys in these threads. Lol

    #317 1 year ago
    Quoted from drfrightner:

    OMG I'm wondering how much of a brain you have left after all that glue you sniffed.
    Let me point out a few things here... you say they pick outdated themes.
    Lets address:
    WOZ: The single most beloved movie of all time and sales proved it as they're somewhere between 5000 and 6000 machines sold. BTW never done before.
    Hobbit: Probably one of the most read books in history, and as for the movies they grossed BILLIONS with a B just so you know. Hobbit was never done as Stern did Lord of the Rings. I might point out that people read the book Hobbit not Lord of the Rings in school. People know Hobbit, LOTR is much lesser known title until the movies.
    Dialed In: Is a unique themed game, and if we compare Dialed In to say Sterns last original theme Black Knight, c'mon there is no comparison none what so ever.
    Willy Wonka: This might be the single most beloved Children's movies of all time, who doesn't love Willy Wonka. In case you're not aware they re-made this movie with Depp, you can still go to the candy store and pick up Wonka candy. Are you serious right now?
    Guns N Roses: Ranked as one of the greatest rock bands in history. Again are you serious right now?
    Pirates: Yes this theme was already covered by Stern, however theirs was produced over 10 years ago. The series of movies grossed multiple billions of dollars, and I repeat multiple billions of dollars. I might also point out that JJP version of the movie series is ranked as one of the ten best games ever made while Sterns is not!
    Toy Story: Coming soon is the biggest digital movie franchise in the history of film. So again can you explain here?
    Dude you're straight up dumb for those comments.
    Now lets look at Stern...
    1) Deadpool: Not even based on the movie. Love the game but there isn't a person on earth who wouldn't have rathered based on the movie. I would call this into serious question.
    2) Munsters: A TV series from the 1960's that apparently has lost a lot of its fanbase.
    3) Beatles: They didn't even use their best songs.
    4) Black Knight: Did anyone really need this theme? I think not!
    So what in the hell are you talking about questionable themes? Give me a break!

    You are such a small minded delight. So kind in what you say to others. You’re a real treasure here on Pinside.

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