It all makes sense...

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Thats Stern. JJP does not do playfield processing other then prototype.

I have a WWLE with a shit ton of plays on it and yeah there's some pooling around a couple of posts but there's not a ton to really worry about. I also have a replacement play field from the guy that I got the pin from but who is really going to either take the time or pay someone to replace it?

Lots of people do swaps or can pay someone to do swaps. It’s probably easier on newer games thanks to the reduced wiring complexity.

I find that statement the hardest to believe! lol JK Scratch that I thought you said WWE.

Hahahaha poor WWE. To be fair tho, it does kinda suck.

Does JJP's warranty state that they don't cover play field issues?

Couldn’t you use the “lemon law” to go after the perceived value loss because of the playfield issues? I thought about doing this when my WOZ playfield started to fall apart. With the continued failure to address the defect it seems like an easy win.

I just don't see how they're going to check your id over the phone. You're just using the original owner's name they're never going to know unless they just happen to know him personally?
But as suggested, you could partner, with him for the extent of the duration of the warranty also..

The seller might be able to help you and be your "virtual roommate" for the year -as mentioned - but I seriously dont think they are going to check yal that much. If the address matches and you know the order ID and buyers name, thats prob good enough. Unless they have a personal relationship with the seller, they just wont even know the details and the address will match. Just trying to help.

One year for $1000+tax?

1. The JJP "Bumper to Post" Limited Warranty covers every part in your new Jersey Jack Pinball Machine for a period of 30 days from the date of delivery of the Machine to its original Purchaser.
2. In addition, the JJP Sound Board, I/0 Driver Board, CPU, 0.96" OLED Monitor, 26" LCD Monitor and RGB LED (Light) Boards are covered for a period of one year from the date of delivery of the Machine to its original Purchaser

Yeah I agree. JJP has no idea where the distributor customer end point is. The day it arrives you register the game, serial, etc via the website as Owner.

ok, so not sure that would be a difficult skill for the new PF manufacturer to figure out

Let’s do it Bmore!

You, me, Bill B and a few others. Lol

Another girl, another planet......

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What's the going rate for a WWLE NIB play field?

Bader or Mirco?

Mirco

Looked like the bottom one was a CPR. I think I fixed a few of those.

Well, that answers that question. Yikes! The first one looks like a total adhesion failure everywhere. I wonder if the ink is sticking well when applied, but the solvents in the clear are permiating the ink and causing delamination?

Oops, doesn't CGC make their own under Churchhill? (Had to look that up to jog the memory cells)

To be fair, giant chunks of Bader's WoZ playfields were just detaching. We're not talking a tear around a post, but big chunks in the open pop bumper forest area (likely helped by the vibration). I'm sure that didn't put JJP in the best mood, especially when money was very tight around that time.

Hobbit would like a word with you.

Oh, that separated one is Mirco all day long. There's plenty of bad non JJP Mirco out there, and he'll tell you all day long why it isn't his fault.

Years before CGC started making AFM remakes, Mirco offered new AFM playfields. I bought one. I let it sit for more than a month, then I started populating it. It looked great at first, but then the clear over several inserts crackled pretty noticeably. I contacted Mirco and he told me that can happen, there's no recourse for it, and to kindly pound sand. Fool me once. I'm never buying another Mirco, whether a standalone playfield or in a new machine. Good luck everyone.

True. If it were CPR they'd tell you that's the way the donor playfield was and argue they all came that way from the factory.

Oh, Mirco does that, too. See: Mirco's atrocious 9 Ball offering (below). Wrong art in spots and completely missing words on the upper left side of the playfield. He had 1000 excuses for the atrocious 9 ball art. I fixed it in less than an hour just to show it's not difficulty but a lack of care that is the root issue.

I keep suggesting he release his prospective PF art to the community to check FOR FREE so this doesn't happen, but he won't do it because he seems to be irrational to a moronic degree. Not a great partner for JJP.
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There are always exceptions.

I don’t imagine POTC is a fun swap either.

I had to install the service bulletin light fix for the popup characters on Hobbit. It's SO TIGHT under that playfield it was literally the worst service bulletin or otherwise fix I've ever had to do. Took me FOREVER to install 4 plastic diffusers.

ST:TNG is also no fun under the playfield. Subway troughs and diverters everywhere.

Any Stern Pro is a piece of cake for a PF swap, though.

I was considering getting a NB pf from Micro but the price was prohibitive. Glad I didn't!

I bought 3 before I got one that was acceptable and that one needed art fixes and a reclear. First one was atrocious and he wanted me to file a claim against the shipping company.

I understand. I saw a few of those playfields and it was like my MET. Coming off in sheets. I think Bader got it figured out now and seems that bridge is probably burned.

What does the warranty even matter when all it gets you is a washer kit?

Does Bader like to make money?

Spooky has limited production.

So they will buyback your game, but the 1000.00 deposit is non refundable or transferable. If they have so many GNRLE’s sold they should just refund the deposit it wont hurt them they have the supposed product everyone wants, i wonder how many would pull out if the deposit was refundable.

I think if they reversed course on non refundable deposits, their order sheet would collapse on itself and I'm pretty sure thats what they are trying to avoid.

Its shameful. Its car salesman mentality, collect a deposit so when you figure out you’re being hustled you either loose the money or continue with the purchase of a faulty product.

Hey JJP , you know why it upsets me at the way you treated me? Because as a business owner And decent human being myself, i would never treat anyone the way i was treated, you’re a horrible company and keep taking the path you’re taking , karma’s a bitch! Ive certainly spread the word, and you may not think it matters but i have about 15 locally on my side that will never buy your shit product. There’s plenty of us out there now and its going to matter, you cant keep screwing people and think it will just be business as usual.

Did you upload a diary page or do you really think they are here reading this?

How many times can JJP do this to title after title before the pitchforks and Tiki torches are busted out and people start marching in the streets, carrying their playfields above their heads screaming "JJP will not replace our playfields!" An extreme picture? Yeah, but right now the silence from JJP is deafening.

If JJP’s next title still has these playfield issues I will officially be rooting for their demise. That’s harsh but what they will deserve for treating their customers so badly. It is obscene what JJP is doing to people at this point. Their time to resolve this issue is officially up......

Ultimately this isn't about the playfield defect. Shit happens and production problems occur. It's about how they are remediating it, which is to say not at all. Well that's not true, they revised the warranty to address this issue, from this (GnR Manual Nov 2020):

What is covered on the game?
Our Bumper to Post“ Limited Warranty” covers every part in your new Jersey Jack Pinball Machine for 90 days from the date of purchase written on your invoice. The LCD monitor will be covered for 1 year from the date of purchase written on your invoice.

To this (GnR Manual May 2021):

What is covered on the game?
Our Limited Warranty covers only the items listed below (“Covered Parts”) from the date the machine is shipped to JJP’s authorized distributors
(or directly to the original owner), for the period of time indicated (the “Warranty Period”):
1. Printed circuit boards (game logic). Warranty Period – Sixty (60) Days.
2. LCD monitor. Warranty Period - Two Hundred Seventy (270) Days.

The optimist in me hopes they are discussing another, less customer-hostile, solution. Also, that JJP won't apply the letter of the law in most cases.

The way the pinball world is now for every game canceled there are 2 more waiting in line.

That’s just the reality

Stern survived GB. JJP will survive this

Im sure they are. You just love to show no support for anything i say and i dont know why. Like i said in the past, your mods arrive to some of my customers broken, i fix them and install them and say nothing bad about you, your company or your broken mods, you dont hear about it because i make it go away,but yet you continue to somehow keep commenting specifically towards me. Well next time im at a customers house they will be contacting you because im no longer taking the high road im now going to make it your problem. You will know its me because they will tell you i told them to contact you. You’re welcome!

For now you are right, but the economy will slump soon and i believe it will then matter. Like i said if JJP is so confident they should announce refundable deposits, without changing this pound sand attitude.

JJP will survive this, no doubt. If it was all about survival, you're right, guessing owners/mgmt want to do more than survive though. Regarding the Stern comparison didn't they send out fully popped GB playfields to put that one behind them?

Oh yeah, the day of reckoning is coming courtesy of higher taxes etc

After the bailouts, stimulus and reckless spending is done.....soon.... 2022 is gonna be an eye opener

On a limited basis. I got nothing.

My pf has some minor insert ghosting and it’s dimpled big time

Doesn’t prevent my enjoyment of the game one iota.

And I bought a shitload more Stern pins after the fact.

I'm in the same boat. I had a JJPOTC with pooling, it never chipped and I installed my post kit and didn't complain like a good boy. Because there was no damage. And I'll open my GnR, which is on the way from JJP now, and play it.

I'd just feel better about it if I knew the company had my back if, worst case, I do have those issues you've seen in the pics. That doesn't seem unreasonable.

100% agree

JJP needs to get their pf shit together

Baffled why people think that makes them a good boy, because they didn’t complain about big problems with poor quality products. I think it makes a person a good boy that stands up to their faulty products and tells them so and expects remedy. If enough did this, they’d make a real change. Do we want their product so badly, we will let them walk all over us at these high prices with poor quality product? I know. I tried to convince myself on JJP product purchased, that I’ll just deal with all the issues, because I liked how packed their machines come. But then after working on them so much, I’m over that now and just enjoy playing pinball from other companies that have relatively no issues.